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Summer league gets going

The good news is that four of Washington's five summer league games will be televised so you good folks can follow the action and see how the young fellas do. I won't be in Las Vegas until Friday morining so I'll be watching along with you all. Just wanted to post a blog if you folks feel like discussing tonight's opener against Portland.

Enjoy and I'll come back with some observations and thoughts later.

By Ivan Carter  |  July 14, 2008; 6:47 PM ET
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Next: Pecherov update


Definitely...wanna see what the kids can do in the summer and develop to help the Bullets {yes I still call them that} win games this coming season.

Posted by: Ben Canada | July 14, 2008 7:03 PM | Report abuse

where will the games be telecast and what time are they?

Posted by: Anonymous | July 14, 2008 7:11 PM | Report abuse

Ivan, what is the deal with Pesh? He playing tonight?

Posted by: Robert | July 14, 2008 7:11 PM | Report abuse

Anon, the game will be televised on both ComcastSportsnet and NBA TV.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 14, 2008 7:16 PM | Report abuse

Looking forward to the game! One question though, are the Wizards pursuing Matt Barnes?

Posted by: romanwiz | July 14, 2008 7:47 PM | Report abuse

FYI (For the cable-less), I am watching it on, but they are showing it on a 30 minute delay.

Posted by: Truthsayer | July 14, 2008 8:34 PM | Report abuse

i know this is summer league, but this is painful to watch. bayless looks like the only player who should be in the nba. mcgee is trying to shoot his way into our hearts (and is failing miserably).

Posted by: akdeac31 | July 14, 2008 9:00 PM | Report abuse

Here are my first half impressions:
Nick Young still has a sweet shot; and still can't play defense.
McGee is BIG, but he seems to want to play small.
Blatche still sometimes looks like the best player on the floor, and sometimes not.
Dee Brown looks lightning fast. Pretty good defender (except against Bayless).
Veremeenko looks like he wants to stay inside (unlike Pecherov, who wants to hang outside)

The Wizards look a bit sluggish - like they're a fraction of a step slower than Portland, but that may be due to their travel problems.

Bayless looks like a real player; but he's not much of a play maker for a Point Guard (if you get my meaning).

Posted by: Rook | July 14, 2008 9:10 PM | Report abuse

McGhee isn't a stiff. Needs a weight training program and 2 years in the Developmental League.

Posted by: bryan | July 14, 2008 9:14 PM | Report abuse

anyone watching the wizards and blazers?

Posted by: Anonymous | July 14, 2008 9:14 PM | Report abuse

Man Steve "Napper" Jones doesn't like Nick Young too much huh?

Posted by: bryan | July 14, 2008 9:16 PM | Report abuse

So it appears Pecherov is out. Is he gonna miss the whole Summer League??

And what is wrong with this kid. Is he injury-prone or just bad timing?

Posted by: Robert | July 14, 2008 9:17 PM | Report abuse

McGhee is a keeper. He show some flashes with his passing, blocking, and low post moves. All he need is one to two years under his belt and gain at least 40 more pounds. He going to be much better than Haywood. As for Blatch, Young and the rest of the second year players, I think they're just there to be playing just to be playing.

Posted by: DeMj | July 14, 2008 9:27 PM | Report abuse

Robert, I've read elsewhere that Pech is hoping to only miss 2 games.

I've watched a little of this game now, and they sure can push the ball up the court.

McGee looks raw but clearly is a physical talent.

Posted by: Johnnie Futbol | July 14, 2008 9:32 PM | Report abuse

Pesh stinks...send that boy to the WNBA...he'd fit in a lot better

Posted by: Mike | July 14, 2008 9:40 PM | Report abuse

make that "send that WUSS to the WNBA...."

I guess she broke a nail and will miss all of the summer league....

Posted by: Mike | July 14, 2008 9:41 PM | Report abuse

Yea, Peshia got to go!

Posted by: DeMj | July 14, 2008 9:45 PM | Report abuse


Posted by: Rskinz | July 14, 2008 10:18 PM | Report abuse


McGee's got some talent and athleticism, but he needs to STOP shooting.

Posted by: Colin | July 14, 2008 10:22 PM | Report abuse

Who signed Forbes? That kid has a rec league game and doesn't belong on the floor.

And whats up Wallace only getting 3 min? He looked good while we was out there. He should have been ahead of Draper off the bench.

Veeeeeeeermeenko has an interesting game. He almost seems more like a 3 then a 4, without the J of course.

Sloppy but not bad for a long day on the road.

Posted by: pg posse | July 14, 2008 10:22 PM | Report abuse

Once again, EG has done it again so far. McGhee looks like a keeper. I know his good outing was against fellow rookies and NBA marginal players, however the kid still looked pretty good.

In about 2 years I see him really turning into something. As for Dee Brown, I am not sure what EG sees in his game. He is turnover prone, has no kind of game to get his shot off and he does not set the offense to well.

NYoung is coming along, DMac did not have a good game; but he is still a NBA player. AB was his usual "nice" self. EG needs to do a search for another 3rd string backup guard because Brown and the other dude can't cut it.

EG needs to bring back that guy from last summer's team who went to Europe (I always forget his name).

Posted by: Bullets Fever #1 | July 14, 2008 10:28 PM | Report abuse

I'm still not sure about McGee.

Yes, he did show some positives, but one of the main things I was looking for was rebounding. Rebounding was a huge knock on him coming out of the WAC with such a low average for a guy his size.

And this game confirms it. He has a total of 2 rebounds (2 offensive rebounds, 0 defensive rebounds) the whole game in 26 minutes, even though he was one of the tallest players on the floor each time.

And it shows on the floor as well, not just on the stats. He has trouble boxing out, he mistimes his jumps for the rebound, and sometimes he doesn't even try for it.

As a legit 7 footer, you would think that rebounds would come a little easier for him.

I'm hoping this changes in the next summer games. It's so important to have your big guys rebounding, as it showed in the 4th quarter where we can't even grab a missed free throw.

Posted by: tenk | July 14, 2008 10:38 PM | Report abuse

McGee showed nice offensive moves and shot-blocking, but he moves like a kite when an opposing player blows even softly on him - he got moved off the ball all night long with virtually no contact. The worst of course was the final play that mattered, where McGee got knocked off the ball on the missed freethrow when we were down by three. If he holds his position and we get the ball back, we have 7 seconds to make a three pointer for the tie.

Instead McGee moves three feet forward, right under the basket because a guy put his arm on him.

The rest of the team wasn't all that great, but the whole commercial flight thing negates any real analysis of their performance. If only the Wiz could afford chartered flights instead of coach...

Posted by: sfam | July 14, 2008 10:39 PM | Report abuse

As for Dee Brown, I am not sure what EG sees in his game. He is turnover prone, has no kind of game to get his shot off and he does not set the offense to well.

Posted by: Bullets Fever #1 | July 14, 2008 10:28 PM

I think you need to give Brown a few more games.... after all 27 minutes of SL action is hardly enough time to make a fair evaluation.

Dee Brown has shown in his 4 year College career, his 1 year NBA experience in Utah, and his year Overseas that IF ANYTHING he is NOT turnover prone.

He had 5 TO's in this game.... but to call him turnover prone is like saying that McGee can't rebound because he only had 2 rebounds in the game.

On the other hand, the few times Brown was matched up against Bayless (Young guarded Bayless most of the game), he was able to stay in front of him on Defense. A good sign.

JaVale McGee is very raw... Athletic, but raw. He also needs more strength. He was continually pushed under the basket trying to block out on defensive rebound attempts.
Nice stroke from outside though.

Posted by: Rook | July 14, 2008 10:45 PM | Report abuse

well, NY looked exactly like last year. not a good thing. he's just not a basketball player. all he can do is shoot (and pout). bayless made him look like a high schooler.

MaGee has quickness and jumping ability. i hope they send him where he can actually play and improve, not sit on the bench.

Dee Brown's quickness and energy should be an asset, if he can stop being a turnover machine like in the second half.

Blatche was a bright spot. he looked good.

Elegar - whoever he is - looked like a find for a few minutes.

V2 should stay in Europe, useless.

McGuire. did he even play? i didn't notice.

Posted by: stevie | July 14, 2008 10:46 PM | Report abuse

Pesh had a boot on his left foot. He said said from the bench it wasn't a big deal, but it was a boot almost up to his knee. Looked like the one he wore last year, but he said it was the other foot...I can't remember which one he hurt last year...

Who is this kid Frank Elegor (sp?) He played really well...

Posted by: CRitch | July 14, 2008 10:47 PM | Report abuse

Not impressed with anyone but Bayless and Kopponnen.
- NY still fades too much on his J, has terrible shot selection and can't/doesn't want to play defense.
- Blatche floats away from the hoop too often
- McGee won't be a factor for some time, if ever (where were the rebounds and the blocks)
- Dee Brown looked slow to me. I didn't see him get by his man once
- D Mac and Pech are D leaguers

Posted by: M.E.G. | July 14, 2008 10:47 PM | Report abuse

I saw all I needed to see from Veermenko in the third quarter. There were two plays where he had the ball right under under the basket, but instead of going up and finishing strong, he did a bent-knee tippy toe "jump" and alligator armed the ball off the backboard. The last thing this team needs is more big men whole play small around the rim.

Dosvedanya, comrade.

Posted by: kalorama | July 14, 2008 10:49 PM | Report abuse

Getting pushed around the basket or not, it's still VERY disappointing to see a 7'0 guy with a hyped 7'6 wingspan come up with only 2 (TWO!) rebounds total against Summer League players.

Posted by: tenk | July 14, 2008 10:50 PM | Report abuse

Yea, I agree with the other posters that McGee will be alright and VV can stay over seas. I know although this is one summer league game but DBrown is a 2 year vet., should have played much better. He should not be our third PG. I caution posters here before that Wallace could be a 3rd string PG that can play better than D(turn over king)Brown and there should not be a decision made until after training camp on which player the team is going to go with.

Posted by: d square | July 14, 2008 10:55 PM | Report abuse

Would some of you's just 1 game and they just LITERALLY arrived for the game. Plus they aren't running the Wiz offense that u see in season play. Give the guys a game or 2 to get the feet wet and some rest of these travel issues and we'll see what the guys have to offer.

Posted by: Ben Canada | July 14, 2008 10:57 PM | Report abuse

Even in summer league we get abused from the 3 point line.

And NY can't get to the rim on his own even against these scrubs. His whole game is a fadeback jumper. I'd rather have Juan Dixon back for that role.

Blatch at the 4 should work out well.

Posted by: CBaller | July 14, 2008 11:00 PM | Report abuse

I wouldn't get too worked up over Brown. According to all reports he's only got a partially guaranteed contract, which usually means that if he's cut before a certain date during the season (usually sometime around the midpoint/trade deadline) the team doesn't have to pay the rest of his deal and he's wiped off the cap. If a better option presents itself between now and them, the Wiz may be able to dump and replace him without any penalty

Posted by: kalorama | July 14, 2008 11:02 PM | Report abuse

Anyone know when and at what time the next game is being aired? Thanks.

Posted by: david | July 14, 2008 11:03 PM | Report abuse

yes, Wallace looked pretty good to me when he was there, for the little time he played.
Bayless looked good. I wasnt impressed with D. Brown either, but maybe he just needs a couple more games.

Posted by: washingtonian | July 14, 2008 11:04 PM | Report abuse

The next game is Wednesday night at 8:00 pm.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 14, 2008 11:15 PM | Report abuse

once again... as i said last time McGee wasn't the type of player we needed. We needed a rebounding first type of guy. A smart move would have been to trade our first pick (since we really didn't like arthur for some reason) and get a later first round pick or very early second round pick and some cash to go along with it and then with that pick draft a guy like Joey Dorsey. (Future Ben Wallace. But no once again the wizards don't realize what they need the most... A BIG MAN!

Posted by: wizfan | July 14, 2008 11:23 PM | Report abuse

You guys crack me up with all the summation from what amounts to a scrimmage. Some guys will look great and never make the NBA and some guys will look terrible who will be future all-stars.

I admit I popped in bc there was little else on TV. Here's what I saw and I am just judging raw skills and styles of play. Not whether anything translates to the NBA regular season.

1) McGee although surely a project is a legit center in size in all aspects. I loved the way he gets up and down the court as well - fast/athletic. He is not a plodder at his size by any means. Probably not getting serious minutes for three years at least.

2) Did not see that big of a difference in Blatche's physique whatsoever? If he has developed his uppper body then he was skinnier than I remember for sure. You would think he would dominate, but as previously stated he did at times and disappeared at other times. Same old same old!

3) Brown played out of control often. He is definitely quick and stays in front of his man on D. Looks like the taller guards will just shoot over him though. So matchups will be key for him. Playing him against the smaller quick guards in the league will help us defensively. I think that's the idea behind getting him.

4) Veremeenko showed me he is a bruiser type. He likes to bang and guard the interior, which may be more of a need than a finesse 3 pt shooting big guy - Pech.

5) Elegar looked like he belonged on the court and played well. A definite NBA body as well! He looked better than McGuire on this night. Guess we will see how it plays out.

Posted by: Rob P | July 14, 2008 11:29 PM | Report abuse


Posted by: Anonymous | July 14, 2008 11:34 PM | Report abuse

no one can make any reliable conclusions from watching a single summer league game... BUT you my gut feelings say, N1 and AB are still basically who they were last year very talented but shot selection needs work. N1 needs to develop another go to move when that mid-range jumper isn't there...VV doesn't look like a player we have to have right now. McG looks legit to me - athletically and he has some level of feel for the game for such a young player. DB can be a solid 3rd PG in the league...DMac needs time to develop his as a fan I feel relatively good about the teams performance - but nothing made me feel better or worse about the team as constituted.

To get to the next level, I still contend we need a significant veteran "offensive minded" contributor off the bench (pref. at SF - I am worried N1 will have many off-nights mixed in with his spectacular outings this coming year) and we need the health gods to smile upon us for a full season...

Posted by: scrappy | July 14, 2008 11:41 PM | Report abuse

I wouldn;t read too much into McGee's 2 rebounds--this is his first pro game, and he's still figuring it all out. He had three blocks, so it's not as if he's inactive under the boards. He's already got more of an offensive game than either Brendan or Etan--he's money on turnaround jumpers from the mid-block.

Posted by: John Brisker | July 14, 2008 11:52 PM | Report abuse


Posted by: DOC | July 14, 2008 11:55 PM | Report abuse

Elegar went to Drexal.

Posted by: rskinz | July 15, 2008 12:08 AM | Report abuse

Let's not draw conclusions about Dee Brown just yet. He's a heady point guard who has been in the Princeton offense for a few days and played directly after a ridiculous travel day. I think he's a great 3rd PG.

VV had an interesting game. I want to see more.

Wanted to see McGuire do a little better than that offensively. When he came up short on the dunk attempt it reminded me too much of Jared Jeffries.

Posted by: | July 15, 2008 1:27 AM | Report abuse

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Posted by: kelly | July 15, 2008 3:43 AM | Report abuse

Stay by your phone kelly, help is on its way...

Meanwhile, all the game commentary on ESPN is about Bayless, Bayless, Bayless...

That said, for the Wiz kids to keep the game close until the final minute and lose only 78-73 after going right from a foul weather flight to the court suggests we should give them at least one more chance, yes?

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Posted by: carrie | July 15, 2008 5:25 AM | Report abuse

Wes Unseld Jr. looks so young, like he is 18 years old, coaching the team. What was EJ doing there? I guess all the head coaches are there too, lurking around...

Posted by: oddjob | July 15, 2008 7:09 AM | Report abuse

It's the Summer League, time for our young players to play together and work on their game. The Wiz have a nice core of talented young players and I'm looking forward to seeing how they progress through these few games.

Last night, considereing that they literally just stepped off a plane, the Wiz played aggressive and were competitive. I'm positive we will see them perform alot better the next game.

Even though it's just the 1st game, I'm not sold on Dee Brown as the 3rd PG. Dee is fast, quick and can stay in front of the quicker PG's, but he couldn't guard Koponen. I have never been impressed with his playmaking ability and he cannot create offense for himself, no jumper. The Wiz played much better when he was not in the game. They gained control of the game when he was on the bench and lost it once he came back on the floor. Just because you're fast don't mean you can play.

The 3rd PG position should be open for competition. Jonathan Wallce was the best PG the Wiz put on the floor and he only played 3 minutes. He needs more time, he showed good court awareness and vision. His rainbow jumper looked good and he was not beaten defensively. The knock against him is defense and quickness, but he was not lacking in either in the short time that he played. He looked very comfortable on the court because of his experience with the Princeton offense.

NY and AB need to play like young veterans not like rookies. Stop making boneheaded plays, play defense without fouling, remain focused. Not worried about them at all. D-Mac needs to keep working on his offensive game. Can't wait to see Pech, unlike most people. He might shoot 3's but he will rebound and compete.

The rook was a rook, but he is very athletic and sKilled. A nice addition to young core, has a long ways to go before he will make a difference. JaVale will prove to be a good pick for the Wiz, but it will take time.

Like what I saw from Vladimir, has good court awareness, rebounds, competes, but nothing special. He is considered a to be a "3", not a "4". I don't think he will get that last roster spot. One more year in Europe.

Elegar looked good. He played aggressive and made a difference in the game.

Overall, these young players will not make much of a difference to the Wiz this year. In the NBA you win with Veterans. The Wiz have a veteran starting "5" and "3" veteran reserves (AD, Etan, Darius). Most teams only play 8 or 9 players. If the Wiz sign a veteran "3" to backup CB, then there is very little playing time for the young players. The only ones who will get time will be NY and AB, the others if injury, fouls or blowout. If they aren't performing then they won't play either.

So, take Summer Games for what they are worth. Time to evaluate the development of young players and to get sports fix until NFL.

Posted by: S.E. | July 15, 2008 7:15 AM | Report abuse

I know most of you will kill me for this but here it goes. The answer to the wizards 3rd guard could be Shaun Livingston. Hear me out, before his knee went out he was a big part of the clippers making the playoffs. He can and did defended both guard positions very well great passer with a good feel for the game + he can score when needed. Remember the game he was killing us when gil or AD couldn't guard him to save there life. If your going to take a gamble on someone why not him (Dee Brown come on) he was headed towards being a superstar before the knee. I know it a chance but he was clear to start ballin again and I think he would do well in EJ's system. Give him a deal thats contingent on his knee. Tell me what you guy's think

Posted by: Pike | July 15, 2008 7:46 AM | Report abuse

From watching that one scrimmage, and believe me I know better than anyone that Summer League means nothing, but from that game it seems as if McGee has absolutely no basketball IQ.

Posted by: Jason | July 15, 2008 8:20 AM | Report abuse

Wallace making the team would be a dream come true for me. (I'm a g town fan and a wiz fan) But I figured when the wiz signed Dee Brown it meant that Wallace was pretty much playing for a contract with another team? Was I wrong? Is it still a possibility the wiz keep him?

I realize it is a long shot with any team - but a shot nonetheless.

Posted by: PJP5 | July 15, 2008 8:35 AM | Report abuse

A lot of people are mentioning McGee only having two rebounds.

I think that's a mistake. No one should assume these stats have much accuracy. I only watched a small part of the game, but I saw McGee grab a defensive rebound (the stats only show 2 offensive boards).

Not that he was a monster on the boards (far from it), but don't take the 2 number in that stat line to be fact.

Posted by: Johnnie Futbol | July 15, 2008 8:54 AM | Report abuse

I'm hoping the Wizards are planning on rotating which backup pg gets bigger minutes. so on wednesday, wallace will get more time on the court. we'll see, but i can see the logic in doing that rather than having the two split time each game. hard to develop rhythm i'd imagine.

Posted by: Johnnie Futbol | July 15, 2008 9:01 AM | Report abuse

So many excuses... conjectures... hopes...
That's a sign of mediocrity... a "real" team would be figuring out who to beat to end up first in their division... I'm afraid it's going to be a long season... Sure, we might make the playoffs, but how hard is that in our division? I'd love to see someone on this squad who would just come in and blow things up.

Posted by: LK | July 15, 2008 9:15 AM | Report abuse


Posted by: dc | July 15, 2008 9:22 AM | Report abuse


Posted by: prescrunk | July 15, 2008 9:25 AM | Report abuse about losers...all you negative nellies are the losers.

The Wiz played a competitive game despite the fact they had been waiting at airports and traveling ALL DAY - arriving at the arena right before tip off after leaving home at around 4:30 am.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 15, 2008 9:25 AM | Report abuse

Who was no.42?

I thought he played well. For the life of me they never showed his name, lol!

AB and Young looked like they should.

The Russian looked horrible. That guy is never going to suit up during the regular season with the Wiz even if he does get his contract fixed. :(

- Ray

Posted by: Ray | July 15, 2008 9:33 AM | Report abuse

"JaVale McGee is very raw... Athletic, but raw. He also needs more strength. He was continually pushed under the basket trying to block out on defensive rebound attempts."


He does have some long freakin arms.

- Ray

Posted by: Ray | July 15, 2008 9:34 AM | Report abuse

I saw a rumor on the net- have any of you guys heard that the Wiz were interested in Ron Artest? I think that would be a good pickup in a trade (if we have anything the Kings would want). A good shooting, great defending 2 to start alongside Gil, Caron, and Antawn. That's the kind of move that could jump us to the top of the East. It's a risky move what with Artest's unpredictability, but one worth exploring I think...

Posted by: Wizskinsterps | July 15, 2008 9:46 AM | Report abuse

Its kinda crazy to say Jonathan Wallace played great when he only played 3 minutes and Dee Brown played bad when he started and got most of the minutes. I don't think that is a fair analysis on some of you guy's part.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 15, 2008 9:47 AM | Report abuse

Dee Brown couldn't even beat one of the slowest PG's I have ever seen off the dribble what is the gonna do when the real season starts. They would be stupid to waste a dime on this guy, whats the use in being fast if you can create your own shot

Posted by: Pike | July 15, 2008 10:00 AM | Report abuse

I know its only summer league,but McGee only two rebounds!!!!! come on you're seven feet, after all my smack talkin about his ability i hope his mom is there to put some foot in his behind! I like Dee Brown's energy and his ability to penetrate. As far as Ron Artest is concerned i would give up a no.1 in a heartbeat for him but can we sign him does he fit under the cap ?.

Posted by: | July 15, 2008 10:10 AM | Report abuse

Artest would be worth going over the cap. With Artest and a healthy squad, the Wiz get to the finals...despite EJ's inadequacies.

Posted by: oddjob | July 15, 2008 10:22 AM | Report abuse

Dee Brown wasn't brought in for his great playmaking ability and shooting. He was brought in to see if he can play D against those small jitterbug point guards that many teams use to up the tempo. Tyronne Lue has made a career out of it.

Posted by: bryan | July 15, 2008 10:27 AM | Report abuse

Fire Wes Unseld Jr. We expect -- no, demand -- wins during summer league.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 15, 2008 10:31 AM | Report abuse

*Spoiler Alert* Abe Pollin isn't going over the luxury tax threshold to sign anyone. He is cheap!

Posted by: bryan | July 15, 2008 10:32 AM | Report abuse

I have a question for the folks who keep mentioning McGee's "only had 2 rebounds" stat? What position on most basketball teams leads their teams in rebounds? Is it the 4 or the 5?

I have not done the research, so I was hoping someone could tell me. I am asking this question because I am thinking it is mostly the 4's and not the 5's, other than Dwight Howard at the 5 for the Magic. Look at that kids size and agility and you can see why he is able to do that.

However you look at McGee and he has no kind of weight with him yet. He might end up becoming a Marcus Campy type and that is alright with me. Every team is looking for a rebounding "5" like Dwight Howard, but there is only one Dwight Howard. So, how about looking at McGee's positives in his game vs. focusing on him only having 2 rebounds?

Posted by: Bullets Fever #1 | July 15, 2008 10:46 AM | Report abuse

McGee and Blatche gave up a lot of offensive rebounds off three throws. That was disappointing to see. It's probably because both of them are reed thin, they get pushed off the ball too easily.

Dee Brown did exhibit quickness and good defensive hustle, particularly early in the game. And he established himself as a pass-first guy, which was nice to see. He'll be a good third PG, I think.

Posted by: Colin | July 15, 2008 11:03 AM | Report abuse

Glad the Wiz don't play today, can you imagine the Jet lag they're waking up to?

Pretty helter skelter game, but the two games the night before were also some what disjointed. Most of the first games out useally are. I hate it that many years the Wiz seem to fly out late and compress their games toward the back of the tourney.

I know there's always a chorus of posters saying how cheap the Wiz are, here's one time I agree. Treat these young guys like pros, fly them out early let them get their feet on the ground and really see what they can do. Jet lag, flying coach, three games in four nights are all things the Wiz could eliminate from the process of figuring out if these guys can really play.

At least last night they got a team in their first game too, other years they've gone out and ran against teams in their second or third games for their first game and suffered blowouts. No help at all.

Some observations: Veeremenko is bigger and more physical then I though he might be. He didn't finish strong on those two times around the hoop but his footwork was bad both times. Replay it on DVR and watch the feet. Guy did mix it up inside a little though and seems to understand positioning. Didn't play bad for a guy that got maybe one practice with the team.

I'd say let him in Europe and he's probably package deal material next summer, unless Ernie comes up with another move this summer, which I doubt.

McGee is raw, but there is talent there. The guy's not a stiff, question is, will he be better in the D-League or better on the bench getting schooled by the vets and coached at the NBA level? Definetly a guy that needs to be monitored with a good diet, time in the weightroom, and time to grow into that body. I'd agree about the stats from that game, he had more then two rebounds. But he does need to just plant his feet and learn to use leverage to fight for position. Did you see those feet?

Blatche showed a few times where the experience of being in the league is paying off. He got a guy on his hip and just leveraged his way to the hoop. That's the kind of thing McGee needs to learn.

McGee reminds me a little of Bynum in LA, a really athletic 7' guy that needs time to fill out and develop a pro game. LA brought in Jabber to be a personal coach to develop Bynum. Can Hubbert and Unseld Jr. develop McGee they way they have worked with Haywood the last couple of years?

Young had a really poor matchup trying to gaurd Bayless last night, he just couldn't stay in front of the guy. I know it was a rookie game and Wes Jr. had other things he wanted to do, but Young should have taken Bayless to the baseline all night long to force the two points off the floor.

The really good news out of the summer league practices is Etan Thomas is going full speed and scrimaging with the team. Etan's career rebounding average is about 5 per game. He'll give the Wizards more frontline help this year then anybody at summer league except for Blatche.

And He'll help Blatche grow and develop because he won't be spending half his time at backup center. It's good news to hear that Etan is going to be back in the mix. Dispite the feelings of a lot of posters, a healthy Etan will help this team. I think it's pretty clear Haywood took over the starting job last year.

Having a solid vet to back him up will do nothing but help. This team is already deeper and more experienced then last year.

I'd agree with Kalorama, Brown's contract probably permits him to be cut at a very low cap cost. If he gets beat out, he gets beat out and the cap hit is next to nothing. I'm not ready to throw him under the bus just yet, give him at least til Wed.

Posted by: GM | July 15, 2008 11:05 AM | Report abuse

pech + 2nd round pick for artest

Posted by: Anonymous | July 15, 2008 11:14 AM | Report abuse

Well, I turned the game on in the second quarter. The kids looked like kids. Blatche looked like the four year vet he is. He did not dominate, but he clearly was the first option out there. He had like 8 fouls, which has always been a problem for him. But the refs looked like rookie refs too.... they called some marginal stuff and missed that charge that McGuire took.

Young still looks promising... but I want to see his D pick up. I mean he is always backing up and not challenging his man. If he is going to log major mins this year, he really has to D-UP!

McGee looked frustrated out there. He missed on quite a few rebounds bc of positioning and not securing the ball. I liked what I saw... worthy of first round pick. The only thing is he thinks he is a 2 guard and not a center. That scoop shot that he tried when he was on the run looked awful.

The coaching staff needs to teach this kid how to be a post up player and grinder. He looks more like a European center. I like that he is graceful and runs the floor, but he needs to play up to his size. I mean his wingspan is ridiculous!

I liked what I saw from Veeremenko in the limited action he got. He could be the 15th man on the roster and split time with McGuire to speall Tough Juice. I doubt that he would leave Russia just yet though. He could use one more year over there.

Dee Brown is exactly what Ernie signed him for, to be a backup to a backup. I like his intensity and hustle, but that Swedish kid lit him up! I would like to see more of what J.Wallace has to offer.... he could fill that role for a lot cheaper. And he ran the Princeton offense for four years at G-town and has a decent perimeter game.

But the biggest thing that I noticed on the court last night: BAYLESS IS A BALLER! I do not see how he fell to the 11th pick. Teams are going to be sorry they passed on him.

Posted by: NobodyBeatsdaWiz | July 15, 2008 11:19 AM | Report abuse

"He might end up becoming a Marcus Campy type and that is alright with me."

I will be surprise if he can attain at least half of what Camby accomplish in the league. Marcus Camby is one of the top rebounders in the league. Not sure if he's numero uno last season. Plus a perennial all defensive team.

Posted by: Dave, | July 15, 2008 11:25 AM | Report abuse

Sorry that kid was Finnish and not Swedish. He still lit up D.Brown all night long. He even gave him an elbow in the chin and nailed a three. Reminds me of Rex Chapman for all you Bullets fans.

Portland looks like they got young talent coming out of their rear ends. I would have loved to see Oden out there.

Posted by: NobodyBeatsdaWiz | July 15, 2008 11:25 AM | Report abuse


Posted by: cj658 | July 15, 2008 11:26 AM | Report abuse

Artest would be worth going over the cap. With Artest and a healthy squad, the Wiz get to the finals...despite EJ's inadequacies.

Posted by: oddjob | July 15, 2008 10:22 AM

Doesn't Artest play the same position as Butler? Who do you move to SG?

Posted by: Anonymous | July 15, 2008 11:27 AM | Report abuse

I can't figure out what's what anymore. All along folks complaining about Arenas shoot first. Then along comes Dee Brown and folks complain he passes off instead of shooting, and him not trying more to make his own shot.

What do you look for in a backup PG, another Arenas?

Posted by: Anonymous | July 15, 2008 11:29 AM | Report abuse

I know its alraydy been said, but the fact is the WIZ flight landed 2 hours before tipoff. If that happen during the reg. season, the game would have been postponed. The Blazers CHARTERED a flight from Portland, only a 1 hr. flight. The Wiz took a commercial flight, 5 hours across the country. Fact is if that "kapono" guy doesn't hit those BS threes, the Wiz win. The refs were happy with their whistles, and Bayless took advantage. He didn't impress me that much, he simply attacked and got to the line. This is what N1 should have been doing. Still N1 and Blatche looked very impressive, just not aggressive enough getting to the rim.

Posted by: cj658 | July 15, 2008 11:31 AM | Report abuse

It sure would be nice if Ernie picked up a big guy who wanted to score in the paint, rather than firing up 15 ft.+ jumpers.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 15, 2008 11:32 AM | Report abuse

And the Wiz need to sign J. Wallace for their final roster spot. After losing a shooter like Mason, this is the move to make. Grunfeld can sign him for dirt cheap, and have a solid long-range shooter off the bench. He has a very sweet stroke, and was Georgetown's BEST player last year. He is also a fundamentally sound player, haveing played in the Big East for 4 years. THIS IS THE SMART MOVE TO MAKE!!!!!

Posted by: Anonymous | July 15, 2008 11:35 AM | Report abuse

Thats it

Posted by: Anonymous | July 15, 2008 11:35 AM | Report abuse

What is up with all these posters saying to give J.Wallace a contract! I mean he probably played three mins for a reason. He probably did not show enough in practices to garner more mins.

As I posted before, he needs to play more to see what he is made of. He was a good player in college and a four year starter in the Princeton offense. Lets see him play in the SL before we start signing him to a contract.

Posted by: NobodyBeatsdaWiz | July 15, 2008 11:39 AM | Report abuse

I was disappointed in NY and AB. I might have to high expectations. Also I travel a lot by air. For sure, afer a fight like that you are a dead dog. I was kind of amazed that they even competed. Except for the two three.s and the stupid foul on their last shot they were there. And believe me that flight woud kill a horse. So, therefor we, the fans, are still in I wonder land.

Posted by: Nickolasreader | July 15, 2008 11:41 AM | Report abuse

Had to go back a while to pick up the Artest thread. That would be an awesome pick up. Every team has a certain window (look at Dallas, Phoenix) when they have the right nucleus, and a key pickup can push you over the top. The Wiz, right now, in the East, healthy (hopefully), with Artest, is at least an East finals team. As to whoever asked where does he play/ Caron plays the same position, no he doesn't. The Wiz start Antonio Daniels at the 2,and Caron at the 3. I think Gil at the 1, Artest at the 2, Caron at the 3, Antawn at the 4, and Haywood/Blatche at the 5, is a pretty impressive team, especially in the (L)EASTERN Conference. Make it happen Grunfeld!

Posted by: Wizman | July 15, 2008 11:45 AM | Report abuse

Artest is a great talent but do you really want a team that can't keep Arenas under control trying to keep Ron-Ron out of trouble.

Posted by: bryan | July 15, 2008 11:57 AM | Report abuse


imo butler would be better off at the 2 isted of artest

Posted by: jojo | July 15, 2008 12:08 PM | Report abuse

Umm, I love the Wiz so I don't mean this to be a negative comment. However, I don't get why AB is still playing summer league? I know he needs work but working out with rookies and guys that probably won't even make rosters? Shouldn't he be home working on bulking up and honing his skills? Do any other teams have an upcoming 4th year guy on their summer league team--just curious.

Posted by: mygr8kidz2 | July 15, 2008 12:08 PM | Report abuse

It goes to show the very slow progression of AB, but it's still appropriate. They are there less than 2 weeks, so it's not like it's taking up his whole summer/ preventing him from otherwise working on his game. And the guys he's going against and playing with are going to be some of the same ones he's going against/ playing with during the regular season (i.e. the second/ third unit off the bench). Still I agree with you- this shouldn't be necessary for a 4th year player. He could have refused to go out of pride though, so I'm just glad he recognizes that he's far from where he needs to be...

Posted by: Wizman | July 15, 2008 12:14 PM | Report abuse

I agree Artest has the potential to be trouble, but what do we have to lose? Right now we look like one and done in the playoffs again. And big rewards don't come without risks. We've been waiting for 3+ years for something here. Look at the Patriots and Randy Moss. Noone wanted Randy, the Pats got him for a steal, added him to solid nucleus, and had the best season in NFL history.

Posted by: Wizman | July 15, 2008 12:17 PM | Report abuse


Do the Wiz have any questions or concerns about that suspect medical staff, if so are you gonna write about it?

Posted by: Wizfan40 | July 15, 2008 12:20 PM | Report abuse

The Wizards have absolutely nothing to offer the Kings (outside of the big three) that won't get them laughed off the phone by Geoff Petrie the minute Grunfeld mentions Artest's name.

Posted by: kalorama | July 15, 2008 12:30 PM | Report abuse

Thanks, Wizman. Keep forgetting it is only 2 weeks.

On a less serious note, does anyone think it's wise to unleash AB in Vegas?! LOL

Posted by: mygr8kidz2 | July 15, 2008 12:31 PM | Report abuse


Posted by: Anonymous | July 15, 2008 12:32 PM | Report abuse

"Posey is considering offers from the Celtics, Cleveland Cavaliers and Los Angeles Lakers."
according to New Orleans Times-Picayune, 7/15

"competition for free-agent forward James Posey? According to the Boston Globe, it's the Celtics, Cavaliers, Hornets and Wizards."
Detroit Free Press, 7/13

Have the Wizards dropped out of the James Posey sweepstakes over the past couple of days?

Posted by: Emmet | July 15, 2008 12:44 PM | Report abuse

The Wiz would have to figure a way to cut salaries to sign Posey, becuase right now that don't have enough to offer. Posey is being offered teams' full mid-level amounts which is alot more than the Wiz have right now.

Posted by: Jeff | July 15, 2008 12:51 PM | Report abuse

I think you seriously overestimate the King's here. They don't want Artest, he wants out, and the Kings want to rebuild. I think a young talent (like Pech or Blatche, or even Young straight up- remember you've got to give something to get something) maybe plus next year's number one pick (which if we makes the playoffs again is only going to be McGee part 2 anyway) would be enough. I checked on ESPN and Artest only makes 7 mill a season, so trade balance and salary cap issues shouldn't be too hard to work out...

Posted by: Wizman | July 15, 2008 12:53 PM | Report abuse


actually, blatche asked to play in summer league this year, he was not required to by the team. he's talked about wanting to try and improve his endurance.

if this new-found work ethic sticks, i'd look to see him improve even more this upcoming season.

Posted by: JC | July 15, 2008 12:53 PM | Report abuse

We have a lot to lose by signing Artest. Ask Indiana how his behavior single handedly destroyed a season in which they were picked to go to the NBA Finals. I won't even get into the salary implications. Plus Artest doesn't want to be a 4th banana.

Also to those who don't believe Blatche should be in Summer League, you have to realize he is straight out of high school and missed his first year of development because of the gunshot wound. He really needs summer league.

To those complaining about McGhee just remember this one name...Tyson Chandler. He had a similar frame and an even worse offensive game when he was a rookie.

Posted by: bryan | July 15, 2008 12:54 PM | Report abuse

Just because the Wizards wanted Posey doesn't mean the feeling was ever reciprocated. Like I've been saying all along, unless the Wiz were willing to significantly overpay him (which would be a bad idea, even if they could), there was no reason to think he'd consider Washington over the other legit contenders who would be bidding for his services.

Posted by: kalorama | July 15, 2008 12:54 PM | Report abuse

Just because the Kings want to move Artest doesn't mean they're going to just give him away. He's a 20 ppg scorer and recent DPOY, one of the best two-way players in the NBA. The Wizards have no players (other than the big 3) to offer that would make the Kings even consider trading Artest here.

it takes more than matching salaries to make a deal viable in the real world.

As for "overestimating" the Kings .. you're seriously underestimating Geoff Petrie, one of the best GMs in the NBA, if you think he'd trade Artest for the spare parts the Wiz have to offer.

Posted by: kalorama | July 15, 2008 12:57 PM | Report abuse

GM, I think the youngster would be better off with the team this year. Not only would he be getting schooled by the vets and NBA coaches, he'd be learning about the other aspects of being a professional. Preparation, diet, etc. are things that he'd probably not learn from other D Leaguers.
My impression of McGee is that he is pretty weak and needs to get stronger in order to be a center in this league. He reminds me a little bit of Rasheed during his first year here. He was too weak to play center but he has decent ball handling skills for a big guy. Seeing McGee pull up and make a clutch 3 was nice. I'm not sure we want the big guy doing that but it was nice to see that he had the form to pull it off. I also saw a couple of nice turnarounds (one with one hand that is unblockable). He challenged a few shots in the lane, as well, and forced guys to shoot floaters.
I hate when coaches say things like "he's a couple of years away". This gives the player a 2 year pass because the expectations are so low. I know we don't want to put too much pressure on a guy but he needs to know that we expect him to contribute sooner rather than later. Even if a guy just picks up the defensive rotations and is able to step in for 5 minutes a game at first, he needs to know that he's gonna be expected to be a star for 5 minutes. He's raw sure but has the arms of Stretch Armstrong.
One last thing that I've always wondered... Why can't teams build the cost of a dietician and personal trainer into the players' contracts? I don't understand how a professional athlete can go for a year or so and still not have competitive strength. Even if AB, McGuire, etc. have the metabolisms of hummingbirds, they could still have been able to grow bodybuilder physiques in the time that they've been in the league. If all you do is play ball, travel and work out, how hard is it to get in great shape? I think we need to raise the bar for some of these guys.

Posted by: mark | July 15, 2008 1:00 PM | Report abuse

Are you really Geoff Petrie in disguise on this board? :> The Artest rumor wasn't started by me, so I'm hoping there's a grounds for it despite how much you're in love with Petrie. (maybe you're his wife in disguise!) Nobody thought the Celtics could pull the trades they did last year (anyone who says they though KG would be a Celtic before it actually happenened is lying). The point is as a responsible GM, Ernie should inquire, and as a fan who wants us to make it past the 1st round of the playoffs, I can hope for some improvement and talk about it in the chatrooms. Bryan, I agree with you about Artest, but again what do we have to lose? I say we're likely out in the first round of the playoffs again without a change, and if Artest doesn't mesh, we'll still likely at least be in the same place. No one though the Celts could mesh the way they did, or that Randy Moss would be a model citizen in New England, but winning has a way of making things work out...

Posted by: Wizman | July 15, 2008 1:16 PM | Report abuse

I wonder does Ernie have anything up his sleeve. I know he didn't ask Arenas to sign for less money so he can sign Dee Brown. I have to think Ernie is on the phones trying to get the Wizards someone that can give some kind of inside presence.

I think the Wiz should trade Blatche while he still MAY have some value.

Posted by: Omar | July 15, 2008 1:24 PM | Report abuse


Your juvenile, uncalled for, and unprovoked (not to mention thoroughly unoriginal and unfunny) insults aside, your argument still has a grand total of zero merit. Artest's value (even it's currently reduced state) far outstrips any player (outside the big 3) the Wiz have on their roster.

Saying that Grunfeld has nothing to lose by trying to get Artest is only slightly less useless than saying he has nothing to lose by trying to get Kobe or Lebron. The bottom line is, he has nothing to offer that will get any of them here.

There is no chance of Artest being traded to Washington.


Posted by: kalorama | July 15, 2008 1:33 PM | Report abuse

You can't say "your... comments aside"- and then mention them! They really aren't aside then are they Einstein?! And again, it's not my argument (did you actually read the whole comments or just the first sentence and then write back?), it's someone else's from above, who read it on the internet. The INTERNET. 100% merit. There you go. Case closed. As for the comment about there being nothing to lose in getting Artest, again you took it out of context (or didn't read everything in your fury)- it was in response to another's comments about Artest being a disruption if in bizaro world he was to come here- not in response to your "zero chance" of him coming here rants (whereby the non-sensical Kobe comparison you made would then make sense). It's summer time man- the best time of the year for the Wizards. The time when hope springs eternal and we all play virtual GM. I was just commenting on someone elses virtual GM proposed trade. I'm very, very, sorry I hurt your wittle feewings...

Posted by: Wizman | July 15, 2008 1:48 PM | Report abuse

I want to agree with some of the posters who say Wallace should get more minutes. I don't think Dee Brown got most of the minutes because of what he did in practice.

He got most of those minutes because he has a partially guaranteed contract and EG has to see if he is worth signing. Now I know he is still trying to learn EJ's offense, so I will take the advice of an earlier poster and give him one more game or two to evaluate him.

Again, what was the name of the point guard we had last summer that went over to Europe? Not the guard Gil was trying to get signed who signed with the Heat, I am talking about the other one??? He should be the guard we have in here at the 3rd spot....

Posted by: Bullets Fever #1 | July 15, 2008 1:51 PM | Report abuse

Mark, I'd tend to agree with you on the idea of having McGhee spend alot of time with the team because of coaching, monitoring diet etc.

There's not enough good young bigs to compete with in the D League most years to really help a guy like that. He's likely to come back dribbling behind his back and trying to lead the fast break like Blatche is inclined to do sometimes.

Inquiring about Artest isn't crazy it's doing due diligence and what a General Manager should be doing while in Vegas. If it doesn't work out, you know, it can just stay in Vegas.

Nothing to offer for Artest? Any package that would start with Young or Blatche should get Petrie's attention. He's in a rebuilding mode, young cheap talent is what he's searching for. I'm not convinved that he's really after Odom from LA unless he's really thinking about some kind of three way.

I wouldn't be shocked to see LA match the Turiaff offer sheet and use him as a center peice for Artest. It does sound like Kobe wants him there. If that's the case the Wiz don't have a chance if LA wants to make the move and is willing to part with some young talent.

LA took alot of heat for not moving Bynum for Kidd a couple of years ago. Bynum is coming off of an injury and the Lakers went out and got Gasol to start. Would a package involving Bynum & Turiaff be enough to lure Artest from the Kings?

One thing for sure as raw and clueless as Young and Blatche both can appear to be at times I wouldn't package them both for Artest if I was Grunfeld. That's the same kind of mistake the Wiz made for years and got burned with our former players making the Allstar team and taking someone else to the finals.

LA was in the finals last year, Artest, Odom, Gasol, and Kobe would make a heck of a core. I think the Wiz are inclined to see if Young and Blatche can mature into a role of being a major contributor this year. Ernie is still more in a building mode.

But if the Wiz could get Artest at the right price him and Caron become almost interchangable wings in the Princeton. Defensively Artest just becomes the all purpose stopper. One thing to remember, Petrie may also be smart enough that the last thing he wants after not being able to get past Kobe and Shaq to get to the finals is to give LA the final peice to get another title.

I don't care how smart he is and what he's done for the Kings in the past, that's the kind of thing that could get him fired.

So he might be looking east for a trade partner...

Posted by: GM | July 15, 2008 2:02 PM | Report abuse

Bullets Fever, I think you mean Aaron Miles. He is on the Mavs summer league team. Doing ok, 6 assists in 15 mins and no points yesterday.

Posted by: rgz | July 15, 2008 2:07 PM | Report abuse


So let me get this straight ... you're arguing that because the Artest to the Wizards trade originated from something someone else read on "the INTERNET" then it automatically has "100% merit"? Really? Seriously? That wasn't a joke?

Wow. That's just sad.

And just because you didn't originate the argument doesn't absolve you from the burden of actually making sense and using logic when you try to defend it. And the fact that you've now elapsed not only into insults and name calling, but insults with cutesy spellings, no less, is a pretty sure sign that making sense is not part of your clearly limited intellectual skill set.

Posted by: kalorama | July 15, 2008 2:10 PM | Report abuse

One last thing that I've always wondered... Why can't teams build the cost of a dietician and personal trainer into the players' contracts? I don't understand how a professional athlete can go for a year or so and still not have competitive strength. Even if AB, McGuire, etc. have the metabolisms of hummingbirds, they could still have been able to grow bodybuilder physiques in the time that they've been in the league. If all you do is play ball, travel and work out, how hard is it to get in great shape? I think we need to raise the bar for some of these guys.

Posted by: mark | July 15, 2008 1:00 PM

Actually, it's quite hard to gain muscle mass in season. They probably aren't lifting any more than twice a week, and only to *maintain* (i.e. not build) muscle mass. And if they're not doing that (imagine how much lifting happens during those long road trips), then perhaps they're regressing. So if Blatche or McGee or anyone puts on some muscle weight during the summer, it's as much a question how successul will they be to maintain that weight.

Building muscle mass involves tearing down your body and letting it regenerate into something bigger. During the season, you can't do that to your body because it'll affect your play.

So it's really only the off-season/summer where players can really develop their bodies. For those players who want to go on vacation, or visit family, or just take a break (perhaps for good reason) they're already potentially cutting into their time to get stronger.

Excluding those players that are naturally muscular, you really have to be a "gym rat" as Blatche described his summer habits to really get bigger in the span of about 4 months. Of course over time some of the taller, lankier players (like Blatche or McGee) "fill into" their bodies, which probably has more to do with a natural maturation process these types of guys go through than weightlifting.

So in short, many players have to be really, really committed in order to get bigger through offseason workouts and then maintain during the season.

Posted by: Johnnie Futbol | July 15, 2008 2:11 PM | Report abuse

On the question of keeping McGee with the Wizards or turning him over to the D-League, I have to think you have to factor in when the Wizards hope he'll spell Etan as Haywood's 1st backup.

If the Wizards are thinking next offseason will be a fantastic opportunity to unload expiring contracts (Thomas, Daniels, etc.), then I believe they have to figure out how to best prepare McGee to get more minutes by next season (now it's quite possible the Wizards could seek a center in such a trade, or perhaps more likely they decide they LIKE the combination of Haywood/Thomas, at least till 2010).

But still i don't know what you do. I tend to think McGee can mature the fastest by hanging around Haywood, Thomas and Jamison regularly.

Posted by: Johnnie Futbol | July 15, 2008 2:17 PM | Report abuse

Kalorama, I agree. The Kings are not going to give up Artest for nothing significant in return unless he had an expiring contract. Also heard rumors that the Lakers & Heat were interested in getting him and either would have to give up something to make it work. Plus at one point, Artest was looking for a raise to go with the $7 mil he was making.

Posted by: G$ | July 15, 2008 2:19 PM | Report abuse

"Any package that would start with Young or Blatche should get Petrie's attention. He's in a rebuilding mode, young cheap talent is what he's searching for."

It takes more than just young and cheap. It also takes comparable or at least potentially comparably.

The reason the Celtics were able to deal for Garnett (aside from the buddy-buddy relationship between Ainge and McHale) is because the Wolves offer centered around a young big man who had already demonstrated all-star potential. The season prior to the trade, Jefferson averaged 16, 11, and 2. Blatche and Young's numbers together don't equal that.

Is it possible that either or both of them could one day be all-stars? Anything is possible. But have either of them done anything so far to concretely suggest they will be All-Stars any time soon? Not at all. You don't trade a player of Artest's caliber for two guys who, based on what they've shown so far, could easily end up career backups.

That's the kind of deal that gets GMs fired.

Posted by: kalorama | July 15, 2008 2:19 PM | Report abuse

The name of the PG you are talking about is Aaron Miles. He is playing on the Dallas Mavericks Summer League team.

Posted by: S.E. | July 15, 2008 2:20 PM | Report abuse

On Artest, I can see the logic in everyone's point of view. I'm not sure we can put too much stock in any Artest "trade rumors." But I would argue if the Wizards really wanted him they could find a way, even without involving the Big 3. It would take some combination of future draft picks and the best of their younger talent, which I'm not sure is worth it.

I think the best cards the Wizards can play to push them to championship level are:

1. stay healthy
2. develop the young guys and team depth
3. pull off a very solid trade with another team looking to build salary cap space during the 2010 offseason.

Achieving 2 of those 3 probably won't be enough, but all 3...?

Posted by: Johnnie Futbol | July 15, 2008 2:24 PM | Report abuse


Expiring contracts likely wouldn't be enough, because Artest's contract expires at the end of the upcoming season. if all they want is cap space, they can just keep him and let him walk at the end of the season.

Which points out the other difficulty in trading for Artest: Getting him to re-sign when the season is up.

One of the reasons the Kings may have no choice but to trade him to the Lakers (or some other contender) is because a non-contending team would be very wary of giving up valuable assets for a guy if they didn't think they'd be able to re-sign him next summer. But a team for which Artest could potentially be the missing piece to a title would (A) be more willing to take the risk and (B) have more leverage after the season to convince him to stay.

Posted by: kalorama | July 15, 2008 2:26 PM | Report abuse

One thing that lessens Artest's value is he's set to be an unrestricted free agent after one season. that's another reason why the kings might be eager to trade him, if they don't see him as part of their future plans.

Posted by: Johnnie Futbol | July 15, 2008 2:33 PM | Report abuse

Artest won't pass the Pollin good guy test.
That factor probably lessens the time/attention that EG will give to that transaction.

Posted by: rgz | July 15, 2008 2:49 PM | Report abuse

So in short, many players have to be really, really committed in order to get bigger through offseason workouts and then maintain during the season.

Johnnie Futbol, you hit it on the head. I guess that's the kernel of my real question. Building and maintaining a strong body starts with diet. How much does it take for a guy to hire a chef to cook their meals and why isn't it a requirement? I just got back from the Klitschko fight and I saw up close and personal the difference between a guy who is in top shape and a guy who is in good but not great shape. The guy who is in great shape won the fight because the guy in good shape got tired.
Guys like McGuire who aren't getting many minutes are doing little during the course of the season but practicing and playing video games.
It's no secret that most of the greatest players ever are all known for their work ethic. Think of Jordan and Tim Grover comes to mind. Think Walter Payton and you remember the hills he used to run. Jerry Rice's offseason regimen was the stuff of legend. I know what you're saying, JF. I know that some guys like McGee and AB are skinny and YOUNG and it'll take time before they fill out. But guys like Garnett are still skinny yet they find a way to get it done. I'm sick of young guys buying into the 3 year plan. They want to turn it on right before their 2nd contract. Force those guys to do the right thing and meet certain criteria. Put incentives out there that make them want to reach their goals. Just like there are penalties for some overweight football players coming to camp, I think there should be some penalties for bball players failing to reach certain physical milestones. If you've been in the league for a year and can't bench 200 or bust a grape, you oughtta have to pay up. I guess maybe I'm being a little unrealistic, though.

Posted by: mark | July 15, 2008 2:51 PM | Report abuse

Bullets Fever, I think you mean Aaron Miles. He is on the Mavs summer league team. Doing ok, 6 assists in 15 mins and no points yesterday.

Posted by: rgz | July 15, 2008 2:07 PM

thanks..... I remembered his name a few minutes later of posting the question? I had already asked Ivan what happened to him and you just answered my question. Thanks again...

Posted by: Bullets Fever #1 | July 15, 2008 2:56 PM | Report abuse

Wiz Summer League Team consists of BONAFIED SCRUBS. Buhahahahahaha.

Posted by: Baller4Life | July 15, 2008 3:00 PM | Report abuse

Wizman, life is too short to engage kalorama in any discussion. Live and learn, dude.

Posted by: Anonymous | July 15, 2008 3:05 PM | Report abuse

I repeat: they're all BONAFIED SCRUBS.

Posted by: Baller4Life | July 15, 2008 3:10 PM | Report abuse

You are so right! It's just that Kalorama is so damned funny though! He's literally trying to tear anyone to shreds who suggests that the Wiz should do anything besides sit on their hands and repeat what's happened the last 3 years (He's literally responded to every pro Artest comment- wait a second- wasn't Kalorama the name of the guy who got punched in the face during the Pacers brawl?!). And he has no concept of sarcasm! Does he really think anyone thinks of the internet as a reliable source? And he's still responding seriously to jokes! Oh well- I guess I should just feel sorry for anyone with so much pent up animosity...

Posted by: Wizman | July 15, 2008 3:15 PM | Report abuse

I guess maybe I'm being a little unrealistic, though.

Posted by: mark | July 15, 2008 2:51 PM

Ha ha.. yeah a little unrealistic unless you're looking for a players strike or an owners lockdown to force these changes.

anyways, i understand the frustration and desire to see these guys develop faster. i tend to be of the mind that when you're 19-21, you tend to act your age (and scientifically speaking, humans begin to develop brain attributes that allow them to better appreciate long-term consequences at around age 22), but not too long after I'd hope to see a much better mental/physical maturation curve. pretty soon Blatche won't be able to fall on the "he's just a kid" excuse. but ultimately, some of these guys are just kids. you gotta be patient and let them grow up. a good amount of pushing, as long as it's within reasonable bounderies, can help.

Kevin Garnett wouldn't have led that Celtics team to a championship during his early 20s.

Posted by: Johnnie Futbol | July 15, 2008 3:19 PM | Report abuse

I repeat: they're all BONAFIED SCRUBS.

Posted by: Baller4Life | July 15, 2008 3:10 PM

could not have said it better.

the arest rumors seem a bit far-fetched, but who knows ... if Ernie could somehow pull it off it'd be great.

Posted by: pepcoenergy3 | July 15, 2008 3:25 PM | Report abuse

When playing poker, the one thing you learn about "holding all the cards", overplay the hand and you wind up with nothing...

Artest played out the hand til the last possible second and found out Petrie's prepared to let him walk for nothing. Artest is now really displeased with his agent, he thought the gambit of holding the opt out over the team's head would get him a new multiyear deal. So now he's chained to a lossing team that doesn't want him for another year...

Overplayed the hand...

Now he's trying to force a deal to a contender. Only way to force a deal, act like a pain in the ass. Considering his past history the more he acts out the less he's worth.

Petrie now has a player that he knows he doesn't want, the player knows that he isn't wanted, and quess what everybody in the league knows they can just wait another year and have him as a FA.

If Petrie thinks he's getting top talent in return, he's already overplayed the hand...

Gasol moved for cap space, Garnett moved for package of young players because their owners and management overplayed their hand, not because of cozy relationships.

I've watched this game for 40+ years, just about every year or two an Allstar caliber guy moves for pennies on the dollar. And more often then not management sat on their hands to long and had to dump a guy rather then keep him and destroy their team and fan base.

If the Kings move quickly they might still get a good deal out of LA for Artest. If they wait too close to camp they risk a three ring circus with an unproven second year coach already getting called out by Artest. With the track record of what he did in Chicago and to the Pacers, I wouldn't hold that hand too long.

Like I said does Petrie risk having broke up his team to get Artest, and then sending him to the Lakers to be the final peice in a Championship puzzle? Or does he send him out of conference?

Unless Artest is willing to pre-sign an extension and allow a sign and trade I can't see the Kings having alot of leverage.

That's where a team can sometimes swope in and get a bargain. If it blows up in your face, nothing ventured, nothing gained.

But the Wizards or anyone else would be foolish to not check the situation out and monitor it, even throw out a feeler or two.

Or they could just sit on their hands...

Posted by: GM | July 15, 2008 3:56 PM | Report abuse


It's not an all or nothing deal. Your argument is framed around The Kings getting "top talent" or accepting "pennies on the dollar." There's plenty of middle ground in between the two, middle ground in which the Wizards don't have a lot of crops growing.

As for the Wiz "sitting on their hands" .. do yourself a favor and don't follow in the footsteps of the foolish. Obviously, the Wizards should put in the obligatory call. Every team in the league should and will. But I bet money that when Grunfeld makes that call offering Blatche and Young, he'll do so fully expecting the response to be a short, sweet "no thanks" (possibly without the thanks).

Posted by: kalorama | July 15, 2008 4:09 PM | Report abuse

Hey, Wizman, the fact that people fail to laugh at your jokes might indicate a problem with the joker, rather than the audience. Something to think about ...

Posted by: kalorama | July 15, 2008 4:11 PM | Report abuse

I've never said for a moment that the Wiz should offer Blatche and Young for Artest. In fact a said the exact opposite.

But, I'm pretty confident after watching years of these situations the Kings will get pennies if they don't pull the trigger.


To fullfill your every present need to always be right. I'll agree with you that the Wizards have no chance to get Artest. But somebody will and it'll be cheap...

Posted by: GM | July 15, 2008 4:38 PM | Report abuse

The only one not laughing was you buddy. All the people in my office are cracking up at your dumb %ss! I see you're still responding to my jokes and still trying to shoot down everyone who says getting Artest is a possibility. Thanks to GM and everyone else for keeping this hilarity going by simply responding to Kalorama with sound conterpoints- I think his head is going to explode. At least after 5 rounds you finally acknowledge that Grunfeld should and will make an offer. That's all I ever really was saying in the first place. Toodles...

Posted by: Wizman | July 15, 2008 4:39 PM | Report abuse

"I've never said for a moment that the Wiz should offer Blatche and Young for Artest. In fact a said the exact opposite."

Retreating from a previously stated position after it's been refuted and pretending like you never said something that's clearly recorded in black and white on the very same page? That's a DC Man move. I expected better from you GM.

"Nothing to offer for Artest? Any package that would start with Young or Blatche should get Petrie's attention. He's in a rebuilding mode, young cheap talent is what he's searching for. I'm not convinved that he's really after Odom from LA unless he's really thinking about some kind of three way."

Posted by: GM | July 15, 2008 2:02 PM

And, just to head you off ... yes, you said later that Grunfeld shouldn't make that deal. But that wasn't what i was disputing. I was disputing whether, if the offer was made, would the Kings reject it. I said (and still say) yes. You said no. That was the point of contention, not whether he should make the deal.

Posted by: kalorama | July 15, 2008 5:26 PM | Report abuse

"I'll agree with you that the Wizards have no chance to get Artest. "

Which of course, begs the question ... if you agree with me, why were you arguing with me?

Posted by: kalorama | July 15, 2008 5:29 PM | Report abuse

Again, what was the name of the point guard we had last summer that went over to Europe? Not the guard Gil was trying to get signed who signed with the Heat, I am talking about the other one??? He should be the guard we have in here at the 3rd spot....

Posted by: Bullets Fever #1 | July 15, 2008 1:51 PM

When the Wizards would not sign him to a guaranteed contract, Aaron Miles signed a one-year deal with Cajasol Sevilla in Spain's top professional league last year.

He's currently on the Dallas Mavericks Summer League squad.

1st game he had 15 minutes, 6 pts, 6 assists, 2 rb, 0 st, 2 to.
2nd Game he had 16 minutes, 2 pts, 3 ast, 2 rb, 0 st, 3 to.
3rd game he had 15 minutes, 0 pts, 6 ast, 2 rb, 1 st, 1 to.

Posted by: Rook | July 15, 2008 6:06 PM | Report abuse

Jeez, all this back and forth over Ron Artest? Who cares? He ain't coming here and I wouldn't want him. Petrie had a nice run, but now he is not looking too good as a GM. Getting Artest in the first place was a mistake. He would probably best be suited for the Lakers who could win a title with him and then cut him loose before he causes any major problems for the team.

I'm a little curious as to why everyone is talking about McGee needing to fill out? I'm sure he will eventually, but right now he is every bit as big as Haywood in the bulk department. Etan is the only player on the roster that would be bigger and stronger than him right now - well at least bigger. Having Etan back will be a big plus in the muscle department even at 12 mins a game!

Also, if Blatche is not dominating SL games at this stage of his career, I am fairly certain he will be a career backup and definitely no future star or "wildcard" player as I like to call them.

Posted by: Rob P | July 15, 2008 6:44 PM | Report abuse

And for those just reading stats.

McGee had more than two rebounds. The statisticians in summer league are as good as the ones running rec at the local YMCA. The announcers were even joking about it. Someone had scored 10 points yet the stat sheet given to them said 2. McGee also got fouled 2/3 times collecting rebounds and subsequently the ball was ripped out of his hands without a call. A very helter skelter game to say the least. I will say he needs to learn to secure the ball better after he gets his hands on it. Those freakily long arms seem a detriment in that department at this point.

Posted by: Rob P | July 15, 2008 6:56 PM | Report abuse

Why would the Kings want me on their team? Kevin Martin does everything that I can do, but better.

Posted by: Nick Young | July 15, 2008 9:15 PM | Report abuse

I hesitate to raise the specter of a C Butler for R Artest trade but why the hell not? Risking the ire of wiz b-ball wonks, any advantages for Wiz, are contracts compatible? Artest's contract is up in one and is a year older than Butler, a better defender, he's probably reached his potential and he's got a rep as a loose cannon. Butler on the other hand might still have some upside left in him.
Bad trade, or an even up pointless one?

Posted by: Myshkin | July 15, 2008 9:28 PM | Report abuse

I said undder the Arenas deal done blog...Elegar is going to be a keeper this year...his game is more developed than most of the players we have on the summer league he's a four year college player with international experience on dominic team??? not sure...scored 27 against Syracuse when Drexel had Mejia and was in competition to go to NCAA's in 2006 with other CAA teams

Posted by: flinstone | July 16, 2008 12:02 AM | Report abuse

On Dee Brown --

Dee is not a drive and shoot PG a la Chris Paul -- you wont see him create like that. he is not a 1st-option scorer, but the Wizards dont need him to be

What you will see from him on offense are:
1. great court vision and good passing when other players are moving to get open. He can feed both the perimeter and the post

2. great movement without the ball. Dee is extremely fast and has a lot of energy. The place where he is great scoring is off of passes, cuts, and screens. He is extremely disciplined and savvy without the ball. Even if people are not distributing back to him to score, he moves so much that he forces movement by defenders, forcing other openings in the defense - good for princeton

3. Ability to push the ball up the floor, and dish or score on the break

4. A great defender for his size. Great, tall shooters have an advantage over him, but guys who like to drive will not find an easy road...very active hands in the passing lanes as well. GO back and watch teh Jazz/Warriors playoff series from 2 years ago - he seriously clamped down on Baron Davis -- Barkley could not stop raving about him.

5. Despite last nights box, he generally does not turn the ball over much.

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Posted by: van | July 17, 2008 2:25 PM | Report abuse

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