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And the Wizards Select Foye, Miller ... And $2.5 Mil

As I walked out of Verizon Center late last night, I asked a security guard what he thought about the Wizards' draft.

"We didn't get nothing," he told me with a shrug.

Well, the Wizards didn't get a draft pick after sending the No. 5 pick to Minnesota the day before and the 32nd pick to Houston on Thursday. But the Wizards came away with a little more than Randy Foye and Mike Miller.


Get up, man. We've got a lot to do in one year. (Photo by Brian Spurlock/US Presswire)

Selling second-round pick Jermaine Taylor to Houston added another $2.5 million to Abe Pollin's pockets, according to someone with knowledge of the transaction. The move increases the possibility of the Wizards adding a veteran big man through free agency if they desire.

I got wind of the Wizards' draft board, and the top four players broke down like this: Blake Griffin, Tyreke Evans, Ricky Rubio and James Harden. I'm not sure the order after those four, but I heard they had Stephen Curry ahead of Hasheem Thabeet, who went second overall to Memphis.

I know the Wizards had Evans ahead of Rubio, but after the first four picks were chosen, I couldn't help but chuckle. I like Evans, and he may very well turn out to be a better pro than Rubio. But, as I've written before, there is something tantalizing about the 18-year-old Spaniard.

I found it quite amusing that the player most experts had slotted as the second-best talent in the draft slid all the way down to fifth. It was eerily similar to the Wizards drop on the night of the draft lottery, when they had the second-best chance of winning the top pick and dropped down to No. 5. On that night, Rubio didn't seem like a possibility. Now his career will forever be linked to the Wizards, much like Devin Harris, who has blossomed into an all-star in New Jersey.

But with the Harris deal, Jamison became a two-time all-star, led the Wizards to four consecutive playoff appearances and helped them win a playoff series for the first time since Michael Jackson released "Thriller" (R.I.P. M.J.).


Remember this face, Washington. (AP Photo)

At least you knew Jamison would be around for a while. With this latest trade, the Wizards aren't guaranteed to have the services of Foye or Miller beyond this season, since both will become free agents in the summer of 2010. Foye is restricted, but this could turn out to be mortgaging the future for the sake of a one-year run.

If Rubio becomes a star in this league, this could really come back to haunt the Wizards. Or he could turn out to be, as Brandon Jennings said, "all hype." I know his agent, Dan Fegan, didn't want him in Washington, but who knew he would actually be there at No. 5? Ernie Grunfeld said he still would've taken Foye and Miller, but he sort of has to, at this point.

The Rubio situation grows more intriguing with his father, Esteban, saying that he could go back to Europe for another year, since his salary at No. 5 wouldn't be able to make his buyout acceptable.

As for the Wizards, they are committed to paying $76 million to 13 players next season, but they still have the full mid-level exception and the bi-annual exception to use for a much-needed veteran big man. Right now, JaVale McGee, Andray Blatche and Dominic McGuire -- average age 22 -- are the only backup forwards/centers on a guard-heavy roster.

The moment the Wizards selected Taylor, it was obvious that he was going to get dealt, but Grunfeld had a good time toying with reporters afterward. Asked to explain the choice, Grunfeld joked, "I like guards. The more, the better."


The Wizards couldn't use me? (Photo by David Sherman/NBAE/Getty Images)

When Pitt forward DeJuan Blair was still on the board after the first round, some of us reporters were fascinated by the possibility of the Wizards adding a rugged but undersized offensive rebounding machine. I still cannot believe that dude slipped all the way to San Antonio at No. 37 after he manhandled Thabeet in Big East play.

I know there are concerns about his knees, but like he often said, those knees still won him co-player of the year in arguably the best conference in college basketball. Grunfeld didn't want to hear about passing on a player who was slated to go in the middle of the first round. Seemed like a good move to get Blair, but Grunfeld didn't think so. "I don't know who was speculating what, but we weren't tempted to take anyone in that spot," Grunfeld said.

It made some sense for the team to sell the pick -- especially for that kind of money (last year's second-rounder, Bill Walker, went to Boston for $750,000) -- since it takes some of the sting out of the dollar-for-dollar luxury tax penalty that will come from signing a veteran big man. Some cheaper free agent options to add a veteran big include Joe Smith, Stromile Swift, Mikki Moore, Brian Skinner, Francisco Elson and Fabricio Oberto, should Detroit cut him. Not an exciting list at all, although Smith might be able to bring something. It would great if the Wizards could add someone like Antonio McDyess, but that is likely a pipe dream. Chris Wilcox is also out there.

But you also have to assume that the Wizards will look to make another trade and find a taker for Mike James's expiring contract. With DeShawn Stevenson recovering from back surgery, it is unlikely that any team would be willing to take him, but you never know.

You just have a hunch that something else is bound to follow.

By Michael Lee  |  June 26, 2009; 9:59 AM ET
 
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Next: Brendan Haywood's Predictions

Comments

The moniker that comes to mind when I think of Ernie and Abe right now is "Two-Faced." On one side of the coin, they are telling us that they had no use for the #5 pick because it was time to win now. Fine, I can live with that. Miller and Foye are solid players....

...But on the other side of the coin, they sell the second round pick (again!) for cash when players that would fill obvious holes on our roster (in the case of Blair, a potential lottery pick) are available for the taking. And on the cheap no less, given their second round status.

Yes, I went to Pitt and I was certainly on the Blair bandwagon, but I would have been fine had Ernie decided there was a player he liked more that he felt would help the team more at #32, but to sell it at the expense of improving the team...that's unacceptable.

I guess they figure us fans are all too dumb to realize they are spitting in our faces and telling us it's raining.

Posted by: ironpanthr | June 26, 2009 9:33 AM | Report abuse

Grunfeld is a joke. He better pull off a big move for a big man to save face.

Posted by: beas13 | June 26, 2009 9:34 AM | Report abuse

"I don't know who was speculating what but we weren't tempted to take anyone in that spot," Grunfeld said

Yeah Dujuan Blair wouldn't have helped this team at all...great call.

What a joke

Posted by: beas13 | June 26, 2009 9:35 AM | Report abuse

Dujuan Blair-- what are they thinking.

heartbroken

Posted by: alosman24 | June 26, 2009 9:37 AM | Report abuse

Mike,

Are you kidding when you write these posts?

Cheap Abe has been pocketing money from not going over the luxury cap for years and with the 2.5 and 750,000 from selling the last 2 years 2nd round draft picks even if they are over the cap this season the old man won't be losing any money!

You should have written with the 2.5 mil made from selling the 2nd round pick the Wizards payroll is at 73.5 this year?

Everyone agrees that the move for Miller and Foye doesn't put them over the top so please keep it real and tell everyone the move was made to make sure Cheap Abe makes the playoffs this season so he can pocket the money from at least one playoff round and he saved money by not having to sign a first round pick!

Woodward and Bernstein must laugh at the reporting going at the post...if you were the reporter you would have said there is nothing going on at the white house and the watergate breakin was okay since it will help get Nixon re-elected?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 26, 2009 9:38 AM | Report abuse

If the Wiz don't use the MLE to acquire a bigman, I'll have no respect whatsoever for EG. He's basically said that the Wiz needed to fill a need for an established veteran bigman, then sold our 2nd round draft pick for cash, and not used it. Maybe Abe Pollin really doesn't want to shell out the cash at this point, but I think we should give him the benfit of the doubt after he spent $150M to retain Gilbert and AJ last summer.

Posted by: wizfan89 | June 26, 2009 9:46 AM | Report abuse

That security guard knows what's up. It sucked last night and it still sucks this morning.

DeJuan Blair isn't guaranteed a contract. In fact no 2nd rounder is so what exactly is the risk?

$2.5 more million to overpay Brian Skinner or Shelden Williams in free agency? WHOOPDEEDAMMDOO!

This is Big Ern's 3rd major tactical error IMO:

1. Signing DSteve instead of Roger Mason last summer
2. Extending Pech's contract last October instead of waiting until season's end
3. Selling pick for cash

Posted by: elfreako | June 26, 2009 9:46 AM | Report abuse

""The moment the Wizards selected Taylor, it was obvious that he was going to get dealt, but Grunfeld had a good time toying with reporters afterward. Asked to explain the choice, Grunfeld joked, "I like guards. The more, the better.""


Yeah, I'd be laughing and joking too - running away from the draft with a pile of cash for Abe, having avoided paying any new players, selling the fans fools gold with the Foye/Miller trade and duping scores of Wizards fans into thinking the team is a serious competitor. Yeah, if I'm Ernie, I'm laughing it up having a great time...

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 9:47 AM | Report abuse

Blair would have been a steal 32. I can't believe Ernie passed on him on him. This is a mistake they'll regret. And the knees? they clearly aren't afraid to sign and pay people who've had knee issues (Gilbert, Foye). That list of washed up bigs is pathetic - Blair would be a better rebound machine off the bench right now than any of those bums.

Posted by: burgundyandgold21 | June 26, 2009 9:51 AM | Report abuse

Deliver us from these petulant pouty posters. The $2.5 mil the team got for the #32 pick will go to acquiring the quality big the team needs. Here's a challenge to all you nannering nabobs of negativism: when it becomes clear that the front office made good moves, post here that you were wrong, and that EG and Flip were right, and the reason(s) for your Bozo outbursts (whether venting because of unrelated personal issues, rash judgements, low IQ, or whatever). The team deserves better. As has been posted recently, do you remember the years before EG was here?

Posted by: 7snider7 | June 26, 2009 9:52 AM | Report abuse

this is tragic.

hey funk it sound like folks are comin around.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 9:55 AM | Report abuse

Does anybody have info on the salary cap space, MLE available to the Wizards right now? Are we able to use the full MLE?

Posted by: psps23 | June 26, 2009 9:55 AM | Report abuse

did yall see the list of potential fa bigs michael just mentioned? mikki moore?joe smith?brian skinner?fransico elson? oberto might be considered a quality big, but he's like 32 and i doubt he would want to come here. so who are these fa bigs we can afford to go throw $ at? i'm usually a homer but this one stinks

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 9:59 AM | Report abuse

Hedo Turkoglu opted out...I'm not saying, I'm just saying.

Posted by: DocHolliday1906 | June 26, 2009 10:03 AM | Report abuse

I have to say that using the 2nd pick the way they did has to indicate something/someone(s) specific are in the works.

Clearing out practically all the dead weight except for MJ was a huge accomplishment for me.

Not filling the void of adding a big man is a question at this point. I am not willing to give a final grade to Ernie just yet.

We now have some flexibility to pick up the big veteran big man backup whomever he might be. It seems that Ernie did not want a rookie backup.

If I guessed this right, then we have to wait and see a bit to see how things shakes out.

Who knows who might become available henceforth from now.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 26, 2009 10:03 AM | Report abuse

this is tragic.

hey funk it sound like folks are comin around.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 9:55 AM


The Ernie apologists are mostly under a rock right now b/c even they know that what went down yesterday is ludicrous.

Ernie clearly fumbled the handling of the #5 pick, and, given our need for an interior rebounder, it is baffling why we wouldn't go for Blair when the risk-reward ratio is heavily in the team's favor when it comes to 2nd-rounders.

I guess one or 2 apologists are out here yapping. But they think EG deserves our undying blind devotion b/c the Wiz actually went to the playoffs a couple times recently.

The more clear-thinking fans will hold Ernie accountable for the moves he ACTUALLY makes, and not the ones we hope he makes.

Until we SEE the F/C on the roster that is actually gonna address this team's long-standing deficienies in the paint, I hope the fans keep letting Ernie hear it.

I

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 10:04 AM | Report abuse

There are 28 general managers making good money who passed on Blair, they must not be complete morons.
Can the Wiz offer a max contract to a free agent next year?

Posted by: theskinnypost | June 26, 2009 10:05 AM | Report abuse

did yall see the list of potential fa bigs michael just mentioned? mikki moore?joe smith?brian skinner?fransico elson? oberto might be considered a quality big, but he's like 32 and i doubt he would want to come here. so who are these fa bigs we can afford to go throw $ at? i'm usually a homer but this one stinks

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 9:59 AM


No kidding. I would have much rather taken a flyer on Blair than throw an MLE or my cash at these donkeys.

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 10:06 AM | Report abuse

There are 28 general managers making good money who passed on Blair, they must not be complete morons.
Can the Wiz offer a max contract to a free agent next year?

Posted by: theskinnypost | June 26, 2009 10:05 AM


And the guy who selected Blair is Greg Popovich...we all know what a moron he is...

And the answer to your question is no. Not with the Gil/AJ contracts, and not if the team intends to extend Caron and re-sign Haywood.

EG has been saying all along that he believes in the "Big 3".

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 10:08 AM | Report abuse

Right now, this moment we are a plus 500 basketball team in a Conference where minus 500 teams still make the playoffs. If D Steve can prove he is healthy, many teams will want him in the West where there is a defensive deficiency. James becomes more attractive to teams wishing to shed salary. Everyone who is mad at EG for not being patient and seeing Rubio slip through our fingers needs to remind themselves of the virtue they tout. Be patient. James has less value now than in a couple of months, and we do not really need a quality banger until after the All Star Break in the build up to stopping Howard and Shaq. Until we make a run in the playoffs we can hold tight without an addition, and we will make it there just by running. Don't feel it is all lost without a quality big right now, because the quality of the big we can get will likely go up if we wait a bit.

Posted by: yankeevicar | June 26, 2009 10:09 AM | Report abuse

Who knows who might become available henceforth from now.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 26, 2009 10:03 AM

i hope ernie knows, b/c this whole draft trading experiment hinges on being able to bolster the front court through fa or trades.

either way, our next move will be one purely of neccesity. that may lead to us giving more than we get.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 10:10 AM | Report abuse

what do yall think about hill going to ny? can he be amare for them? we coulda had a young athletic pf to learn the game behind AJ, possibly LH if we swapped with ny so they could get curry or rubio.

we're back at square one with a lot less options at pf than we would have had before the draft.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 10:13 AM | Report abuse

since the wiz drafted cash this year so we get an additional reduction in ticket prices

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 10:15 AM | Report abuse

I'm looking forward to seeing the Wiz on the court next year -- I like the additions.

From hearing Saunders talk about Blatche -- it sounds like they're expecting him to take a leap in his development next year. Well see. He's got talent, but hasn't been able to put the pieces together yet.

Moving Mike James's contract would be great if the Wiz can do it -- it will be even better if they can get a veteran back-up for Haywood in the process.

Not much sizzle, but Nesterovic is also an unrestricted FA who would fall within the MLE. Gortat is likely to be out there too. Not sure if Drew Gooden has resigned with the Spurs, but he could be a solid addition provided the Wiz are willing to go over the tax.

Posted by: JPRS | June 26, 2009 10:15 AM | Report abuse

I know well that this is a sports site, but Clarence Thomas is a hanging judge and a disgrace. An 8-1 decision and he was the one to believe that a 13yr old girl had no protection against being strip searched in middle school. I guess it is really clear now that he really does not believe he sexually harassed Anita Hill.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 26, 2009 10:16 AM | Report abuse

I don't have a problem with selling the 2nd round pick for $2.5M if we use it to acquire a good player whether through FA or another trade. Blair would have been a steal at 32 but let me say this. Blair isn't offensively that skilled and he is a rugged player. However, his toughness and strength was able to get him through in college even though he lacked height. In the NBA his lack of height will really hurt him. I think on a team like SA (who drafted him) he's a great fit but on our team he doesn't really work out as great as some think. It's as simple as this:
If WIZ use that $2.5M plus free money they have for a trade or FA pick up on a good big man it's a smart move. If they did that move and don't sign/trade for a solid big man than we wasted a 2nd round pick on being cheap. As I've said all along let's see what else is done before we call this offseason a waste. If we were to get someone like Chris Wilcox and use that $2.5M toward him, I'd rather have Wilcox over Blair. Here's why:

Wilcox is stronger, more athletic, taller, and has no injury history. Blair is shorter, not nearly as athletic, and has 2 ACL tears. If we were to use that $ for someone like Wilcox it is a smart move. If not, than I agree with everyone who criticizes the move. Let's just wait and see what happens.

Posted by: DCSportsFan28 | June 26, 2009 10:20 AM | Report abuse

Folks reported last night that Ernie was talking about some "announcement" to be made this morning.

Is the "announcement" the sale of the pick to Houston for cash?

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 10:21 AM | Report abuse

Right now, this moment we are a plus 500 basketball team in a Conference where minus 500 teams still make the playoffs.

Right now we're a 19 win team with 2 injury prone superstars(gil/cb) two new old expendables (ask minny) in a conference that has just gotten extremely top heavy. all these trades in the east coupled with vast superiority at the top of the division makes the wizards a team that gets to the playoffs and exits early.
how are we any different than before?

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 10:24 AM | Report abuse

$2.5 Mil for a 2nd Round Pick? EG just fleeced Houston. They just paid more for a pick than the actual cost of the player.

We need someone to play 5-10 Min for about 35 Games. Any of those FA's can do that.

Oberto would be a good fit. He knows the role of backup 4 fairly well, and that turns the Center position into a 3 man rotation with Haywood, Blatche & McGee.

Back in 07/08 the Blatch/Haywood combo was actually pretty good.

Posted by: cballer | June 26, 2009 10:29 AM | Report abuse

best jon cheyney quote " put in the goon" i forget who they were playing, but somebody big was havin a field day all over temple and cheyney couldn't take it. he put in a " goon" to rough up the other team's big and break his rhythm. he ended up hurting the kid and getting in hot water b/c of it but i loved it.

you gotta have a goon. somebody who's not that skilled neccessarily but is rugged. blair relies on his toughness to be effective, which means unless he runs out of toughness, he'll always play that way( rugged, tough, hard). he won't walk away from the fight and start shooting 3s like our starting 4.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 10:31 AM | Report abuse

EG just fleeced Houston.

Posted by: cballer | June 26, 2009 10:29 AM

Houston's not the only one that EG has been fleecing...

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 10:32 AM | Report abuse

pop just got a goon to do timmy's dirty work

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 10:33 AM | Report abuse

For whatever it's worth, this made me feel better, Chad Ford knows his stuff...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft2009/columns/story?columnist=ford_chad&page=DraftGrades-090626

"WASHINGTON WIZARDS GRADE: A

Round 1: None

Round 2: None

Analysis: Washington had the No. 5 pick in the draft but traded it, along with Etan Thomas, Darius Songaila and Oleksiy Pecherov, to the Wolves for Randy Foye and Mike Miller. The Wizards understood that they were unlikely to get a player at No. 5 who could crack their rotation, and they wanted to be serious contenders right away in the East. I think the addition of Foye and Miller puts them there.

The Wolves were willing to pay significantly more than any other team, giving up two solid starters. I don't think the Wizards could've done any better in getting value for the No. 5 pick."

I still think we should have taken Blair, but will reserve judgement until I see who we sign and/or trade for. The only certain right now is that there are still moves to be made. Let's all remember that the offseason just started. Still have the full MLE, Mike James' contract, and maybe Nick Young to work with. Fingers crossed...

Posted by: tcerand | June 26, 2009 10:33 AM | Report abuse

The value in this draft will prove to be late in the first round. If you are not excited about a kid you should not draft him...(Kwame Brown) So all in all the Wiz are no worse for the wear. Rubio is another euro who will be average at best. Remember the kid that we drafted and we had to send packing last year. Ahhh what is his name?????? Exactly my point it doesn't matter it has been about 4 years since he was drafted and no impact. It is a must that we drop 2 of the 7 guards on the roster. We need an athletic wing and a rugged 4.

Posted by: jtrob_1 | June 26, 2009 10:33 AM | Report abuse

Still waiting for rebounding, size and defense. We need two players from: Marcus Camby, Drew Gooden, Marcin Gortat, Zaza Pachulia, or Brandon Bass. Gortat has the size to deal with Cleveland and Orlando. Gooden and Camby give rebounding and defense. It is OK to add big men if you want to go past Cleveland and Orlando. It is OK to give Abe what he wants-- a championship.

Posted by: JoeC2 | June 26, 2009 10:40 AM | Report abuse

wizfan89:

What ABE did with those two 150 million contracts is cripple the D.C. franchise for years to come. This club is geared solely to winning what it can in 2010 not beyond that date. A championship is nowhere in sight with everyone healthy that's currently on the roster. Until season tickets holders have a say in the operation of sports franchises nothing will change. There will always be well-meaning, but befuddled wanna be's with $$$$ and no brains trying valiantly to secure championships. When the long-term ticket-holders have a say in who that will be, things will improve because their motivation is a championship, not wringing all the return on their investment they can out of suckers who pony up big bucks in vain.

Posted by: glawrence007 | June 26, 2009 10:40 AM | Report abuse

On paper at least the Minny trade makes the Wiz better -- and it gives them two quality players to trade if they decide to go that route too.

Miller, in particular, isn't a top scorer or a #2. As a 6th man though he could be dangerous. As a 3rd option he will give most opponents fits. Foye is an interesting option to throw into the mix too.

This team's D is probably going to suck, but its ability to put up points is going to make it a tough match-up for most opponents.

If the Wiz can get some extra insurance in the front court, they should be in as good a position as almost anyone. The main thing is that this team is going to be able to hit opponents from a number of different directions on the offensive end of the court.

Posted by: JPRS | June 26, 2009 10:41 AM | Report abuse

Is DeJuan Blair better than Andray Blatch? Not any time within the next 2 years.

Javale McGee? Not even close talent-wise, and McGee has a year head start experience-wise.

In fact, is DeJuan Blair better right now than any of the FA's on Mike's list? Will he be better than any of them in the next 2 years? No.

DeJuan Blair is exactly what the Wiz needed... another backup developmental big under 23...

Posted by: jones-y | June 26, 2009 10:42 AM | Report abuse

As we assess the "Pros" of this team (great jump-shooters, perimeter play/flexibility) and the "Cons" (interior defending/rebounding/scoring), I'm half expecting to look up at the calendar and see "2004-2005" on it.

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 10:45 AM | Report abuse

how are we any different than before?

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 10:24 AM


It depends which before you look at. Before we were the top team in the East with the talent now on the table, plus guys that improve our already potent scoring and give us more options to rest injury prone stars.

Posted by: yankeevicar | June 26, 2009 10:49 AM | Report abuse

I heard Party John Ramos is available this summer...

Posted by: jbisdaman | June 26, 2009 10:50 AM | Report abuse

Whatever happened to Vlad Veremenko?

Posted by: amalg | June 26, 2009 10:50 AM | Report abuse

how does mike miller become the third option? don't we already have a big 3. miller would be the fourth option and statistically less dangerous than nick young going on last year's stats. where does that put foye? i dunno. i agree another move must be made, but now we have less leverage in trying to make a deal. everytone know we're desprate for a big.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 10:50 AM | Report abuse

With what we are trying to jettison, James is attractive to cap relief, something that becomes more valuable to teams that write off a bad year mid season and begin to rebuild.

D Steve needs to show he is back to form to have any value.

Either contract will bring in some muscle later on in the season.

Posted by: yankeevicar | June 26, 2009 10:56 AM | Report abuse

how does mike miller become the third option? don't we already have a big 3. miller would be the fourth option and statistically less dangerous than nick young going on last year's stats. where does that put foye? i dunno. i agree another move must be made, but now we have less leverage in trying to make a deal. everytone know we're desprate for a big.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 10:50 AM


Exactly. Alot of people like this move for Miller/Foye looking at it in a vacuum: "We got 2 solid starters for #5 and a bunch of big nobodys".

But you've got to look at the how the team has already been constructed, and then assess the trade. We weren't desperate for a perimeter jump-shooter. We weren't desperate for a combo guard. We already had some "solid starters" on the permieter. Our "Big 3" perimeter players were already the strength of this team. So we bolstered an area of the team that was already strong???

...nice shiny new coat of paint, but hasn't the car been up on cinder blocks for 5 years???

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 10:56 AM | Report abuse

19 wins last yr
1st in the east 4 yrs ago after 40 gms
getting old

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 10:57 AM | Report abuse

funk!

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 11:00 AM | Report abuse

Calm down, people. The offseason doesn't end on draft night. Give Ernie time to balance the roster.

I'm also chuckling at the people calling Abe "cheap". This is the same guy who just shelled out over $160M to keep Arenas and Jamison with full knowledge that it would put them into luxury tax territory. Remember Juwan Howard's contract? Nothing cheap about that. Abe also built the Verizon Center with his own money and revitalized an entire section of the city. The man is not cheap, people.

This is a strategic move on Ernie's part to give the team the financial flexibility to be active in free agency. We don't need more young players, we need veterans who already know how to win. And by the time the offseason is over, that's what we will have.

Posted by: LyricalRico | June 26, 2009 11:01 AM | Report abuse

But last year was so full of injury and dysfunction, 3 years ago, not 4, is a better measure of where this team actually is. How many people have been angling that they are the missing piece to the Wizards winning a ring this year? Amare, Griffin, Harden...

Posted by: yankeevicar | June 26, 2009 11:04 AM | Report abuse

The 2009-2010 roster has a lot more depth than the 2004-2005 team -- it also has more offensive balance.

Jeffries may have been a slight defensive improvement over the current starting roster, but he wasn't a factor much on the offensive end.

Haywood has also come along in his development since then. I'd also give Blatche the nod over Kwame.

Caron versus Hughes too, I'd take Butler without a moment of hesitation. He's a much more complete player and is a better fit at small forward.

The current roster can go at least 7 deep and the other 5 could factor in the rotation too. 2004-2005 team had a lot of excess that didn't really add much to the team. After the starting 5 you had guys like Ruffin who could serve as limited role players. Dixon was a one-dimensional offensive presence who was a serious liability on defense. Ruffin was a one dimensional defensive presence who was a serious liability on offense.

This team is much deeper -- especially in the back-court. It has more talent too and could field a complete second unit in some games.

Posted by: JPRS | June 26, 2009 11:09 AM | Report abuse

Reading these comments are making me laugh more than I did watching The Hangover. You people have ABSOLUTELY no idea what you are talking about when you attack Ernie Grunfeld. The man has assembled a team with 50+ win potential from the depths of hell--a team that was perennially stuck in the 25-30 win stature for years and years.

It's simply pathetic how those who quite literally became Wizards fan in large part thanks to the moves that this GM has made in the last 6 years are now the same people calling him a "joke."

If you think Ernie Grunfeld is a joke, you are rooting for the wrong team.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 26, 2009 11:12 AM | Report abuse

"Our "Big 3" perimeter players were already the strength of this team. So we bolstered an area of the team that was already strong???"

Our "strength" of the team was the starting spots at the 1, 3, 4, and 5.

What other perimeter guards were our "strength"? Nick Young? Mike James? DeShawn Stevenson? Javaris Crittenton?

The only player any logical person would say as of right now was even close would be Nick Young.

And he's no more of a "strength" than Andray Blatche (in fact, he's probably less). And none of the other guys are as useful as Javale McGee, as raw as he is. And Dominic McGuire is more useful than the entire list above.

As many bodies as we had there, there were really only 2 guards on the roster that any competitive team would feel comfortable putting on the court on a regular basis; Gilbert Arenas and Nick Young. After that, it was a pile of crap (though I do have hope for Crit someday).

So while, yes, it's important that we bolster our frontline, in no way, shape, or form was our backcourt even close to a strength. We had major depth weaknesses across the entire lineup, and we had no starting 2. We solidified depth at the 1, 2, and 3, and gave ourselves multiple options for a starting 2. I definitely agree that we need to complete the offseason with adding at least one, hopefully 2 big men, but make no mistake, adding the backcourt help was absolutely necessary.

Posted by: psps23 | June 26, 2009 11:14 AM | Report abuse

Remember Juwan Howard's contract? Nothing cheap about that.


abe was outbid by miami for juwan, and heard about it in the media and from fans for letting go of an all star. he only ponied up after incurring the wrath of the local fans and media, and when stern voided miami's contract with howard.
don't act like abe fuels up the jet for free agents like danny does.


if nothing else he'll overpay to keep our own guys. the last big time free agent signing was gil. plenty of guys have hit the market since then; why not spend to win now and not keep pulling juwan howard and building the stadium out his arse?

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 11:16 AM | Report abuse

lilhollywood10,

Miller becomes a 3rd option during games, because Arenas, Butler, and Jamison aren't going to play 48 minutes most nights.

When Butler gets his breather, odds are Miller takes his place. When Jamison gets his breather, odds are Miller will fill in for him with some situations. There's a chance he might even see some action at SG. Except for blow-outs Miller probably won't be the primary scorer.

He'll probably be teamed up with two of the "big" three when he's on the court. I'd guess he'll be used most games as relief rather than as part of the starting 5.

Nick Young will get his minutes. But NY isn't a career 40 percent shooter from 3-point territory. There's only one guy on this team that fits that description.

Posted by: JPRS | June 26, 2009 11:17 AM | Report abuse

I dont know why all the negativeity on the pick. SO what if we missed out on rubio..hes unproven, did not want to play in washington and prally wont even play this year in the NBA. MIller and Foye are proven and you folks keep sleeping on Foye, I insist he is an upgrade at a position we soarly lacked. It makes room to trade possibly nick young,mike james and another piece to acquire a quality big man like a Mcdyess or Milsap or Landry, and sign him with the MLE because of the cap space that was cleared.

please wizards fans wait until we have a final roster for opening day.
grunfield hired his coach, he got his players now its time to wait and see

Posted by: mrhney03 | June 26, 2009 11:17 AM | Report abuse

And yes, I'm pissed that EG (or Abe) sold the 2nd round draft pick. Even if you only think there's a 5% chance that this guy can help immediately, you owe it to the fans and the league to do everything possible to give yourself a chance at improving.

Posted by: psps23 | June 26, 2009 11:18 AM | Report abuse

Even if Blair did nothing but eat up space and rebound, he's better than 90% of the guys mentioned in this blog as big man possibilities.

Only Wilcox and perhaps old azz underachieving Joe Smith would do us any good. Oberto might work, too as a backup to a backup.

No excuses. We need rebounding. Blair provides rebounding. This was a mistake. Of course, we may still win a lot of games and Eg will look like a smart guy. Problem is we could win even more with Blair.

Posted by: original_mark | June 26, 2009 11:20 AM | Report abuse

@glawrence007
"Until season tickets holders have a say in the operation of sports franchises nothing will change."

Uh, yeah, uninformed, popular opinion is definitely the way to go....??? And season ticket holders do have a say, they vote with their wallets.

I would have liked to see Ernie take a shot on Blair, Young, Summers or some of the other quality talent that was there to be had in the 2nd. But if that 2.5 mil helps us sign or acquire a decent vet big man, I'll give Ernie a pass. I'm not an Ernie apologist, but I believe he has done enough good things with the team to earn some slack. If we enter the season with essentially the same team plus just a Mikki Moore or Brian Skinner, the slack will get considerably shorter.

Abe is getting up there in age and is too sentimental, sometimes to the detriment of the team, but I'll never trash talk him or call him a bad owner. I won't say he's the shrewdest owner, but he has spent bucks to bring in talent, and he spent big bucks of his own money to build the arena. The arena which also revitalized a part of the city. Where a few months ago, everyone was excited to Rock The Red. We didn't go through the drama that surrounded the Nats stadium which is getting funded off the DC taxpayers' backs and we didn't lose our team like the Sonics did because they couldn't put together a stadium deal. So all you haters out there can sit back and talk crap about Abe about how he's cheap and doesn't want to win, but you won't hear it from me.

Posted by: ts35 | June 26, 2009 11:23 AM | Report abuse

Wiz have two open roster spots at the moment. So buy selling 2nd rounder does this suggest signing 2 free agents? or possibly signing one FA and a 2 for 3 or 1 for 2 trade with Mike James?

# name pos 09-10 salary years 2010 status
1 G. Arenas G $14,653,466.00 5 under contract
2 M. Miller GF $9,028,575.00 1 unrestricted
3 C. Butler GF $9,249,980.00 2 under contract
4 A. Jamison F $9,923,285.00 3 under contract
5 B. Haywood C $5,500,000.00 1 unrestricted

6 R. Foye G $2,815,560.00 1 restricted
7 A. Blatche F $2,739,669.00 3 under contract
8 N. Young SG $1,602,960.00 1 restricted
9 J. McGee C $1,392,240.00 1 restricted
10 D. McGuire SF $711,517.00 1 restricted
13 J. Crittenton G $1,381,560.00 1 restricted
11 D. Stevenson SG $3,616,072.00 1 unrestricted
12 M. James G $6,244,093.00 1 unrestricted

14 open PF?
15 open C?

Posted by: jwinches | June 26, 2009 11:23 AM | Report abuse

wilbon's column.... he said the trade doesn't address the wizards needs. hello...they couldn't hit a 3 point to save their lives last year, and they had problem at the point. the trade addresses both issues. of course a big man is another issue, but still. lame column.

Posted by: stevie2 | June 26, 2009 11:24 AM | Report abuse

Our "Big 3" perimeter players were already the strength of this team. So we bolstered an area of the team that was already strong???"

Our "strength" of the team was the starting spots at the 1, 3, 4, and 5.

What other perimeter guards were our "strength"? Nick Young? Mike James? DeShawn Stevenson? Javaris Crittenton?

The only player any logical person would say as of right now was even close would be Nick Young.

And he's no more of a "strength" than Andray Blatche (in fact, he's probably less). And none of the other guys are as useful as Javale McGee, as raw as he is. And Dominic McGuire is more useful than the entire list above.

As many bodies as we had there, there were really only 2 guards on the roster that any competitive team would feel comfortable putting on the court on a regular basis; Gilbert Arenas and Nick Young. After that, it was a pile of crap (though I do have hope for Crit someday).

So while, yes, it's important that we bolster our frontline, in no way, shape, or form was our backcourt even close to a strength. We had major depth weaknesses across the entire lineup, and we had no starting 2. We solidified depth at the 1, 2, and 3, and gave ourselves multiple options for a starting 2. I definitely agree that we need to complete the offseason with adding at least one, hopefully 2 big men, but make no mistake, adding the backcourt help was absolutely necessary.

Posted by: psps23 | June 26, 2009 11:14 AM


And what exactly do those guys at the 1,3 and 4 give us? They give us perimeter scoring. They give us 3-point shooting. They don't give us much defense.

Nick Young gives us perimeter scoring. Mike James gives us perimeter scoring and 3-point shooting (that's ALL he gives us). But they don't give us much defense.

And so our big move was to bring in...drum roll...Mike Miller!!! Who gives us (take a wild guess) 3-point shooting, perimeter scoring and no defense!! TA-DA!!

I guess it's nice to have Randy Foye as insurance for Gil. If Gil goes down again, we can lean on Foye to lead us to the Championsh...errr, never mind...

Once again: The car has been up on cinder blocks for 5 years, and we are oogling over the new coat of paint.

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 11:25 AM | Report abuse

At first I was stunned that we passed on DeJuan Blair, seeing that he was the best available prospect when it was our turn to make a selection.

However, I now believe that Washington is the WORST place for Blair to have come. Blair may have been able to get a few good college seasons out of his two bad knees. He's not going to be able to hold down heavy minutes playing a grinding 82 game schedule. The level of competition is much higher (duh) and the rules for big men are a lot more restrictive than in college.

Popovich is famous for managing his players for the long haul, giving them plenty of breathing room.

Washington probably has the worst medical staff in the history of pro basketball. And until that changes, this is not the place to have an undersized power forward lacking knee ligaments to task with fighting for position under the basket.

Posted by: mabkhar | June 26, 2009 11:25 AM | Report abuse

I just read this..

The Phoenix Suns have reportedly agreed to trade star F/C Amar'e Stoudemire to the Golden State Warriors for a package consisting of F Andris Biedrins, recent seventh overall pick PG Stephen Curry, and F Brandan Wright or Marco Belinelli.

Now THIS is a fleecing. Biedrins alone is almost as valuable as Stoudemire. To throw in Curry (who should be awesome alongside Nash in an uptempo game) and either one of those young prospects is a steal.

Posted by: original_mark | June 26, 2009 11:27 AM | Report abuse

I have no problem with the Wiz acquisitions of Foye and Miller, and even passing on Blair. Hopefully, they were working on Josh Heyvelt out of Gonzaga who went undrafted after destroying Hansbrough a year or two ago. I know there are some injury concerns with him, but we aren't looking for a starter. Of the free agents mentioned, Joe Smith is the only name with any pop to it. I am trying to imagine a trade situation where we can unload a couple of these guards, but I can't right now. And I might be foolish, but I think we want to keep Stevenson. He is getting a lot of hate, but he is functional and a true warrior. Other than Caron, what other wizard can you say that about right now. Second round of the playoffs maybe, but Cleveland and Orlando got a lot better. Boston, not so much.

Posted by: Gwiz66 | June 26, 2009 11:27 AM | Report abuse

We do not have the cap room to sign a free agent unless it is a sign and trade. We know the teams pattern, it is unlikely we will go over the cap, but why should we? Teams gamble that way and loose more often than win. Boston did not take a championship this year, they lost revenue that made last years expenditure viable, and look how ready they are to blow things up.

Hold tight. See how what we have works together unless there is a sign and trade available for Milsap, McNice... which is doubtful until teams decide they need to dump salary. We no longer have anything to entice teams into trading with us until the financials' become a burden to loosing teams.

Posted by: yankeevicar | June 26, 2009 11:27 AM | Report abuse

wilbon's column.... he said the trade doesn't address the wizards needs. hello...they couldn't hit a 3 point to save their lives last year, and they had problem at the point. the trade addresses both issues. of course a big man is another issue, but still. lame column.

Posted by: stevie2 | June 26, 2009 11:24 AM


Gee. I'm going out on a limb and saying that our 3-pont struggles and PG struggles had to do with Gilbert's injury...ya think??

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 11:27 AM | Report abuse

Good lord people:

Stevenson was not signed at the expense of Roger Mason -- get a grip. Stevenson signed his deal the year before. Mason was a wondering FA at that point. Stevenson is not the reason Mason was not brought back -- Mason's desire for more money and playing time were. Don't try to rewrite history on that one.

Posted by: Chad32 | June 26, 2009 11:28 AM | Report abuse

True the wizards medical staff does kinda give a silver lining (in that mercury is poisonous but pretty kinda way). But im still stuck on the fact that he provided the exact piece we needed (banger/rebounder) and would have cost less while being just as (if not more then) ready/skilled as whatever ruffinesque scrub that's available for the vet minimum.

Posted by: PindarPushkin | June 26, 2009 11:30 AM | Report abuse

while i may have accepted rubio at 5 i don't know if he'd have been my pick. but that's not to say i don't see value in keeping the pick till draft day and then seeing how much we could get or drafting him and trading him. espn analyst just said that rubio will prolly play next yr b/c there may be a trade in the works. those are the options minny had yesterday and still has today just by keeping the pick .

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 11:30 AM | Report abuse

no jprs, they won't all play 48 mins, but the all avg over 37 mins pg for their careers. so how much is mike gonna do in 12 mins or so he only avg'd 9 pts last yr

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 11:34 AM | Report abuse

Wow, why is everyone crying on this board for today?

EG handled this very well I thought.

Rubio, shmubio.

Dude has never played in the NBA and trust me, a lot of those passes he did in Europe won't make it here in the NBA.

Sounds a ton like a couple years ago with JCN. In this draft it was Griffin or nobody.

Personally speaking I liked Evans after Griffin as well. Hard to pass on a kid with the wing span of someone who is 6'11".

And who cares about a crappy second round pick anyway?

- Ray

Posted by: rmcazz | June 26, 2009 11:34 AM | Report abuse

"We do not have the cap room to sign a free agent unless it is a sign and trade."

Not true. They can spend the MLE on one or more FAs. But they'll have to pay luxury tax on any amount they spend.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 26, 2009 11:34 AM | Report abuse

um... hate to tell you this but Stevenson was resigned the same year Mason left. Stevenson's original cheap contract did not last all that long.

Posted by: PindarPushkin | June 26, 2009 11:36 AM | Report abuse

all day that! mark

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 11:36 AM | Report abuse

Wow the whiners and complainers re: EG leaving the Wizard's depleted of backup big men would have a field day in Orlando bashing their GM Otis Smith. The Wizards have a not so terrible trio of bench big men in McGee, Blatche and Maguire. Contrast that to Orlando with Battie already gone in the Carter deal and Gortat soon departing via free agency. That leaves the Magic with a stellar cast of backup bigs consisting of Adonal Foyle and Ryan Andersen.

By the way, ESPN analyst Chad Ford not only rates the Wizards draft moves an "A" but also gives the trade partner, the Timberwolves, a grade of "C+".

Posted by: phil27 | June 26, 2009 11:37 AM | Report abuse

we're gonna get ruffin pindar

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 11:39 AM | Report abuse

chad ford gave everyone a passing grade so that means nothing. while we drowned last year everyone in the East got better. You koolaid drinkers are banking on what happened 2 years ago. If and it is a big IF the wizards do make the playoffs it will be as a 7 or 8 seed and they will exit early facing either Boston Cleveland or Orlando. So this one year pipe dream was a waste.

Posted by: anacostia85 | June 26, 2009 11:40 AM | Report abuse

"And what exactly do those guys at the 1,3 and 4 give us? They give us perimeter scoring."

Jamison gives perimeter, post scoring, and rebounding. Butler gives an all-around offensive game, especially when he's not counted on as the primary ballhandler. Arenas gives perimeter scoring, ballhandling, rebounding (for his position), transition offense, and (when he wants to) movement of the ball. To classify any one of them as purely a "perimeter scorer" is beyond myopic.

On top of that, Miller gives us rebounding (for his position), Foye upgrades the 1/2 defensive spots (over the 2 realistic options we had at guard), and Foye provides ballhandling relief and transition offense.

And if your team is relying on Mike James to provide any sort of contribution, I don't care who you thought we could have acquired to rotate with Blatche and McGee, that team will not be contending for anything.

Posted by: psps23 | June 26, 2009 11:41 AM | Report abuse

"$2.5 Mil for a 2nd Round Pick? EG just fleeced Houston."

Not really. Last year Miami paid $3 Mil plus future consideration for Chamlers at #34!

You can say EG sells it cheap (I guess it is a weak draft)!

Chamlers really paid out for Miami. I wish Wiz has such gut to select a player than sold it!

Posted by: sagaliba | June 26, 2009 11:41 AM | Report abuse

We already had a Foye on our team and his name is Javaris and he is a better defender and he proved it on THIS team last year he can handle the ball and push the break.

Posted by: anacostia85 | June 26, 2009 11:45 AM | Report abuse

phil27,

If Magic does not re-sign Turk, then it would have plenty of money to re-sign Gortat.

Posted by: sagaliba | June 26, 2009 11:45 AM | Report abuse

When asked early this week which opposing teams were poised to best improve themselves in Thursday's NBA Draft, Washington Wizards president Ernie Grunfeld had a simple answer.

"The Clippers."

Grunfeld let out a laugh over his painfully obvious -- and safe -- statement but went on to explain that time will tell who will emerge as the draft's winners and losers.

"As with every draft, there are some very good players in this draft," Grunfeld said. "But because many of these players are 19, 20 years old, it's just going to take some time for them to develop. But teams will be able to get better through the draft."

Indeed, with college freshmen and sophomores accounting for most of the players taken in the first round, there will be growing pains, and it's too tough to call at this point. But for the fun of it, here's the snap reaction:

Like what they did

• Los Angeles Clippers -- The no-brainer of the night, the Clippers took the only sure thing in the draft in Griffin, who draws comparisons to Amare Stoudemire and should give an infusion of young, athletic energy to a front line that features an aging Marcus Camby, Chris Kaman, who is coming off of an injury, and the underachieving Zach Randolph.

• Minnesota Timberwolves -- They dealt Randy Foye and Mike Miller to the Wizards for injury-prone center Etan Thomas, backup forward Darius Songaila and the seldom-used Oleksiy Pecherov so they could attain the fifth pick in the draft. They used the pick on Ricky Rubio - the player the Wizards wanted but didn't think would be left on the board by then - who's drawing comparisons to Pistol Pete.

this was from the wash times they are not afraid to call out the wiz

Posted by: anacostia85 | June 26, 2009 11:51 AM | Report abuse

If Magic does not re-sign Turk, then it would have plenty of money to re-sign Gortat.

Posted by: sagaliba | June 26, 2009 11:45 AM

True, Orlando will probably have the $$$$ to re-sign him but he wants to go elsewhere and play significant minutes which he doesn't get backing up "Superman". There are many teams where Gortat will be an upgrade as the starter at the 5.

Posted by: phil27 | June 26, 2009 11:52 AM | Report abuse

There are 28 general managers making good money who passed on Blair, they must not be complete morons.
Can the Wiz offer a max contract to a free agent next year?

Posted by: theskinnypost | June 26, 2009 10:05 AM

___________________________________________

San Antonio, a shrewd franchise, did not pass on Blair. They realize that what he lacks in physicality, he more than makes up for it in strength and toughness. The Wizards did not even have to give him a guranteed contract. Which one of the FA bigs will give the Wizards toughness other than the big kid from Orlando. Blair brings a toughness that the wizards do not have in Blatche and McGee. They weren't risking anything if he did not pan out so be it, but to sell the pick for money that is unacceptable. Do you know what a hot dog costs at the Verizon Center and to think I we are not trying to put the best product on the floor over money. I defended Abe yesterday against a blogger that was calling him Cheap Abe on this very blog. I was wrong. I disagree on Rubio, the Mix Tape Streetball passes he throws would never work in the NBA. Even Rafer "skip to my Lou" austin does not try that foolishness in the NBA. Jason "white chocolate" Williams had to tone it down to become a solid role player in the NBA. I have been an AAU coach for some time now and I can tell you that this kid is slow, can't jump, has no strength and no jump shot. I agree with Jennings he has been hyped by a European media unaccustomed to seeing the game played with flair. Pete Maravich averaged 37 points a game in college and even he would have struggled against that athleticism,size and agility of today's players.

Posted by: impartial1 | June 26, 2009 11:54 AM | Report abuse

"um... hate to tell you this but Stevenson was resigned the same year Mason left. Stevenson's original cheap contract did not last all that long."

Um, hate to tell you this, but that's wrong. Stevenson was re-signed in the summer of '07. Mason left in the summer of '08.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 26, 2009 11:57 AM | Report abuse

By the way, ESPN analyst Chad Ford not only rates the Wizards draft moves an "A"

Posted by: phil27
------------------------------------------

Yeah, but San Antonio got A+ by selecting DeJuan Blair in the 2nd round.

Posted by: sagaliba | June 26, 2009 11:58 AM | Report abuse

"And what exactly do those guys at the 1,3 and 4 give us? They give us perimeter scoring."

Jamison gives perimeter, post scoring, and rebounding. Butler gives an all-around offensive game, especially when he's not counted on as the primary ballhandler. Arenas gives perimeter scoring, ballhandling, rebounding (for his position), transition offense, and (when he wants to) movement of the ball. To classify any one of them as purely a "perimeter scorer" is beyond myopic.

Posted by: psps23 | June 26, 2009 11:41 AM

And by "post scoring", I guess you mean that AJ is adept at grabbing rebounds around the basket and throwing up put-back floaters. Becuase if you think we throw the ball to Jamison in the post and let him work the block, then I wonder if you've ever watched a Wizards game.

And what exactly do Miller/Foye bring to the table that is different from what you described coming from our Big 3??

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 11:59 AM | Report abuse

I dont know what Ol Ernie has up his sleeve, but it better be something because I have not been happy with the moves made this week. We need frontcourt help/depth!

Posted by: delgc23 | June 26, 2009 12:02 PM | Report abuse

the last big time free agent signing was gil. plenty of guys have hit the market since then;

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 11:16 AM

Maybe Gil was the last big free agent signing because there's something called THE SALARY CAP and they haven't had the ability to make a big free agent signing.

As for the 2nd rounder, I can only say that I totally trust Grunfeld on this regard. His history with 2nd round picks has to be as strong as anybody's. If he didn't see anyone he liked, then I am comfortable believing there was no one left worth taking.

FInally, what does it get you being angry about this stuff? You have zero control over what happens. I can see being annoyed by certain moves, but quit pretending that the Grunfeld years haven't been a drastic improvement over the practically 20 years that came before it. Enjoy what you have, you miserable crybabies.

Posted by: IrenePollin | June 26, 2009 12:03 PM | Report abuse

True, Orlando will probably have the $$$$ to re-sign him but he wants to go elsewhere and play significant minutes which he doesn't get backing up "Superman". There are many teams where Gortat will be an upgrade as the starter at the 5.

Posted by: phil27
-----------------------------------------

Maybe, but Magic still has matching right. It all depends on what kind of money other teams are willing to shell out given this economy.

Posted by: sagaliba | June 26, 2009 12:04 PM | Report abuse

Ernie Ernie ernie!!!. Were you watching your team for the last few seasons?
When are you going to address the abvious weaknesses in your roster. Are you not tied of rearranging the Deck Chairs on the Titanic.
What the Wiz need is REBOUNDING and In the Paint play.
NONE of the moves made in the LAst few Season addressed this issue.
Rebounding Rebounding Rebounding.
Dont let Jamison's Double/Doubles fool you . He cant guard anybody. Post Defense Post Defense Post Defence Get it Ernie?.
It does not matter how many points you score UNLESS you can stop the opposition they are always in the game. How ofen have we seen 20 Point Leads dissapear BECAUSE he have NO Lock Down Defenders?
DEFENCE ? You talking about Defense?
Until we address this problem we will never be Contenders.
Flip had a good defensive team in Detroit- what did he do with it?
They ran him out after 2 years.

Posted by: Carprin | June 26, 2009 12:06 PM | Report abuse

HAVE A HUNCH THAT SOMETHING ELSE IS GOING TO FOLLOW. I have followed the wizards for over 20 years. Grunfeld does not have any clue about what is to follow. Pick up a journeyman PF/C; like that will help.

Let's look at this:
Jamison hurt part of last year
Butler hurt part of last year
Arenas out all year
Haywood out most of the year
Stevenson out part of the year (and may not come back)but basically ineffective
Thomas was ineffective
James was ineffective
Oleg ineffective

Say "Let's put 2000-09 behind us"

Arenas is injury prone,
Butler is injury prone
Jamison is injury prone
won't mention Stevenson

So, we get Miller and Foye, a good move (?) and now have depth at Guard (7-8) but no depth at F/C. Let's pass on drafting Dejuan Blair and Sam Clancy. Why because they cost money and they would look better improving someone else's team.

Let's use a valuable draft pick #32 and draft someone to improve Houston's team.

A gift was placed in the Wizards hand and they said No to Blair, Clancy and Derrick Brown or Neins.

Get a Freaking Clue

Posted by: RichAbraham | June 26, 2009 12:08 PM | Report abuse

1. Rubio was the single riskiest player in the top ten
2. Miller is proven/solid and Foye is poised for b-level stardom (similiar to C. Butler pre-Wiz)
3. Wiz cannot continue to play big-3 39 minutes per game...THAT'S how you get hurt and THAT'S why they needed proven scoring backup.
4. N. Young is a knucklehead, package him for a big.
5. I have an inside source (spoke with Tap personally) who says Arenas is 100%/fine.

that is all

Posted by: sunnyman1 | June 26, 2009 12:17 PM | Report abuse

"Becuase if you think we throw the ball to Jamison in the post and let him work the block, then I wonder if you've ever watched a Wizards game.

"And what exactly do Miller/Foye bring to the table that is different from what you described coming from our Big 3??

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 11:59 AM"

(1) Yes, we do. He often gets posted up to throw his little scoop shots and and awkward releases. Now, Jamison doesn't do it all the time because his game is more versatile and he's not as effective against premier strength defenders (who, incidentally, will make any post player less effective), but he does provide that option.

(2) It's not about what they provide that our big 3 doesn't, it's about what they provide that our other players don't. You're screaming your head off saying we need frontcourt help. Of course we do. But there's no shot in hell this team is going anywhere if Mike James, Javaris Crittenton (unless he makes a quantum leap), or Deshawn Stevenson (unless he miraculously comes back to 2006-2007 form) plays any sort of major role for this squad. Unless, of course, you think they should have planned on playing a post-multiple-surgical Gilbert Arenas and a limited and still raw Nick Young 48 minutes a night for an entire season.

Posted by: psps23 | June 26, 2009 12:21 PM | Report abuse

This may be a distinction without a difference, but I don't see the front office moves through the lens of Abe's willingness to pay.

If I was EG or Abe Pollin, I would definitely look to get the most production out of the money spent (both in terms of wins and ROI). A 19 win season is a disaster. Unmitigated. Money down the drain from Abe to the sponsors to the paying customers.

The paying customers want a competitive team, and I do think that Grunfeld is working towards that. I don't fault Abe for staying under the luxury tax and forcing the team to optimize it's assets. There is no sense in overpaying for mediocrity. This is a franchise that hasn't sniffed 50 wins in decades, and a 31 game improvement has yet to happen in the NBA. (If it turns out to have happened, this oddball bunch isn't the squad to match it)

I am less concerned that the Wizards are stockpiling cash and cap space than that we are stockpiling guards when there are almost no quality big men available in free agency. Which means we could potentially set ourselves up to GET fleeced by someone whe has what we now deperately need.

While I am stunned that Ricky Rubio lasted to the #5, I do realize that there was little chance of him ever suiting up for us.

The question becomes, had we kept the picks, what would we have received for a package of Rubio, Etan, Pech, Mike James or some combination of that?

Posted by: mabkhar | June 26, 2009 12:25 PM | Report abuse

Understand my fellow bloggers frustration with the Wiz not using the draft pick at #32 to pick DeJuan Blair, but let's be realistic about his chances in the NBA:

He's a 6 6" power player with limited offensive skills and a history of knee problems (ACL operations on both knees). I don't see how he would have won many minutes with Blatche and McGee on the roster. A team like San Antonio who has no needs to fill can take a flyer on a guy like Blair since he'll be a 14th or 15th man on their roster. No one picked Blair in the 1st round because they saw all of his potential downside and not too much upside. I doubt Popovich is expecting Blair to make any impact for San Antonio next year.

Now that we've "freed" up $2.5M of cap space, let's see if EG actually uses the money to sign a legit bigman like Paul Milsap or Chris Wilcox to back up AJ and Haywood....the rest of the guys mentioned are marginal players who won't add much to our rotation. If he signs no one, than I'll be on the bandwagon with everyone about Ernie's lousy moves and that Abe is cheap.

Posted by: wizfan89 | June 26, 2009 12:27 PM | Report abuse

"The question becomes, had we kept the picks, what would we have received for a package of Rubio, Etan, Pech, Mike James or some combination of that?"

There's really no reason to think they would have walked away with any better or different deal yesterday than the one they made the day before.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 26, 2009 12:28 PM | Report abuse

Look, Blair is only 6'6 and has two bad knees so passing on him is no big deal. And who cares that he manhandled Thabeet? Thabeet will turn out to be a bust in the NBA too.

However, losing on out Rubio will burn them down the road - but there was no guarantee that he wanted to be here anyway. And who would have thought he would have lasted until pick #5?

Given what he knew, Ernie made the best deal possible for the Wiz. Now his job is to bring in a big body to backup Haywood - and if they can land someone then this could be a top 4 team in the East. And as Orlando proved this year, all you have to do is be hot down the stretch and you can make it to the championship.

Posted by: c_vandagna | June 26, 2009 12:38 PM | Report abuse

I've never understood what grunfeld does. He has a rep based on......? Ya, I'm not sure either. Here he is talking about the draft


http://www.comcastsportsnet.tv/pages/inner_player?vidID=vidcast_10181&feedID=257&startclip=1

Posted by: nattylite88 | June 26, 2009 12:42 PM | Report abuse

There's really no reason to think they would have walked away with any better or different deal yesterday than the one they made the day before.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 26, 2009 12:28 PM

Yes there is. Rubio was widely rated as the #2 prospect and he fell to #5. Reports were saying the Wolves wanted him - perhpas even exploring a way to move up to grab him.

If we'd held onto #5 and waited till draft-time, that would have given us some extra leverage in a trade - we could then guarantee that they would get Rubio.

Ernie even said he didn't want to send Darius to Minny, and would have rather inserted DeShawn.

THere's plenty of reason to believe that if we held onto the pick, we could ahve at least gotten that concession.

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 12:43 PM | Report abuse

I think I'm more upset with the 2nd round pick than with the trade of the 5th pick.

2nd round pick = no guaranteed contract and a pretty reasonable cheap contract (especially considering this team is hovering near luxury tax territory). DeJuan Blair may have medical issues which scared teams away from him in the first round. As a 2nd round pick, he is a steal if it works out. If it doesn't work out, the spurs can cut him no problem. Giving his college production, he will be a decent rebounder at a minimum. But he can potentially be a good rebounder/inside defensive presence that the team really needs.

I highly doubt that $2.5 Million will be used on the team. The problem with this team is that Ernie overpaid for Songalia, Stevenson, Daniels, E.Thomas (matched his deal) etc. That list of big men Mike listed, you think any of them will sign for what Blair signs for? Ernie will do something stupid like give them a multi-year deal with several million/per year guaranteed. I do think they should get a vet big guy on a 1 yr min deal, but they should have also taken Blair. His salary will be less than $1million and not fully guaranteed. If you have a cap of $76 mill, there is no logical explanation for not taking the chance on the guy. Especially if your team has an overload of guards/wing players but if really thin up front.

I like Blatche and McGhee, but they aren't physical guys you need to have inside. They are good athletes but skinny tall guys. Haywood really isn't that much of an enforcer. None of those veteran guys listed are enforcers. This team will get pushed around inside all the time. Which was painfully obvious when Haywood was out most of last year. You have to have some depth.

Yes this was a weak draft, but Ernie badly misplayed both picks by acting too soon.

Posted by: al_kohaulic | June 26, 2009 12:52 PM | Report abuse

With DSong gone, we have no choice but to give minutes to Blatche and Javale. Instead of DSong, I might actually prefer having a Calvin Booth type as our fifth big man to ensure that our young bigs get playing time.

Posted by: yop32 | June 26, 2009 12:53 PM | Report abuse

7snyder7: thank you for being an exception. For a minute I thought there wasn't a single rational Wizards fan, or DC had suddenly become Boston.

Agreed -- knee-jerk reactions are seldom informed, and it's always easier to bash, even when the criticism makes little sense. Why not wait for the other shoe to drop before judging this move. As a fan since the last championship, I am well aware of what the years were like before EG. Too bad so few here have that perspective.

Posted by: RIP-21 | June 26, 2009 12:56 PM | Report abuse

"With DSong gone, we have no choice but to give minutes to Blatche and Javale. Instead of DSong, I might actually prefer having a Calvin Booth type as our fifth big man to ensure that our young bigs get playing time.

Posted by: yop32 | June 26, 2009 12:53 PM"

Both Calvin Booth and Michael Ruffin are free agents this offseason. If you think it is bad now, just wait till Ernie brings back one of these slapdicks.


Posted by: dominic10464 | June 26, 2009 12:57 PM | Report abuse

Don't understand everyone's fascination with Rubio. He's an 18-yr. old unproven European player who would take 3-4 years before he'd make any type of impact. Considering we already have a PG who needs the ball in his hands a lot (Arenas), Rubio would never have been a good fit here. Not to mention that the team that drafted him also picked another PG in Flynn because of all of the legal issues involved with Rubio being able to buy out of his contract. It's very possible Rubio will be playing for his team in Spain for another 1-2 years before he's able to even play in the NBA. It was clear he had no interest in playing for the Wiz.

I don't think the Wiz would have even picked Rubio if they held the No. 5 pick and would have opted for Jordan Hill. IMO, EG at least improved the team for next year by trading the No. 5 for two solid rotation players who will help us right away and possibly in the future (Foye).

Posted by: wizfan89 | June 26, 2009 1:01 PM | Report abuse

couple of things...

first i'm glad to know the wizards people also felt the same way about tyreke evans that I did. I think he will become a great nba player, but I am glad the kings took him 4th, so the wiz had no chance at him anyways, which wont have us regretting trading this draft pick.

that being said, my issue with grunfeld was him making the trade two days before the draft....if the wolves best offer was foye and miller, y not hold out...they aren't going to withdraw their offer....and as the draft approaches closer, thats when teams get even more desperate...now imagine if we had kept the pick, and the draft played out the way it did...i dont want rubio, but they would have gotten plenty of better offers for rubio than they got for the 5th pick....the wolves needed that pick anyways, i think if they held out a little longer, they would have been able to get the 18th pick as well...I think some more patience would have paid greater dividends in this case

Posted by: jasonma1 | June 26, 2009 1:11 PM | Report abuse

Trading draft picks for veterans.. this is similiar to what former Redskins coach George Allen did. Abe may not have much time left to see the Wizards back in championship game.. so I'm guessing that's why Ernie pulled this off. We have too many guards now.. some of them may be traded for a quality back-up in PF/C position. Grunfeld's not done yet, I'm sure.

Posted by: RedCherokee | June 26, 2009 1:12 PM | Report abuse

no jprs, they won't all play 48 mins, but the all avg over 37 mins pg for their careers. so how much is mike gonna do in 12 mins or so he only avg'd 9 pts last yr

Posted by: lilhollywood10

Miller will probably get 25-30 mins a game. The high minutes for the big 3 over the years are due to the absence of any depth. Miller can play 3 positions, so he'll get his minutes. Maybe it'll only be 15 at the 3, but he'll probably pick up minutes at the 2 and the 4 in games too.

Miller's also insurance if Butler or Jamison miss time due to injury. Foye gives the Wiz insurance at the 1 and the 2. I wouldn't be surprised to see Foye and Miller alternating starts at the 2 based on match-ups.

Last year not having a PG killed the Wizards. Crittenton may develop this year, but I still wouldn't trust him as the primary back-up. This year the Wizards have some insurance.

As far as perimeter shooting goes, NY isn't Miller (or Foye). James will probably only see spot minutes in blow-outs. Unless he has a great training camp, he's probably the odd man out.

NY gives the Wizards a guy who can attack the basket off the dribble. He has a good mid-range jumper. But he's not someone who stretches the defense from behind the arc. He can sink the 3 but he's still 35-36 percent from behind the arc. Miller was 38 in an off-year -- he's career 40 percent. The percentage points difference is significant -- especially for someone who takes a lot of shots.

As far as Rubio goes, there's no guarantee that he even plays this year or the next. There's a pretty good chance that Minnesota will have to deal him in order to net any value from the selection.

Of course, none of this speculation really matters. We won't know for sure how this all plays out. On paper though, I like the net that the Wizards got for dealing reserves. The only potential loss is Songaila -- and that's on the margins. On the upside, dealing Songaila gives the Wizards a little extra cap room over the next few seasons.

Posted by: JPRS | June 26, 2009 1:26 PM | Report abuse

Ernie Grunfeld should resign, he can't possibly save face

Posted by: emmet1 | June 26, 2009 1:26 PM | Report abuse

"THere's plenty of reason to believe that if we held onto the pick, we could have at least gotten that concession."

No, there really isn't. You're scenario proposes that the Wiz would hold all the leverage in that scenario. They didn't. They wanted to move the pick and get some veteran help just as much, if not more, than the Wolves wanted Rubio. Add to that the still existing possibility that Rubio may not even come over to the NBA next season because of the buyout issues and the fact that his agent said publicly that he thought Rubio was a bad fit with Arenas, and the idea that the Wiz were operating from a position of great strength goes out the window. Grunfeld had what he thought was a very good deal on the table. Passing on it in hopes of a better one could have left him sitting at the table holding his cards while the pot was being divvied up around him.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 26, 2009 1:27 PM | Report abuse

(1) Yes, we do. He often gets posted up to throw his little scoop shots and and awkward releases. Now, Jamison doesn't do it all the time because his game is more versatile and he's not as effective against premier strength defenders (who, incidentally, will make any post player less effective), but he does provide that option.

(2) It's not about what they provide that our big 3 doesn't, it's about what they provide that our other players don't. You're screaming your head off saying we need frontcourt help. Of course we do. But there's no shot in hell this team is going anywhere if Mike James, Javaris Crittenton (unless he makes a quantum leap), or Deshawn Stevenson (unless he miraculously comes back to 2006-2007 form) plays any sort of major role for this squad. Unless, of course, you think they should have planned on playing a post-multiple-surgical Gilbert Arenas and a limited and still raw Nick Young 48 minutes a night for an entire season.

Posted by: psps23 | June 26, 2009 12:21 PM

(1) We'll agree to disagree on whether Jamison's runners and what-not constitutes "low-post" scoring. Bottom line is that you don't put him out on the floor to work the post. That's not what gets him minutes. You put him out there to create mismatches ON THE PERIMETER and b/c he can shot 3s.

(2) Crit is a ball-handler who gives us perimeter D, and he's still developing. That sounds like a great complement to what we already have in Gilbert, Caron and AJ. Nick Young is a talented perimeter scorer who is still developing and can come off the bench.

Why is it such negative for Crit and Young to "still be developing", but people say that about Randy Foye like it's such a great positive?

People saw our backcourt last year without Gil and it wasn't pretty. Fine. But you know what? The Wolves backcourt SUCKED last year too. It's not like Foye/Miller did anything spectacular there. THey also lost tons of games and missed the playoffs. Bottom line - unless we've Chris Paul coming off the bench, our backcourt is going to SUCK if our best player goes down.

Now it's about opportunity cost. We have needed and still need frontcourt help. We've needed this for years. Our need for an extra 3-point shooter and our need for someone to spell GA has to be much farther down the list than our need to bolster the 4-5. We took our #5 pick and parlayed it into a move that simply does not address our key area of need - in fact it weakened it when you consider that DSong was our best frontcourt depth guy. I fell like we lost an opportunity.

So I'm pissed. I'm not popping champagne and singing Ernie's praises because I'm waiting for something to happen that is actually going to address this team's PRIMARY area of need to make it competitive. I'm just not going to oogle over our logjam of redundant talent at the 2 and the 3, when we have one of the thinnest/weakest 4-5 rotations in the entire NBA.

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 1:27 PM | Report abuse

Who gave Etan and Pech the bad contracts in the 1st place? Who signed Darius? So we should have patience with Ernie why exactly? He gave away our 5th pick to erase the mistakes he made in the 1st place. He did not even have the patience to wait until draft night to squeeze extra out of the twolves. They would not have backed out of the deal as they wanted Rubio badly. Who decided we needed Deshawn more than we needed Roger Mason? This is the same guy who underminded Eddie Jordan while he was here. Screw Ernie & Abe. League wide they know we need big men and no one will give us one cheaply we will end up having to mortgage the future to get one. Why are we all mad we have seen this same movie many times.

Posted by: anacostia85 | June 26, 2009 1:29 PM | Report abuse

"THere's plenty of reason to believe that if we held onto the pick, we could have at least gotten that concession."

No, there really isn't. You're scenario proposes that the Wiz would hold all the leverage in that scenario. They didn't. They wanted to move the pick and get some veteran help just as much, if not more, than the Wolves wanted Rubio. Add to that the still existing possibility that Rubio may not even come over to the NBA next season because of the buyout issues and the fact that his agent said publicly that he thought Rubio was a bad fit with Arenas, and the idea that the Wiz were operating from a position of great strength goes out the window. Grunfeld had what he thought was a very good deal on the table. Passing on it in hopes of a better one could have left him sitting at the table holding his cards while the pot was being divvied up around him.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 26, 2009 1:27 PM


Yes. THere really is. The Wolves wanted Rubio. The Wolves picked Rubio. The Wolves had even been talking about moving up to get Rubio.

On Wednesday we made a deal with them and could not guarantee them what they wanted - Rubio. On Thurday we could have made a deal with them and guarantee them what they wanted - Rubio. That gives us leverage plain and simple. It sweetens the deal for them, and we can get a concession in return.

It's not hard to see that, why do keep stubbornly denying it...

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 1:35 PM | Report abuse

Abe Pollin sucks!! So how long has Ted had to endure losing money on the capitols with the promise that Pollin would sell him the wizards??? That what Abe does, tells you one thing and does another. Ask Air Jordan would he had played here instead on Chicago, LA, New York or Miami if he had known Pollin wouldn't stick to his word...... 82 Sell outs and get out the door.......

Posted by: punchdaclock | June 26, 2009 1:35 PM | Report abuse

#1, why is people saying Arenas injury-prone? He had an injury that was poorly rehabilitated. Injury prone people injure their leg 1 year, their ankle the next, an arm, the back later, etc. As far as I'm concerned, the knee injury is behind him. That does not mean it is as good as new. Caron is more injury prone than Gilbert. Antawn is not injury prone. Neither is Haywood.

#2 How will defenses defend the wiz? Double Gil and leave who open? Man-up and single Gil, Caron, Antawn? Pick your poison. Which brings me to the bench. When things are on the line and your vets are actually playing for something meaningful, the puppies will not play like kids at an amusement park. Blatche, JaVale, Nick, combined with Foye or Miller, whichever is not starting, thrown in Javaris and McGuire and the bench will when more battles against other benches extending leads or decreasing deficits.

Yes we need another big man, but everybody has a big-man off the tail end of the bench that does not play. How many bigs really played for Orlando? Howard and Gortat. Who else? For the Lakers, who backed up Bynum and Gasol? I don't even remember. Who backs up Garnett and Kendrick Perkins up in Boston? Leon Powe and Big Baby? They are ok, but they don't scare nobody. JaVale and Blatche matchup with them. Big Baby looked good in the playoffs, while Boston was playing for something. Blatche can step up too. Will he? Good question.

I just think that teams will not be able to keep up with the Wiz offensively.

Yes, the defense is lacking. We do have 4 shotblockers to protect the paint in Haywood, McGee, Blatche, and McGuire so it aint like it will be layup city for teams.

The pressure will on other teams not to miss. Like the Patriots in football, you'd better score touchdowns cause field goals aint gonna help you keep up. The 49ers under Montana/Young were like that too.

Posted by: G-Man11 | June 26, 2009 1:37 PM | Report abuse

The bloggers here have a fascination with names that have been in the news.

1/2 of the bloggers want Amare (detatched eyball) and Blair (no ACL in his knees). The other 1/2 complain that our team is injury prone. Some folks complain about injury prone players AND want Amare & Blair.

I am happy that Ernie is the GM. Especially in contrast to the buffoons in Golden State, Minnesota, and the Clippers.

Posted by: cballer | June 26, 2009 1:38 PM | Report abuse

passing on blair to sell the pick is pretty sad

Posted by: bford1kb | June 26, 2009 1:42 PM | Report abuse

I just think that teams will not be able to keep up with the Wiz offensively.

Yes, the defense is lacking. We do have 4 shotblockers to protect the paint in Haywood, McGee, Blatche, and McGuire so it aint like it will be layup city for teams.

The pressure will on other teams not to miss. Like the Patriots in football, you'd better score touchdowns cause field goals aint gonna help you keep up. The 49ers under Montana/Young were like that too.

Posted by: G-Man11 | June 26, 2009 1:37 PM

For whom exactly has the run-and-gun permieter philosphy worked well for in the NBA to deliver a championship? It didn't work for Ernie's Bucks, it didn't work for the Suns, it hasn't worked for Cleveland. And I'd say all those teams have more talent on the perimeter than we do.

And if you don't think Washington is lay-up city, you haven't been watching the team lately.

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 1:44 PM | Report abuse

Thank God everyone drank their kool aid this moring and we are all back under the control of Abe, Ernie and kal.

I love a team that strives to be mediocre? Yes, Irene we shouldn't complain and "Enjoy what you have, you miserable crybabies." we should be satisfied by watching this team make the playoffs with no chance at winning a title again.

Does anyone understand Orlando and Clev got better for two reasons.

1st they made moves to get them over the top

2nd they both were in the playoffs last year

How can anyone think the Wizards are ready to take the next step?

Gil hasn't played in two years so he's not going to come back and be in playing condition not to mention BTH how is no Howard when it comes to being in shape.

Does anyone remember when the "Small 3" were healthy they couldn't get by Clev then?

This is soooooooo sad it's no wonder the country is in the shape it's in since let's all just sit back and never complain about anything. If we listened to Irene back then we would all be drinking warm beer and sipping tea. On the bright side there wouldn't be an NBA so we would have nothing to voice our opinions abouts.

I thought thats what being a fan was all about!

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 26, 2009 1:46 PM | Report abuse

I think the recent experience with Juan Carlos Navarro hits home with Rubio.

Navarro lit up the Spanish League and supposedly matured after being a #2 pick by the Wizards.

But he stayed in Spain for years under a big contract that he was only able to work his way out of at age 29.

What did the Wizards really get for him when they turned around and traded his rights?

Rubio is younger and has perhaps a bigger upside, but like Navarro he wasn't exactly eager to come to Washington after he was drafted.

Who needs the hassle of a #5 pick that you invest part of your present and future in that spurns you to stay in Europe for another 2-3 years and then comes over?

In 2012 the Wizards will have a different team and most probably a different coach.

Rubio at that point may or may not fit in.

The point, though, is that he was not ready to come to the NBA in 2009 and be a factor.

And on a team with 28-30 year old players the Wizards aren't thinking about what MIGHT be in 2011 or 2012.

Nor should they after committing all that money to Arenas and Jamison.

I agree with the trade.

Now, with the added draft the team needs to acquire a veteran power forward that can assist on the boards.

Posted by: leopard09 | June 26, 2009 1:48 PM | Report abuse

and maybe if the organization played the young guys we would have faith in AB and JM on the front line this year.

Considering the team didn't even have enough faith in them (to play them any meaningful minutes last year) why should we believe they are ready to step up now?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 26, 2009 1:50 PM | Report abuse

vince carter will kill the magic

Posted by: bford1kb | June 26, 2009 1:53 PM | Report abuse

Reading these comments are making me laugh more than I did watching The Hangover. You people have ABSOLUTELY no idea what you are talking about when you attack Ernie Grunfeld. The man has assembled a team with 50+ win potential from the depths of hell--a team that was perennially stuck in the 25-30 win stature for years and years.

It's simply pathetic how those who quite literally became Wizards fan in large part thanks to the moves that this GM has made in the last 6 years are now the same people calling him a "joke."

If you think Ernie Grunfeld is a joke, you are rooting for the wrong team.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 26, 2009 1:54 PM | Report abuse

How is it that everyone is talking about Blair's knees? No one mentioned his knees when he was grabbing 12 rebounds a game, 6 of which were on the offensive glass. he was a First Team All American in one of the toughest conferences in basketball. He was tied for second as the AP College basketball player of the year and he's not worth a shot?

It was a non guaranteed SECOND ROUND PICK, people. If Abe didn't want to pay, we could've let him go. It was worth the risk.
My guess is that EG had already traded the pick (not expecting him to drop this far) and was just waiting for Houston to tell him who they wanted. He might have had a 'oh sh*t' moment when he saw what he could have had.
Similar to the 'oh sh*t' moment he had when he saw Rubio drop.

As I predicted, Rubio dropped to us. No way we keep him but the hype was so huge that we could have traded him and gotten more than Miller and Foye. You think the Knicks and D'Antoni would have liked to see him in a Knicks uni running that system?
We could've probably gotten David Lee, Larry Hughes and their #8 (Hill) for our garbage and Rubio. They probably would have even thrown in some cash. I know LH is almost done but he's a stopgap and still an upgrade over our present 2 guards.

I'm ok with what we did this offseason so far but I just feel like we could have done better.

Posted by: original_mark | June 26, 2009 1:55 PM | Report abuse

Those attacking Ernie Grunfeld and calling him a joke are some of the very same people who thought the Wizards should tank games to get a high draft pick. Look how that turned out people.

If and when Ernie trades Mike James and one of our other guards for a veteran big man, this off season will go down as one of the greatest in Wizards history. It's beyond comical how few Wizards fans actually realize this.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 26, 2009 1:56 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: G-Man11 | June 26, 2009 1:37 PM

"How will defenses defend the wiz? Double Gil and leave who open? Man-up and single Gil, Caron, Antawn? Pick your poison. Which brings me to the bench. When things are on the line and your vets are actually playing for something meaningful, the puppies will [step up].

Yes we need another big man, but everybody has a big-man off the tail end of the bench that does not play. . . "

Thanks, G-Man, for some good new points worth repeating. All these hissy fitters and chicken littles seem to have lost their heads. The Wiz are going to be trouble for opposing teams.


Posted by: 7snider7 | June 26, 2009 2:00 PM | Report abuse

Would some self-respecting journalist please ask Grunfeld what his plan is re Foye and Miller at the end of the year? Isn't it true that there's no money to re-sign either one? And please demand that he answer those questions, because the fans have a right to know whether this trade was simply an acquisition of two one-year rentals. If so, should Grunfeld be fired for giving away Rubio for one-year rental players?

Posted by: BulletsFan1 | June 26, 2009 2:08 PM | Report abuse

Teams can't win a title with 3 vets and some rookies?

Wait Boston did it with rondo and perkins?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 26, 2009 2:09 PM | Report abuse

"It's not hard to see that, why do keep stubbornly denying it..."

Because, as usual, you have no idea what you were talking about. Leverage can move both ways. The leverage Rubio and his agent had opver the Wiz (the threat of staying overseas and leaving them with nothing) dwarfed whatever leverage you think the Wiz had over the Wolves. Yes the Wiz had something the Wolves wanted. But the Wolves also had something the Wiz wanted. There's no obvious, automatic formula that says one greatly outweighed the other. But when you account for the additional leverage that Rubio and his agent had over Grunfeld, if anything it tilted against the Wiz. Grunfeld had a deal on the table that got him what he wanted and basically negated any attempt by Rubio's agent to seize the reins in determining Rubio's destination.

It's not hard to see that, why do keep stubbornly denying it? Oh wait. Because you're you.

My bad.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 26, 2009 2:11 PM | Report abuse

Y'know, the key to the improvement of this team - other than the obvious return of injuries from the key players - will be the development of Blatche and McGuire and to a lesser extent Young and McGee.

Whoever they drafted wouldn't be much of a contribution this year or probably much of next.

For me, Rubio more closely resembles a possible Steve Nash than a Maravich. If he become a superstar, it'll be because of his passing and playmaking and nothing else.

The trade was the smart thing to do consider the makeup of this team.

Posted by: SteveMG | June 26, 2009 2:11 PM | Report abuse

"Teams can't win a title with 3 vets and some rookies?

"Wait Boston did it with rondo and perkins?"

Neither of whom was a rookie when the Celtics won the title. The only rookie in the Celtics regular rotation on the title team was Glen Davis, who played a very minor role.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 26, 2009 2:14 PM | Report abuse

Would some self-respecting journalist please ask Grunfeld what his plan is re Foye and Miller at the end of the year?

Posted by: BulletsFan1 | June 26, 2009 2:08 PM

Woodward and Bernstein must laugh at the reporting going on at the post? Mike,if you were the reporter investigating the watergate story you would have said there is nothing going on at the white house and the watergate breakin was okay since it will help get Nixon re-elected?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 26, 2009 9:38 AM

Good luck finding a self-respecting journalist in this city and they wonder why newspapers all over the country are going out of business?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 26, 2009 2:15 PM | Report abuse

Neither of whom was a rookie when the Celtics won the title. The only rookie in the Celtics regular rotation on the title team was Glen Davis, who played a very minor role.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 26, 2009 2:14 PM

Ab, NY and Critt aren't rookies?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 26, 2009 2:16 PM | Report abuse

"Why is it such negative for Crit and Young to "still be developing", but people say that about Randy Foye like it's such a great positive?"

Because, whether or not you want to admit it, Foye is much further along in his development. Nick Young struggled to get consistent time on a 19-win team that, for one reason or another, lost it's 4 most minute-heavy guards from the previous two seasons (Arenas, Stevenson, Daniels, and Mason). Same with Crittenton, who additionally failed to even crack the Memphis lineup. Foye, while hardly leading his team to anything great, was at least being relied upon as a top 2 option to carry their team. He already has played a major role for an NBA team, and while he wasn't great in that specific role, he has definitely benefited from it. Neither Young nor Crit can say that. Young and Crit would have had to significantly increase their burden should they have been asked to step in the Wizards' voided role. Foye actually decreases his burden from last year to step in there.

And besides, nobody is listing Young's or Crit's development as a negative. We're purely saying they weren't ready for the role they would have been relied on to play had nothing been done about the backcourt depth.

Posted by: psps23 | June 26, 2009 2:17 PM | Report abuse

Juwan Howard is available!

Posted by: frankjomama | June 26, 2009 2:18 PM | Report abuse

The difference is Boston has an owner who wanted to win a championship and gave DA the green light to make trades that brought in the right talent to win one!

Something your organization isn't willing to do!

Kal show us the memo from Cheap ABE (or did you shred it) that told Ernie he couldn't hold on to draft picks, since we are going to be over the cap?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 26, 2009 2:21 PM | Report abuse

Foye is much further along in his development then Critt or NY because he was allowed to play through his mistakes.

We had ETaps as our head coach which stumped the growth of our young players worse than smoking cigs!

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 26, 2009 2:24 PM | Report abuse

Well said, psps23.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 26, 2009 2:25 PM | Report abuse

Now we need to trade Stevenson and James, and get unrestricted free agents Drew Gooden or Anderson Verajao.

Posted by: liveride | June 26, 2009 2:25 PM | Report abuse

The Wizards are stocked with undersized guards, and Rubio would be just another one in the mix. I have no idea if he’s going to be all that in the NBA, but I know that with Miller we got a former ROY and 9 year vet with size that’s one of the best 3 pt shooters in the league.

We also got a 3 year vet in Foye who’s increased his scoring average by 3 pts every year in the league and is now averaging 16.3 pts/4.3 assists and about 35 mins a game. His 3rd year stats stack up against Gilbert pretty well. Gilbert was a second year player on the worst team in the league averaging 18 pts/6 assists when Ernie got him. In his third year (with the Wiz), Gilbert averaged 19.6/5, and everyone thought he walked on water. If Foye gives us the same production he gave Minn last year, everyone will think Ernie’s a genius. Rubio, by contrast, has never averaged more than 10 pts per game as a professional, and has never played more than an average of 22 mins per game. The NBA season is a grind, and he’s not ready for it this year.

The Wiz got $2.5 mil for selling the second round pick. Trust me. They are stockpiling guards and/or money for a trade and free agent pickup to address their front court needs. Sheed and McDyess will be available after July 1st. There are also quality backup big men like Drew Gooden, Christ Wilcox, Zaza Pachulia that will be on the market. Flip has coached Sheed and likes him – he uses Sheed’s “Ball don’t lie” line all the time.

Posted by: Kenbeatrizz | June 26, 2009 2:28 PM | Report abuse

Might not take much to pry this guy from the Raps. $5 million over 3 years could do it.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=3053

Posted by: elfreako | June 26, 2009 2:34 PM | Report abuse

Would some self-respecting journalist please ask Grunfeld what his plan is re Foye and Miller at the end of the year? Isn't it true that there's no money to re-sign either one? And please demand that he answer those questions, because the fans have a right to know whether this trade was simply an acquisition of two one-year rentals. If so, should Grunfeld be fired for giving away Rubio for one-year rental players?

Posted by: BulletsFan1 | June 26, 2009 2:08 PM

Dude, what are you 5 years old? You always have the most retarded comments on here. NO, IT IS NOT "TRUE THAT THERE IS NO MONEY TO RE-SIGN EITHER ONE." You seriously have no comprehension of the Wizards salary cap situation nor how the NBA works.

Please go away.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 26, 2009 2:36 PM | Report abuse

You can add Fabricio Oberto to that list. He's a tough player and could definitely help us. I’m surprised SA traded him but understand their need for more scoring punch. We have scoring and need Defense and Toughness. So, Drew Gooden, Anderson Verajao, or Fabricio Oberto would work best for what we need, especially if we can trade James and Stevenson in the process.

Posted by: liveride | June 26, 2009 2:39 PM | Report abuse

Wah,Wah,Wha,

Good heavens, it appears no player,no GM, no owner, can do enough to please the people on this board. I am beginning to wonder if all of these crazy a ideas are from rival poster because I find it hard to believe that "supposed" fans of a team can be so damn negative. Give it a rest already, we have what we have and I am ready to roll with it. GO WIZ!! Shake off the doubters and haters!

RIP MJ

Posted by: ivyleague | June 26, 2009 2:41 PM | Report abuse

I slightly disagree about one thing you wrote, psps23. I personally believe that Critt's experience toward the end of the year qualifies him to be a decent backup at the point position. Coupled with the fact that all of the players will be learning a new system, I think Foye and Critt may be close to even in terms of their ability to run THIS team. I'd even give Critt the nod because he at least knows where certain guys like the ball.

Posted by: original_mark | June 26, 2009 2:42 PM | Report abuse

Trust me. They are stockpiling guards and/or money for a trade and free agent pickup to address their front court needs.

Posted by: Kenbeatrizz

I guess the 20 rookies 6-6 or shorter picked in the first round (14 more in the 2nd round) weren't enough for the guard-starved GMs out there.

Hey, who do we have in the D-League anyway?

Posted by: mabkhar | June 26, 2009 2:45 PM | Report abuse

"Might not take much to pry this guy from the Raps. $5 million over 3 years could do it."

A bag of M&Ms and a free T-shirt should do it.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 26, 2009 2:47 PM | Report abuse

Wah,Wah,Wha,

Good heavens, it appears no player,no GM, no owner, can do enough to please the people on this board. I am beginning to wonder if all of these crazy a ideas are from rival poster because I find it hard to believe that "supposed" fans of a team can be so damn negative. Give it a rest already, we have what we have and I am ready to roll with it. GO WIZ!! Shake off the doubters and haters!

RIP MJ

Posted by: ivyleague | June 26, 2009 2:41 PM

AMEN AMEN AMEN AMEN AMEN AMEN AMEN AMEN

Not to mention, what we "have" is a LOT.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 26, 2009 2:48 PM | Report abuse

"It's not hard to see that, why do keep stubbornly denying it..."

Because, as usual, you have no idea what you were talking about. Leverage can move both ways. The leverage Rubio and his agent had opver the Wiz (the threat of staying overseas and leaving them with nothing) dwarfed whatever leverage you think the Wiz had over the Wolves. Yes the Wiz had something the Wolves wanted. But the Wolves also had something the Wiz wanted. There's no obvious, automatic formula that says one greatly outweighed the other. But when you account for the additional leverage that Rubio and his agent had over Grunfeld, if anything it tilted against the Wiz. Grunfeld had a deal on the table that got him what he wanted and basically negated any attempt by Rubio's agent to seize the reins in determining Rubio's destination.

It's not hard to see that, why do keep stubbornly denying it? Oh wait. Because you're you.

My bad.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 26, 2009 2:11 PM

Kal,

You were saying that there is NO reason to think the Wiz could have made a better deal on Thursday than on Wed.

The simple fact that on the Thursday, the Wiz would have actually had the very player that the Wolves wanted is a reason to think we could have been in a better position to make the deal.

How would it have actually played out?? Who knows?? Not me.

But there is a simple logic involved:

When you actually have the thing that the other guys wants, you are in a better position to deal than if you did not have the thing that the other guys wants.

That, very simply, is a reason to believe we might have gotten a better deal.

Do you disagree that this is at least ONE reason to think dealing on Thrusday would have been better than dealing on Wed?

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 2:48 PM | Report abuse

"Flip has coached Sheed and likes him"

Seriously, do people pay absolutely no attention to the NBA outside of Washington?

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 26, 2009 2:49 PM | Report abuse

Good link elFreako, POPS Mensah-Bonsu would be a great addition for tough Defense and Rebounds (albeit with no offense). More importantly, he excels at Offensive Rebounds which translates into more possessions and Shots.

Posted by: liveride | June 26, 2009 2:50 PM | Report abuse

I love this trade. Here’s why: it dramatically changes the 3 point disparity of last year. As every Wiz fans knows, the team last year was buried under a barrage of 3 pointers. They couldn’t make a 3, couldn’t defend against it.

The statistics tell the sad story. Wiz were the 2nd worst 3 pt shooting team in the league, and the 2nd worst team defending the 3. During the season, opponents hit 279 more 3’s than the Wiz (that’s 3.4 more threes per game, which averages out to about 10 pts per game.) AJ was the only Wiz player to average more than 1 three a game last year (he had 112 – 1 more than Randy Foye).

The players whose minutes these new guys will be eating up (Mike James, Deshawn, Crit, Juan Dixon) made a total of 128 threes last year. Foye, Miller, and a healthy Gilbert should make 400+ threes next year. That’s more than enough to wipe out last year’s deficit without improving 3 pt defense at all.

Posted by: buddhahat | June 26, 2009 2:53 PM | Report abuse

People, Abe is dying. He probably has no more than a couple of years left to try and see another championship run by his team. He has no use for developing youths with potentials, so I am not surprised by the draft results. However, I am surprised that he has not given the OK to land a big impact forward or center and go over the luxury tax just like Cleveland did last year in order to make that "last" run. Ernie, please make that man happy while he is still alive!

Posted by: JohnWWW | June 26, 2009 2:53 PM | Report abuse

can anyone tell me why david lee isn't on our radar? is he too expensive? i feel like he would perfectly fill the role we need...he'd actually be able to give us big minutes and instantly make up deep at forward as well

Posted by: akdeac31 | June 26, 2009 2:54 PM | Report abuse

"You were saying that there is NO reason to think the Wiz could have made a better deal on Thursday than on Wed."

Wrong again. Of course they COULD have made a better deal. What I said was:

"There's really no reason to think they would have walked away with any better or different deal yesterday than the one they made the day before."

"Would" not "could." Crucial difference.

Is it possible they could have gotten a better deal? Of course. it's also possible they would have ended up with the same deal. Or a worse deal. or no deal at all.

Your argument has been that there was a better deal that they missed out on by not waiting. My point is that there is absolutely no way to know that. They had a good deal in front of them and took it. Everything else is pure, unsupportable speculation. There's is no way of knowing, predicting, or guaranteeing that there would have been a better one if they waited. Absolutely none.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 26, 2009 2:55 PM | Report abuse

All right 'ZARDS fans here is the solution for us...

Trade AJ for Big Z straight up (the $$$ works for this year) then deal Haywood and Mike James for Tyson Chandler. (both contracts are up next year what N.O. wants) Next sign Turkaglu for say 5 years-$50 million and use MLE for Wilcox...

Starting five of...
C - Tyson Chandler $11 mil
F - Hedo $10 mil
F - Tuff Juice $10 mil
G - Foye $4.5 mil
G - Gil $16.5

Bench...
C - Big Z/McGee - $13 mil
F - Wilcox/Blatche -$7 mil
F - Miller - $9 mil
G - Young - $2 mil
G - Crit - $1.5 mil

You have 3 point shooters (Foye, Hedo) mid-range shooters (Hedo, Gil, Caron) 2 guys who can get theirs anytime they want (Hedo, Gil) and a defensive presence and rebounder in Chandler... PLUS firepower off of the bench...Miller, Big Z! This team as constructed gives them enuff to compete in 2010 However...

In 2011 Big Z., Miller, come off the books ($20 million) BUT you have a nucleus of Gil, Hedo, Caron (in a contract year) and Chandler (ditto). This team is much better than the version of the Magic that made it to the Finals this year... PIPE DREAM cause this'll never happen because this is the NO BA**S ASSOCIATION...

Any thoughts?

Posted by: samisunc | June 26, 2009 2:58 PM | Report abuse

How about Pat Ewing Jr. ? He's probably available, he tested great at the workout and he's hungry for a shot. Problem is, at 6'6" and 224, he may be too small. Give him a shot, though.

Posted by: original_mark | June 26, 2009 3:01 PM | Report abuse

Camby please. I'd be happy with Chris Wilcox also. All we need is a veteran guy who can come in to back up Haywood occasionally. Camby would be perfect because he can help McGee learn. EG still has a number of "assets" in his bag of tricks and has STOLEN Foye to give us an upgrade at the 2. He's also gotten us a rental shooter who comes off the books when we need to resign/replace Haywood.

Seriously..
Arenas, Foye, Butler, Jamison, Haywood

That's the most talented starting lineup in the east except Orlando. Having Miller on the bench at as 6th man is about all we could hope for. Having Critt as Arenas insurance.. what are you idiots complaining about?

Had we drafted Rubio we'd still have Stevenson as a starter, Nick Young as the primary scoring option coming of the bench and a disaster scenario of a foreign player deciding to play in Europe.

Posted by: jon_quest | June 26, 2009 3:02 PM | Report abuse

Your argument has been that there was a better deal that they missed out on by not waiting. My point is that there is absolutely no way to know that. They had a good deal in front of them and took it. Everything else is pure, unsupportable speculation. There's is no way of knowing, predicting, or guaranteeing that there would have been a better one if they waited. Absolutely none.


Posted by: kalo_rama | June 26, 2009 2:55 PM

No Kal, my argument has been that by waiting until draft-day, Ernie WOULD have been in a better position to deal.

When you have the thing the other guy wants, you ARE in a better position to deal.

What would the outcome of those deals been, who knows?? But our bargaining position WOULD have been better.

Since you are a big fan of the difference between the words "WOULD" and "COULD", you might want to pay as careful attention to the statements of other posters as you do to your own, because here's what I said before:

""There's plenty of reason to believe that if we held onto the pick, we could have at least gotten that concession.""

Do you disagree?

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 3:09 PM | Report abuse

DeJuan Blair, is a developmental player with (count 'em) two bum wheels.

The Wiz are paying lux tax this year. $2.5M goes a long way toward making that a workable situation bottom-line wise. While also giving EG a little more leeway to go out and get a good big.

One nice trade (fingers crossed for camby or chandler, david lee wouldn't be a bad pickup) and one MLE (look at Mike's list, and we're set (and probably even further into lux tax land.

Who will be the trade partner? NO needs bench scoring (Nick Young). NY needs cap room (MJames) and an uptempo 2nd point guard (JCritt). The Clippers have a glut of big men.

Win now mode is the reality, with Abe on his last legs. Best believe he's loosened the reigns on EG (evidenced by the fact that we're already gonna pay lux tax). How does DeJuan Blair fit into that? ESPECIALLY with your only frontcourt depth at present being two developmental bigs... Yeah we could really use another one...

And what currently available FA is Blair better than over the next 2 years? Which of our developmental bigs is he gonna squeeze out for PT?

Perspective, people. If we were retooling (i.e. staying in the draft), then the cry would be 'why aren't we capitalizing on the current window of opportunity by bringing in provven vets?'

Oh, and I'm glad the jew stuff is over. that was really ugly. If it were my blog, a few members would've been banned this morning.

Posted by: jones-y | June 26, 2009 3:13 PM | Report abuse

sigh....okay calm down everybody. I have posted this kind of comment several times now, so I might as well do it again. With regard to selling the pick for 2.5 million = good move (assuming of course you use it to help get a decent big man for back-up). Look Blair probably would have been a nice steal, just like Rubio would have been. But can we wait and see them develop? NO, the window is closing and there is no room on the roster for guys trying to figure out there game (unless McGee really is the only player we have left to back-up Haywood). Oh, if Abe and Ernie do nothing with that cash then you guys have a right to whine. But the offseason isn't over yet. Far from it with free agency and trades still abound. So shut up and keep your cool and see how things pan out. Remember we are trying to win this season, not in three years when Jamison is too old, Gil cannot recover from injury anymore (knock on wood) and Butler wants to get the hell out.

Oh yeah, while i'm at it...
Stop trying to trade Jamison just because he is a PF but not a big man. 20 9 people.
Stop going after every flashy name out there. The starting rotation is set save shooting guard. We don't need Amare, or Bosh, or whatever other ridiculous trade idea you can come up with. We need solid back-ups to support Jamison and Haywood. Wilcox sounds like a real possibility, though he's another guy who kinda lacks D.

Yes, I agree we are not over the top and still need that big man presence off the bench. At least we now have a starting SG and a guy who can score off the bench, two components we were missing from before. Of course, this is all barring injury, which unfortunately has been a big problem with this team, but there is no control over that factor.

Posted by: mcgratsp | June 26, 2009 3:15 PM | Report abuse

What has Ernie ever done in the NBA? He got lucky with Michael Redd. Van Gundy got the Knicks to over achieve in a strike shortened season. I mean really, why does this guy have a rep for being a good GM?

Posted by: sjp879 | June 26, 2009 3:15 PM | Report abuse

"I slightly disagree about one thing you wrote, psps23. I personally believe that Critt's experience toward the end of the year qualifies him to be a decent backup at the point position.

Posted by: original_mark"

That's an optimistic view, o_mark. I like Crit's potential a lot, but seeing as how he was playing the role of backup PG last season, and we were awful as a team, I'm not ready to say he's a qualified decent backup option for what we hope is a contending team.

If he turns out that way, great. If not, we know we have another good option.

Posted by: psps23 | June 26, 2009 3:15 PM | Report abuse

Ernie Grunfeld should resign, he can't possibly save face

Posted by: emmet1 | June 26, 2009 1:26 PM

How about if you, bulletsfan78 and all the other haters agree to apologize to Abe and Ernie and quit posting your vitriol if the Wizards win 50+ or make it to the conference finals.

Posted by: Blurred | June 26, 2009 3:19 PM | Report abuse

As I said last night - even the Lakers are scared of the luxury tax (Buss always has been) not this year but in 2010-11.

They won the championship but u can't say they weren't passed by the Spurs again last night & maybe even Cleveland & a healthy Boston again.

So why were they sellers last night just like the Wiz & a bunch of other teams for cash & future picks.
But there is a reason. Economic Armageddon.


The economy & ratings were down this past year.
Twelve teams received loans from the league this spring.

& the commish said that revenues could be down as much as 10%!

http://www.nola.com/sports/t-p/index.ssf?/base/sports-43/124417987474800.xml&coll=1

& as ESPN Holliger wrote in another article:
"
I'm not sure everyone completely appreciates the nuances of the salary cap, so let me make certain everyone understands this: If revenues decline by 10 percent in 2009-10, as commissioner David Stern seemed to suggest in his press conference Thursday night, it will be total financial Armageddon for the league's teams because of the "claw-back" provisions in the salary cap.

The commissioner phrased it like it wasn't a big deal; in reality, this couldn't possibly be a bigger deal. Each year's salary cap is a guesstimate built off the previous year's numbers. If it turns out they were wrong, they "claw back" the amount they were off, in addition to whatever adjustment is built into the cap for the coming year.

The cap normally assumes growth of about 4.5 percent, so if revenue actually dropped 10 percent instead, the claw-back provision would be 14.5 percent, slashing about $10 million off the salary cap and luxury-tax levels.One source I talked to said even a 5 percent drop in revenues would push the luxury-tax level to slightly above $60 million, which would in turn put the majority of the league's teams over the tax line in 2010-11 unless they made some serious adjustments to their payroll. It would also dramatically reduce the projected cap space for teams hoping to get in on the bidding for prospective free agents like LeBron James, Chris Bosh and Amare Stoudemire.

That same source pointed out to me that teams doing it on the cheap -- let's say Memphis -- would benefit even more in such an environment. The way the luxury tax works is that money from teams over the tax is split among the teams under the tax. If there are more teams over and fewer teams under, the pot of riches from being under expands significantly. The lesson: Don't be surprised if the Clippers and Grizzlies spawn a few imitators in the coming months."

If you understand any modicum of economic theory, you will understand why the Wiz & Lakers played the same off-season hand last night.


of course dim wits like slimjob or was it dumbo discounted it without even knowing the facts.

Posted by: Rocc00 | June 26, 2009 3:24 PM | Report abuse

samisunc,

There is no way that EG blows up the team at this stage by trading Jamison. Chemistry and timing don't happen overnight. The Wiz can throw a couple new guys into the mix, but rebuilding the entire foundation only makes sense if a team is rebuilding.

Miller and Turkoglu are a wash -- same player on the offensive side of the court with an edge to Turkoglu on the defensive end. Also, I think you're under-rating Haywood. Haywood is a more complete player than Chandler. Chandler has the rebounding edge, but Haywood is a better all-around player at this stage in his career. Fewer health concerns too.

Big Z is on the down-slope in his career. He got manhandled by Howard in the Finals. Plus he's got that $11 mill + player option next year. I'm sure that Cleveland would love to trade Big Z straight-up for Jamison. Fortunately, there's no way that EG makes that deal.

At this point the only thing that the Wizards really can -- and should try to do is find some veteran support in the front court.

Posted by: JPRS | June 26, 2009 3:29 PM | Report abuse

"Buckaroo Bonzai", that was a good movie..

Posted by: frak | June 26, 2009 3:30 PM | Report abuse

what if all this maneuvering allowed us to sign Bosh next year? If Foye & Miller are rentals for this year... that is $12 million off the books.

Posted by: tony325 | June 26, 2009 3:31 PM | Report abuse

Had we drafted Rubio we'd still have Stevenson as a starter, Nick Young as the primary scoring option coming of the bench and a disaster scenario of a foreign player deciding to play in Europe.

Posted by: jon_quest | June 26, 2009 3:02 PM


thats the best comment that any blogger said. why is everyone crying and complaining..? we added two PROVEN players on our roster and the summer is not even over with. July 1 free agency starts and there will be more trades and news going about. I know one thing we all have in common is we wanna be a relevant team outside of the DMV, and we will be. It felt good having success from 2004-2007 but injuries and the whole nine slowed us down. Its funny how no one was calling ernie out when he got rid of jerry stackhouse,christian laetner,kwame brown,jared jeffries, now ethan thomas, pesh...he brought in Arenas,Butler,Jamison, young, much better than any of the other Gm's ever did for the wizards. We even won a playoff series. the best is yet to come. Just give it some time,,. let us be a bit more healthy and watch how far we can go.

Posted by: mrhney03 | June 26, 2009 3:33 PM | Report abuse

How about if you, bulletsfan78 and all the other haters agree to apologize to Abe and Ernie and quit posting your vitriol if the Wizards win 50+ or make it to the conference finals.

Posted by: Blurred | June 26, 2009 3:19 PM

I'll agree if Abe will give all the season ticket holder a refund if they don't?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 26, 2009 3:36 PM | Report abuse

"If you understand any modicum of economic theory, you will understand why the Wiz & Lakers played the same off-season hand last night."

So what, you're saying the Wizards and Lakers are purposefully attempting to make themselves worse now, so that they decrease their revenue to the point that other teams suffer the salary cap consequences in 2010?

Or are the Wizards and Lakers attempting to increase their (and league) revenue by bringing in $$ for draft picks, attempting to avoid the lux tax and salary cap drop?

What's your thesis here? Remember, how much they spend has nothing to do (directly) to how much revenue they bring in.

Posted by: psps23 | June 26, 2009 3:39 PM | Report abuse

I'll agree if Abe will give all the season ticket holder a refund if they don't?
Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 26, 2009 3:36 PM


Since you know squat about economics & sports, no wonder u still follow the team & rant.
Of course your money is never where your mouth is now is it - bigot?

Posted by: Rocc00 | June 26, 2009 3:39 PM | Report abuse

By the way, I hope I'm right in my assertions there. My economics class from college isn't holding very well.

Posted by: psps23 | June 26, 2009 3:41 PM | Report abuse

What's your thesis here? Posted by: psps23 | June 26, 2009 3:39 PM

Did you see this part?

even a 5 percent drop in revenues would push the luxury-tax level to slightly above $60 million, which would in turn put the majority of the league's teams over the tax line in 2010-11 unless they made some serious adjustments to their payroll. It would also dramatically reduce the projected cap space for teams hoping to get in on the bidding for prospective free agents like LeBron James, Chris Bosh and Amare Stoudemire.

I mean would Phoenix with 2 parts of a trio from a playoff team so ready to blow it up so fast?

Posted by: Rocc00 | June 26, 2009 3:43 PM | Report abuse

“Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.”

Albert Einstein

But we all know Abe, Ernie and kal are smater then Al?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 26, 2009 3:46 PM | Report abuse

But we all know Abe, Ernie and kal are smater then Al? Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 26, 2009 3:46 PM

Definitely smarter than u khaki wearing bigot.

Achtung!! - Einsein was jewish you know. Just wasn't practicing....hmmm...maybe that's why u allowed it in your attack on the Wiz.

Keine Juden! right '78??!!

Posted by: Rocc00 | June 26, 2009 3:52 PM | Report abuse

"By the way, ESPN analyst Chad Ford not only rates the Wizards draft moves an "A" but also gives the trade partner, the Timberwolves, a grade of "C+".Posted by: phil27"

I don't know anything about Chad Ford's credibility but I think he's right. If the Minnesota draft works out, it'll be in spite of themselves. If you think fans here are disappointed, you should check out the Wolves' fans, who suddenly pine for Kevin McHale...

Posted by: Samson151 | June 26, 2009 3:53 PM | Report abuse

People on here make it sound like Abe went out and spent big bucks on a "top notch" free agent and that's why he's over the cap?

Draft day was all about saving money and if you're willing to spend your money even though Abe doesn't really care about winning a championship don't blame me.

I've spent more money (at the Cap center) on this team then most people on here, but I gave up my season tickets when the Wizards were forced to practice with Mike O'Koren (i forget the other asst coach) because Abe didn't want to go over the cap back then to make sure the team had enough players at practice.

Like AI would say we're talking about "practice"!

Maybe I am older then most of you but part of being a fan gives you the right to disagree with the organization.

You guys are worse then Fox News reporting about the Rep and the way the libreal media is with Obama.

That's why I took my money and dropped out of the society so I can to play golf, ride my harley and travel.

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 26, 2009 3:56 PM | Report abuse

I have to admit that despite the fact that I have been one of the posters telling everyone to be patient and not judge the Wiz as their roster stands today, I was very frustrated when the team did not use the #32 pick on Blair.

He would have filled a huge hole that they have had for the last few years. He would have provided a banger in the low post who has enough strength to fend guys off so that the rest of the light frontcourt players would have an easier time clearing the boards. I think he could have stepped right in to do that (despite what EG says to the contrary) and he still has upside.

All that said, if that whopping $2.5 Mil (that's a lot of ChingChing) goes to pay for a big move later, I will be fine with their decision to look for a guy who can play some at C as well as PF (Blair cannot do that).

Posted by: SportzWiz | June 26, 2009 3:57 PM | Report abuse

"Calm down, people. The offseason doesn't end on draft night. Give Ernie time to balance the roster.

I'm also chuckling at the people calling Abe "cheap". This is the same guy who just shelled out over $160M to keep Arenas and Jamison with full knowledge that it would put them into luxury tax territory. Remember Juwan Howard's contract? Nothing cheap about that. Abe also built the Verizon Center with his own money and revitalized an entire section of the city. The man is not cheap, people.

This is a strategic move on Ernie's part to give the team the financial flexibility to be active in free agency. We don't need more young players, we need veterans who already know how to win. And by the time the offseason is over, that's what we will have.

Posted by: LyricalRico | June 26, 2009 11:01 AM "

This is a classic case of someone who has both short term and long term memory loss.

What the heck does "balance the roster" mean? Oh, do you mean getting rid of people that EG signed, and now has gotten rid of, and now must "rebalance" the roster?

Juwan Howard? Is he the dude that Les BouleS lowballed because they wanted to change the market? Then they came back later with an offer that matched Miami, and it took Stern to make him return to Les BouleS?

What a joke.

Oh, is this the same Verizon center that Abe built that is tax exempt and his filled like 256 days out of 365 days of the year with events that pad Abe's pockets? How about the cool $50 mil that the DC gov gave to Abe to upgrade the lux boxes and to put in a $1.5 mil jumbo screen?

Whatever.

Mike Lee says that Les BouleS have both the MLE and the BiA exception? Unfortunately, that means squat. Like last season, there's no guarantee that Les BouleS will use it, as they did not use it last season when they were undermanned and had to have Unseld Jr. help in practice.

The bottom line is that due to poor choices to overpay Gilby, MeTawn, MeShawn, and AB, Les BouleS were in lux tax territory. Because of that, they traded away one pick, and sold one for cash. That's how you turn a potential loss into a profit, team success be damned.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 26, 2009 3:59 PM | Report abuse

"I mean would Phoenix with 2 parts of a trio from a playoff team so ready to blow it up so fast?

Posted by: Rocc00"

Again, I'm missing your overall thesis here.

Are you saying Phoenix is purely attempting to cut payroll because they want to avoid the luxury tax threshold (or as much of it as possible)?

Or are you saying there's a deeper motivation to try and gain a competitive advantage by lowering revenue (by virtue of being uncompetitive this year, thus losing fans) so that it's more difficult for other teams to be players in free agency in 2010?

Posted by: psps23 | June 26, 2009 3:59 PM | Report abuse

That's why I took my money and dropped out of the society so I can to play golf, ride my harley and travel.Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 26, 2009 3:56 PM


Wo sind Ihre Papiere? Gehen Sie jetzt!

Posted by: Rocc00 | June 26, 2009 3:59 PM | Report abuse

"People, Abe is dying. He probably has no more than a couple of years left to try and see another championship run by his team. He has no use for developing youths with potentials, so I am not surprised by the draft results. However, I am surprised that he has not given the OK to land a big impact forward or center and go over the luxury tax just like Cleveland did last year in order to make that "last" run. Ernie, please make that man happy while he is still alive!"

Posted by: JohnWWW
"

Obtaining Bosh cures cancer...seriously!!

Posted by: frak | June 26, 2009 3:59 PM | Report abuse

DeJuan Blair, is a developmental player with (count 'em) two bum wheels.

The Wiz are paying lux tax this year. $2.5M goes a long way toward making that a workable situation bottom-line wise. While also giving EG a little more leeway to go out and get a good big.

One nice trade (fingers crossed for camby or chandler, david lee wouldn't be a bad pickup) and one MLE (look at Mike's list, and we're set (and probably even further into lux tax land.

Who will be the trade partner? NO needs bench scoring (Nick Young). NY needs cap room (MJames) and an uptempo 2nd point guard (JCritt). The Clippers have a glut of big men.

Win now mode is the reality, with Abe on his last legs. Best believe he's loosened the reigns on EG (evidenced by the fact that we're already gonna pay lux tax). How does DeJuan Blair fit into that? ESPECIALLY with your only frontcourt depth at present being two developmental bigs... Yeah we could really use another one...

And what currently available FA is Blair better than over the next 2 years? Which of our developmental bigs is he gonna squeeze out for PT?

Perspective, people. If we were retooling (i.e. staying in the draft), then the cry would be 'why aren't we capitalizing on the current window of opportunity by bringing in provven vets?'

Oh, and I'm glad the jew stuff is over. that was really ugly. If it were my blog, a few members would've been banned this morning.

Posted by: jones-y | June 26, 2009 3:13 PM

Well said jones-y. AMEN.

Posted by: oddjob2 | June 26, 2009 4:00 PM | Report abuse

Are you saying Phoenix is purely attempting to cut payroll because they want to avoid the luxury tax threshold (or as much of it as possible)?
Posted by: psps23 | June 26, 2009 3:59 PM

This. & a bit of strategically be ready to be players in '10 when a boatload of FA will hit the market due to lower cap.

Posted by: Rocc00 | June 26, 2009 4:01 PM | Report abuse

my favorite thing of the day is when I went to the link for POPS, it had an ad that said "Average Raptor IQ = 83"

Trying to figure out that means some really smart birds or some really dumb ballers!

What's the deal with Shawn Marion? Is he healthy? Isn't he a free agent this summer? or is it next summer?

Posted by: Blurred | June 26, 2009 4:04 PM | Report abuse

Oh, is this the same Verizon center that Abe built that is tax exempt and his filled like 256 days out of 365 days of the year with events that pad Abe's pockets? How about the cool $50 mil that the DC gov gave to Abe to upgrade the lux boxes and to put in a $1.5 mil jumbo screen? Whatever.
Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 26, 2009 3:59 PM

Confirmation - u are a nit wit twerp! Apparently u can't even afford to go down to Penn Quarter near Abe Pollin Avenue so how can u even comment on economics?

Posted by: Rocc00 | June 26, 2009 4:05 PM | Report abuse

""People, Abe is dying. He probably has no more than a couple of years left to try and see another championship run by his team. He has no use for developing youths with potentials, so I am not surprised by the draft results. However, I am surprised that he has not given the OK to land a big impact forward or center and go over the luxury tax just like Cleveland did last year in order to make that "last" run. Ernie, please make that man happy while he is still alive!"

Posted by: JohnWWW
""

I hate to say this, but "a couple of years" is hugely optimistic.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 26, 2009 4:12 PM | Report abuse

"

How about Pat Ewing Jr. ? He's probably available, he tested great at the workout and he's hungry for a shot. Problem is, at 6'6" and 224, he may be too small. Give him a shot, though.

Posted by: original_mark | June 26, 2009 3:01 PM "

Mr. Kool-Aid man busts through the wall with a remarkable suggestion again.

Pray tell what Pat Ewing Jr. will give to the franchise that dudes above him, namely Caron, Eminem, DMac, AB, and NY, can't?

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 26, 2009 4:16 PM | Report abuse

I hate to say this, but "a couple of years" is hugely optimistic.
Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 26, 2009 4:12 PM

Sprechen Sie Deutsch ?? hick hick hick

Posted by: Rocc00 | June 26, 2009 4:18 PM | Report abuse

Poll question: If Abe wasn't too old and sick to really run the club properly, would EG still have his job?

Posted by: rocky123 | June 26, 2009 4:21 PM | Report abuse

I was a bit disappointed at the Zards not taking a flyer on Blair, but I understand UConn's Jeff Adrien went undrafted. 6'7" with 7'2" wingspan. Four years of Big East experience, very stong, very physical and very healthy. He was the enforcer for the Huskies, Thabeet was just tall..

Posted by: bozomoeman | June 26, 2009 4:21 PM | Report abuse

DEFENSE wins championships. Look at any sport, doesn't matter. Defense.
The Wiz didn't learn that in the past and I guess they haven't learned it now. They play no D and there's noone in this trade that's going to address that situation.
They are just spinning their wheels.

Posted by: dovelevine | June 26, 2009 4:22 PM | Report abuse

"I hate to say this, but "a couple of years" is hugely optimistic.
Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 26, 2009 4:12 PM

Sprechen Sie Deutsch ?? hick hick hick

Posted by: Rocc00 | June 26, 2009 4:18 PM "

Heil my brotha....

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 26, 2009 4:28 PM | Report abuse

I also think the Wizards should be interested in Jeff Adrien from UCONN. At least sign him to the summer league team!

Who else who was highly rated did not get drafted?

Posted by: PostSubscriber | June 26, 2009 4:31 PM | Report abuse

Heil my brotha....
Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 26, 2009 4:28 PM

I knew it! u = bigot too just like '78='88.

Posted by: Rocc00 | June 26, 2009 4:32 PM | Report abuse

I like the trade for Foye and Miller. If the Wiz run a spread offense Foye will surprise people as he will get in the lane often and make a living at the line. He does that in transition now. He went off a few times this year and scored in the high thirties in a poor offense. He does not have GA's shooting range, but teams will not be able to ignore him. He is WAY more dangerous that JC or NY.

Miller will be the best 3-point shooter on the team percentage-wise, and he's not a bad rebounder either. As others have stated he can play a lot of roles.

I'm ambivalent about selling the 2nd pick. I think they want another big who can rebound and defend the post decently as a backup. (What Etan was supposed to be) There wasn't anyone left in the draft meeting that criteria. Blair can rebound, but he's poor defensively.

And I wouldn't assume Miller and Foye will be gone after next year either. Miller will probably not get another contract offer that increases his current, generous one unless he performs far superior to what's expected, and Foye is restricted, so the Wiz can match. If he plays great then he's worth the match; if not let him travel. No guarantees, but the odds are sure better than yet another draft pick project.

Posted by: sysadb420 | June 26, 2009 4:37 PM | Report abuse

"I knew it! u = bigot too just like '78='88.

Posted by: Rocc00 | June 26, 2009 4:32 PM "

Seig Heil my brotha.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 26, 2009 4:39 PM | Report abuse

LarryinClinton, your racism has no room on this blog! Go put ointment on your bottom.

Posted by: shoveit | June 26, 2009 4:39 PM | Report abuse

EG knows that rubino will fall down.They picked him to trade him. If they picked him to use him, there was no need to draft another PG, they should have taken curry.They have no buyer so far.EG makes mistakes like giving bad contract but did good in this draft.Who is this blair?, he could be a beast but you need experianced Big man in big games I think the list on mike blog is much better than him, even ruffin will be much help full in big games than Blairmm, he does everything perfectly except scoring.
I think they should not rash to narrow their chance, they can sign a veteran big with 1.5 to 2.5 and wait until trade dead line to land a complete big man.

Posted by: gtefferra | June 26, 2009 4:39 PM | Report abuse

"Sprechen Sie Deutsch ?? hick hick hick

Posted by: Rocc00 | June 26, 2009 4:18 PM "

No I don't.

Do you d0uche?

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 26, 2009 4:45 PM | Report abuse

Stevenson was inked to wiz a year after he played for 989,000 for a year.He was already signed when mason came to us as a FA.Mason's departure is the value he had due to the minutes he got from arenas injury

Posted by: gtefferra | June 26, 2009 4:53 PM | Report abuse

pretty good basic explanation and supposition from Lee's trascript:
"I suspect there is a lot of negative reaction to the Wiz not taking DeJuan Blair last night, but the move actually makes sense to me. If Blair signs for $800,000, it's really double that from the tax. Throw in the $2.5M cash they got for the pick, you're up to $4.1M for Blair alone. Throw in the $3M or so for the saved first rounder and the $3M in luxury tax from that, and you're up to $10M saved. And they added two veterans!

Do you see the moves as crafty or cheap? What sort of veteran might be available at a starting salary of $5M or so?"

Posted by: oddjob2 | June 26, 2009 4:54 PM | Report abuse

At the trade deadline, I hope they pick up a center who can run the floor. If Phoenix is not looking like a contender and is looking to shed contracts in February, I would love to be able to get Biedrins.

Posted by: yop32 | June 26, 2009 4:55 PM | Report abuse

"For whom exactly has the run-and-gun permieter philosphy worked well for in the NBA to deliver a championship?"

Not many, you're correct, but Orlando came very close to bucking that trend.

Posted by: Samson151 | June 26, 2009 4:58 PM | Report abuse

who noticed blair's bad knees when he was dominating thabeet last season? he was limpin all over the court, basically playin on one leg it was heroic how he played through the obvious pain he was experiencing.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 5:00 PM | Report abuse

Lets be honest the Wizards are broke. They hinted before the draft that they don't have the money for new players. The sad fact is if they stay healthy they will squeak into the playoffs lose the first round. Then they will declare the season a sucess. The loser mentality starts at the top with the owner. My only hope is the fans boycott.

Posted by: MARKHAGNER | June 26, 2009 5:09 PM | Report abuse

Samson151 Orlando had Dwight Howard the defensive player of the year we don't

Posted by: anacostia85 | June 26, 2009 5:10 PM | Report abuse

"Not many, you're correct, but Orlando came very close to bucking that trend.

Posted by: Samson151 | June 26, 2009 4:58 PM "

O-town would be running right behind Les BouleS to the lottery if not for DH.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 26, 2009 5:12 PM | Report abuse

"Lets be honest the Wizards are broke. They hinted before the draft that they don't have the money for new players. The sad fact is if they stay healthy they will squeak into the playoffs lose the first round. Then they will declare the season a sucess. The loser mentality starts at the top with the owner. My only hope is the fans boycott.

Posted by: MARKHAGNER | June 26, 2009 5:09 PM "

Let's see.

They "don't have money," but they do have $160 mil to throw to a gimpy legged, overrated diva, and they have $50 mil to throw to a one dimensional tweener who almost blows his knee pretending to play D against a slow footed 7 footer in Dirk Nowitski, and they have $14 mil to throw to a nondefensive stopper and non shooter in MeShawn after nobody else bid for his services, and another $14 mil to throw to AB as a reward for finishing john school.

Yeah, broke...broke in da head.

Seig Heil to those brilliant decisions.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 26, 2009 5:15 PM | Report abuse

psps: "Because, whether or not you want to admit it, Foye is much further along in his development [thank Young or Crittenton]."

Yes, he is. In terms of production, I'd compare him to Mike Bibby. Here are the numbers:

Bibby: 79 games, 34.7 min. per game, 14.9 points per game, FG% 43.5 3 pointers 39% FT 79% Assists 5.0 TOs 1.62 Eff +14.36

Foye: 70 games 35.6 minutes 16.3 points FG 41% 3 pointers 36% FT 85% Assists 4.3 TOs 2.14 Eff +14.0

Randy's two inches taller and probably 20 pounds heavier, and he's entering his 4th year. Miller, on the other hand, is surprisingly comparable in terms of productivity to Joe Johnson:

Johnson: 658 games, 553 starts, 36.8 minutes, 17.2 points FG% 44.1 3 pointers 37.4% FT 79% RB 4.2 Assists 4.2 TOs 2.23

Miller: 638 games, 478 starts, 32 minutes, 13.9 points, FG 46.2% 3 pointers 40% FT 77% RBs 5.0 Assists 3.2 TOs 1.9

Not saying Miller is as good as Johnson, but you can see why Mike has trade value. His history of coming off the bench doesn't hurt in the eyes of a GM.

The question I have: why did the Wolves give up so much for the 5th pick? I think if they'd waited until the draft, they might actually have gotten the Wiz to go for less.


Posted by: Samson151 | June 26, 2009 5:41 PM | Report abuse

I think Rubio is WAY overhyped, not to mention he probably won't play in the NBA til 2011 or 12. So Im not worried about missing out on him. I dont even think he'll be a better PG than Flynn or Curry who both went after him.

As for our Wiz, there MUST be a move coming soon. If they really got 2.5 Mill for Jermaine Taylor, I believe we could see Zach Randolph or Camby or Kaman possibly. After the Clips drafted Griffin, They need to get rid of 1 of their bigs. Send Mike James, D Steve, and cash for one of those veteran bigs, and we'll be in a great spot

Posted by: Gtown87 | June 26, 2009 6:02 PM | Report abuse

randolph due 33 mil over next 2yrs
kaman due 34 mil over next 3 yrs

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 26, 2009 6:06 PM | Report abuse

DeJuan Blair is maybe 6'7" by all legitimate accounts, so, no, he would not have helped the Wizards. What would help the Wizards is painfully obvious at this point, even to the casual fan.

A nice game of lower your guards (by the numbers) for one or two space eaters who don't get hangnails and sit out for long stretches would do nicely. In the pipedream world, we'd all love to see an Amare Stoudemire type but in the real economic world no owner is paying a dollar-for-dollar $15 Million luxury tax penalty to carry that many short term max contracts.

I will say that for the Wizards purposes, a Ben Wallace in his prime type or a Marcus Camby type of defender and rebounder would be a damn fine thing. A David Lee or a Chris Bosh would be too much like hand picking the team for it to happen, right?

Posted by: i2igems | June 26, 2009 6:08 PM | Report abuse

"As for our Wiz, there MUST be a move coming soon. If they really got 2.5 Mill for Jermaine Taylor, I believe we could see Zach Randolph or Camby or Kaman possibly. After the Clips drafted Griffin, They need to get rid of 1 of their bigs. Send Mike James, D Steve, and cash for one of those veteran bigs, and we'll be in a great spot

Posted by: Gtown87 | June 26, 2009 6:02 PM "

Les BouleS got 750k last draft for Bill Walker. What did they do when manpower was short and they had an slot to fill?

They did nothing.

Don't hold your breath.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 26, 2009 6:37 PM | Report abuse

Les BouleS got 750k last draft for Bill Walker. What did they do when manpower was short and they had an slot to fill?

They did nothing.

Don't hold your breath.

Yeah, if we had filled that slot, we could have gotten one extra win and thad the third worst record in the league (instead of tied for second worst), and we would have won the Blake Griffin sweepstakes.

Posted by: yop32 | June 26, 2009 6:44 PM | Report abuse

i love nick young's potential but at a certain point the guys gotta produce.
i say we trade him for a quality big man
theres just not enough time for him here with miller foye and arenas

Posted by: mardiros | June 26, 2009 7:11 PM | Report abuse

...you know Wiz fans, Calvin Booth is still out there! 6'11" 230lbs -- provides defense and rebounds, plus he can make free throws. Yours for $1.3M.


Posted by: oddjob2 | June 26, 2009 7:18 PM | Report abuse

WE NEED TO DO WHATEVER IT TAKES TO GET PAUL MILSAP
the guy is a beast and exactly what we need

Posted by: mardiros | June 26, 2009 7:25 PM | Report abuse

The wiz will win more games next year just because they have a real coach. Why does everyone want to get rid of Young. This guy will be a star in this league. It will be as big a mistake as Jordan getting rid of Rip. Anyway Foyer and Miller will be backing up 2 guys who never want to come off the floor (Gil, Jamison). How sad. Blatche needs to play the 4 with Haywood at the 5 until McGee bulk up which isn't going to be to long. Hopefully we don't get rid of him.

Posted by: rnbrown4 | June 26, 2009 7:30 PM | Report abuse

"The wiz will win more games next year just because they have a real coach. Why does everyone want to get rid of Young. This guy will be a star in this league. It will be as big a mistake as Jordan getting rid of Rip. Anyway Foyer and Miller will be backing up 2 guys who never want to come off the floor (Gil, Jamison). How sad. Blatche needs to play the 4 with Haywood at the 5 until McGee bulk up which isn't going to be to long. Hopefully we don't get rid of him.

Posted by: rnbrown4 | June 26, 2009 7:30 PM "

Wow, what a no brainer.

Don't forget, Les BouleS "didn't lose" only 19 games last season. That shouldn't be a hard figure to beat.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 26, 2009 8:05 PM | Report abuse

What about trading Mike James to Milwaukee for this guy?

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=1710

Their salaries and age match pretty well but it is big for small...
Big Ern could sell this as tutelage for Brandon Jennings and the Bucks could let Sessions walk without suffering any depth issues.

Posted by: elfreako | June 26, 2009 8:06 PM | Report abuse

Here's something that I predicted that may come true.

I said all along that RR would probably have gone higher if he did not have the buyout issues with his current euro team, and probably issues with his agent Fegan. Because he was drafted lower than he thought, it is now being said that he won't be making enough to break even if he paid off his euro team.

Now, other teams, such as the Knicks, are looking to see if they can get RR. RR, if moved to the Knicks, can probably get a lot more endorsement money compared to playing for the Wolves, so it might be a good gamble for him.

Unfortunately for Les BouleS, if they had kept the 5th pick, and drafted RR, they might have been able to pry David Lee away from the Knicks. Now, they are stuck with 2 players they are already have some depth at, and these 2 new players may be gone after this season.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft2009/news/story?id=4290401

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 26, 2009 8:11 PM | Report abuse

...you know Wiz fans, Calvin Booth is still out there! 6'11" 230lbs -- provides defense and rebounds, plus he can make free throws. Yours for $1.3M.


Posted by: oddjob2 | June 26, 2009 7:18 PM

But wait... There's more!!! If you sign Calvin Booth before the first of July, you'll get Charles Jones and John 'hot plate' Williams, all for just 1.3M!

Posted by: demonj21 | June 26, 2009 10:12 PM | Report abuse

"LarryinClinton, your racism has no room on this blog! Go put ointment on your bottom.

Posted by: shoveit | June 26, 2009 4:39 PM"

Shoveit, Dem comments ain't racist, not atall they ain't, I jus happen to agree with Eight Supreme Court Justices in this case. Pray tell, what legal law would Clarence Thomas would have to be looking at to say that the little middle school girl had no legal protections in the law in this United States of America.

Naww, SHOVEIT, Dem comments ain't even close ta' bein' racist. It is all about legal protections under the law of the great USA, and just because Clarence Thomas made it all the way to the Supreme Court of the US of A, it does not also equate that he has Any Clue.

I have had 3 daughters go through middle school and I can't imagine how I would I have felt if Middle School stripped searched one of them without due process.

SHOVEIT, suppose that was your little girl that got stripped searched in Middle school. Would you be siding with Clarence Thomas. Clarence Thomas needs ta' be' kicked off the Bench.

Ya' Heard Me. Gag Me With A Maggott.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 26, 2009 10:21 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: PostSubscriber | June 26, 2009 10:35 PM | Report abuse

I couldn't believe DeJuan Blair fell to us in the 2nd round. I could believe however and in fact could have predicted what happened next. I am consistantly disapointed by this team to the point that I expect it. He is exactly the type of player we need. I guess we need cash more.

I also would have been interested in Sam Young, DaJuan Summers, and Chase Budinger.

As far as Rubio... I didn't want him, but I bet we could have gotten more in trade for the #5 after he fell there. So far this offseason is no surprise. Trade our pick for a couple supporting players in Miller and Foye, while Cleveland trades for Shaq, Orlando trades for Vince Carter, Spurs trade for Richard Jefferson.

It's the difference between setting a goal of winning a championship and setting a goal of being "competitive".

Posted by: Darnell1 | June 26, 2009 10:44 PM | Report abuse

Chris Wilcox, Shelden Williams, Channing Frye are FAs I'd be shooting for.

Camby is who I'd be going for as far as trade. Salary matches up with James/Stevenson.

Posted by: Darnell1 | June 26, 2009 11:12 PM | Report abuse

What the heck are Wiz thinking. Trading a draft pick for cash only to sign a journeyman scrub or over the hill big man for one, maybe 2 years? Or is it just because Abe running short on cash in golden years and wants to spread more around to family. I was in disbelief with Dejuan Blair still on the board, knowledgeable hoopheads like Bilas touting him as a steal at 32, and the Wiz blow him off. If the Wiz dont need a guy like Blair to do the dirty work, grab the rebounds and body up on the power players, then I don't know what they need. You rather have Mikki Mouse, er Moore? What did he do for the Celts? He's got a bigger upside? Joe Smith was nice coming out of college - he's in his 30s and nothing left. This was almost like a first round pick at 32 -- it's a joke that the Wiz poo-poo it because it was the 2nd round. Hey, Wiz, the good teams always pick around 25-30, and they get players there. Adding insult to injury, the Spurs take Blair, yeah like the Spurs don't know what they're doing with 4 championships and finding Ginobili and Parker. I can't believe Wiz are counting on a frontline of Haywood, McGee and Blatche, and thinking they're championship contender with that.

Posted by: schlomoG | June 27, 2009 12:16 AM | Report abuse

"No Kal, my argument has been that by waiting until draft-day, Ernie WOULD have been in a better position to deal. "

And that argument is dead solid wrong. Could he have been? Sure. But could only implies possibility. Anything is possible. Would he have been? There's no way for you or anyone else to know that. Would implies probability and you have absolutely no way of knowing the probability of the Wizards getting a better deal had they waited. None. For all we know thw odds of Grunfeld getting a better deal could have been roughly the same as the odd of Rubio refusing to sign and saying he'd rather stay in Spain which would, quite obviously destroy any bargaining position the Wizards had.

You're claiming to be able to predict something that quite simply can't be predicted.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 27, 2009 1:23 AM | Report abuse

This draft has turned out far worse than I even thought possible. We give up a premier talent in Rubio for two overpaid journeymen who will not propel us among the elite. We spend so much on said journeymen that we have to sell our second pick, which could have landed us Blair, Budinger, etc. That is lousy GM-ing, no way around it. Hope springs eternal, and I´m sure there are a couple Ernie apologists out there who see us as a contender because they remember us getting to the second round of the playoffs three years ago and are excited by filling some roster spots with Miller and Foye. For me, it is a sureallistic nightmare which this franchise will struggle to recover from for years in the future. Grunfeld must go.

Posted by: SammyT1 | June 27, 2009 6:05 AM | Report abuse

It don't matter who we get we 4 guys that aren't sitting anyway. Jamison, Butler led the league in minuts played on a 19 win team. You think they are going to sit now. Hell as long as Jamison is at the 4 we could have KG and he wouldn't play. Just kiddin. They would have to sit him for KG. They paid Jamison 40mil for 4yrs and he's what 36. I don't blame anyone for getting paid. Ernie go get your big like everyone wants and let him sit behind Jamison and Haywood. Short of just wanting to get paid what big will come here to sit. That's what McGee and Blatche will do. Then they will leave and become someone else's star. Run and gun Flip but no cigar. Last I checked Flip had KG in Minn. Sheed, Billups,Prince, Hamilton, Wallace in Detriot. How'd that workout.

Posted by: rnbrown4 | June 27, 2009 7:41 AM | Report abuse

I will reserve judgement about the upcoming season. I can only assume EG knows we need rebounding and a serious presence inside. I assume he knows Blatche is a joke and that Mcgee isn't going to get it done. It is blatantly apparent to all of us fans we need a big man, so I assume EG has to know it. Now, whether anything is done about it? Well, we'll see. If we don't, this team may still win 50 games. But its starting to become clear the Wiz are content making the playoffs and are not overly concerned with competing once we get there. If Wiz mngmnt think this current roster can compete with Garnett/Howard/Shaq...they're in for a rude awakening.

Posted by: storers1 | June 27, 2009 8:00 AM | Report abuse

Posted by: PostSubscriber | June 27, 2009 8:18 AM | Report abuse

They paid Jamison 40mil for 4yrs and he's what 36.

For the record, Antawn Jamison, Mr. 22/9, turned 33 two weeks ago. So with three years to go on that contract, he will be exactly 35 (about to turn 36) when this contract ends.

Posted by: jefsadler | June 27, 2009 8:28 AM | Report abuse

"They paid Jamison 40mil for 4yrs and he's what 36.

For the record, Antawn Jamison, Mr. 22/9, turned 33 two weeks ago. So with three years to go on that contract, he will be exactly 35 (about to turn 36) when this contract ends.

Posted by: jefsadler | June 27, 2009 8:28 AM "

Methinks that was 50 mil over 4 years.

Being Abe's favorite player carries a lot of weight, whether you play inside the paint or not, or whether you even can spell defense, doesn't matter.

I still think MeTawn has some trade value. I think the Cavs still want him, as many talking heads have said that they need a shooting 4.

Because of his close ties with Abe though, don't know whether he'll ever be moved even if it helps the franchise.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 27, 2009 8:31 AM | Report abuse

I can see people being upset because we did not do more with our 2nd pick, but I cannot see them being upset because we did not select DeJuan Blair.

He is a 6' 7" wanna play wit' the big boys wit' not one, but two bum knees.

And pray tell, where would he play on this Wizards team. Backup to the 5, Oh Nooo. Backup to the 4, Oh Nooo. We got no playing time available for this guy. We might look thin at the 5/4, but we really ain't.

Blair is a very poor fit for this Team, just as Ricky Rubio is.

Ernie knew what he was doing by not drafting this guy. He could not help us.

We just don't need any big guy, we need a good one. Thabeet was the only choice in the draft and since we could not get him, Ernie probably has his eye on a Vet.

Getting rid of Thomas, Songaila, and Pech is a huge deal. It is a lot huger than a lot of you are mentioning.

The fabric of your Team is crucial to its success. By relieving it of pieces that don't fit only makes it better. Miller and Foye are not the greatest, but they fit this Team and they also can be used to get that big mean tough guy.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 27, 2009 9:11 AM | Report abuse

Who is better? Foye or Crittendon.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 27, 2009 9:14 AM | Report abuse

And who was that that said we probably could not unload Thomas because of that clause in his contract was dead wrong. In the final analysis, he had to waiver that clause or he would have lost money.

Ha! Ha!

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 27, 2009 9:27 AM | Report abuse

And that argument is dead solid wrong. Could he have been? Sure. But could only implies possibility. Anything is possible. Would he have been? There's no way for you or anyone else to know that. Would implies probability and you have absolutely no way of knowing the probability of the Wizards getting a better deal had they waited. None. For all we know thw odds of Grunfeld getting a better deal could have been roughly the same as the odd of Rubio refusing to sign and saying he'd rather stay in Spain which would, quite obviously destroy any bargaining position the Wizards had.

You're claiming to be able to predict something that quite simply can't be predicted.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 27, 2009 1:23 AM


I don't know how many times I have to repeat myself to help you get it.

I'll try to spell it out this way:

When someone goes into a deal, they go into it with a certain "bargaining position" (let's call it).

For instance, if I am trying to get a loan, when I walk into the bank one of the things that determine my inital "bargaining position" is my credit history. If I have a crappy credit history, that hurts my initial "bargaining position". If I have a great credit history that helps my initial "bargaining position". You would agree that having good credit history does make it MORE LIKELY that I'll get the loan, than having bad credit history. Is good credit a "guarantee" that I'll get the loan? No. But I am absolutely in a better position to bargain if I have good credit history vs. poor credit history. With me so far?

In the NBA universe, the Wolves were hoping/wanting to get Ricky Rubio. On Wed, we could offer the 5th pick with no guarantee that Rubio would be there. On Thurs, we could have offered the pick WITH the guarantee that Rubio would be there. On Thurs., we absolutely were in a better bargaining position with the Wolves than we were on Wed. Would that have definitely absolutely positively guaranteed us a better deal? No - and I've been saying that all along.

But we would have absolutely definitely positively been in a better initial bargaining position on THursday because we could guarantee that Rubio was there.

This isn't that complicated, Kal; you are just stubbornly determined to refuse that I'm right on this.

Posted by: p1funk | June 27, 2009 9:47 AM | Report abuse

if the cavs got twan, they would win the nba championship, with or without shaq, now how in anyway is that making our team better?....and these are the same people calling abe cheap...the only thing the cavs were offering for jamison is expiring contracts, now that would be cheap....trading jamison for anything less than good players in return would be foolish...if u could trade jamison for a bosh or stoudamire i'd be all for it...problem those teams aren't looking for a 33 yr old pf with 3 years left on his contract when they kno they would have to rebuild

Posted by: jasonma1 | June 27, 2009 10:19 AM | Report abuse

I agree with P1funk.

The logic is sound on both sides, but due to the fact that Rubio fell to the 5 slot our bargaining position would have been greater as P1funk says.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 27, 2009 10:24 AM | Report abuse

All this talk of Rubio is absurd. For one, if Rubio came to play for the Wizards, he'd be on the bench behind Arenas and others. It would take years for him to develop into a halfway decent player.

Two, Rubio knows this, and would insist on a trade to a team that buys into his hype, that's desperate enough to give him significant minutes. He would threaten to stay in Spain until he was traded to a preferred team (which he may be doing to Minnesota now). This in turn would compromise the Wizards' bargaining position. This also explains why the Wizards couldn't simply draft Rubio and hold him for ransom. The longer they held onto him, the more likely the Timberwolves (or whomever they spoke to) would realize that acquiring Rubio would be fraught with problems. If Minnesota has to trade Rubio, Grunfeld will be vindicated.

Three, the Wizards know that Rubio would refuse to play for them, and that he would hold up and/or diminish any trades, and would not have selected him. If I remember correctly, Jordan Hill was the next available player on their list. So, the question is really, did the Wizards make the correct move by exchanging Jordan Hill and the continued services of Songaila, Thomas and Pech for Mike Miller and Randy Foye? Not only did they make the correct move, they made a great move.

Posted by: satchmore | June 27, 2009 10:34 AM | Report abuse

Here's a glimpse of the mess the Wizards would've had to endure had they kept the pick and selected Rubio:

http://myespn.go.com/blogs/truehoop/0-41-157/Ricky-Rubio--Playing-Minnesota-Poker.html

Posted by: satchmore | June 27, 2009 10:39 AM | Report abuse

pfunk is right, and i've been saying it as well....my main issue with this trade is that they didnt wait a little longer, y would u trade two days before the draft...do u really think the same offer wouldnt have been on the table on thurs? Minnesota acquired this pick with no idea rubio would fall to them, the minnesota manager even said as much...with rubio falling there is no doubt that our pick would have gotten more value than it did two days before the draft...

leaving rubio out the equation, lets just say he was picked 2nd or 3rd like many thought he would...even still it would have been prudent to wait til the day of the draft to pull the trigger on any trade...we kno there were teams trying to move up...the closer and closer we get to the "deadline" which is our pick, the more desperate those teams trying to move up become...i really think we coulda at least gotten the 18th along with what we got...

also the trade rumors for amare were that they offered us their pick along with amare for caron, nick or crit, and the 5th...i think we shoulda coutnered with amare str8 up...for jamison, crit, and our 5th,

at this point rumours are that clips are still trying to move camby...i would see if they would accept james and stevenson for camby...camby is injury prone...but if he can provide 15-20 min a game...i doubt he gets injured, and that will be very very useful for us...i would rather have kaman...but no way clips give up kaman...

pachulia would be a decent option to sign, he is a solid tough big...

also i'm not worried about orlando at this point...the carter trade was more of an admission that they wont be able to sign hedo...if they dont sign hedo, and they lost courtney lee, i really dont see them any better, only if they are able to resign hedo will that trade have any impact

Posted by: jasonma1 | June 27, 2009 10:41 AM | Report abuse

Pfunk: Man, would I like to get you in a negotiation ... what you're talking about is called in the business BATNA (Best Alternative to a Negotiated Solution). Yes, it's true that Minnesota, if they wanted Rubio above all else, would have been willing to give up more knowing that it was guaranteed he would be available. But that's in a vacuum and there are other factors. For one, we don't know he was their choice. What if they REALLY wanted Evans (which makes more sense for their team) or Thabeet? For another, and probably the big gorilla in the room, who's to say if the Wiz hadn't bit when they did that some other team wouldn't have swooped in, say OKC or Sacramento, to grab Miller and Foye or other T-wolves for an even better position in the draft? You're just taking one relatively minor consideration and isolating it, saying EG blew it because of that one thing. As I say, love to get you to the negotiating table with bucks on the line.

Face it, EG fleeced the Twolves. Got two starters, one in his prime the other about to enter it. Who average together over 30 points, 10 bounds, and a bunch of assists. Who are good teammates and unselfish players. And who do things the Wiz need. For what? Three useless, high contracts and an 18 year old who has never scored over 10 points a game (and never started even) for a middling Euroleague team, and who's probably going back to Spain anyway.

Man do you all have issues.

Posted by: WizintheRockies | June 27, 2009 11:09 AM | Report abuse

And, if we had waited till draft day because someone wanted Rubio so badly, we might have gotton one of those 1st round picks back from the Wolves.

But as Kalo points out we could not have known this going in, but as things shook out, you cannot disallow the fact if we had held fast till draft day, that it actually would have made our bargaining position stronger.

(It is all a gamble, even the sure #1 pick.)

Even strong enough to have secured a lower 1st round pick, just like I and some others had projected.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 27, 2009 11:11 AM | Report abuse

But, WizintheRockies,

the point of the whole matter is that if we had waited longer it would have made our bargaining position stronger. That is it in a nutshell.

I don't think P1funk is saying that EG made a lousy deal atall.

If we had waited as he is saying there is no telling what would have happened, given our stronger position.

Hell can you imagine how New York felt when they lost their player to Golden State right in front of them. If EG was still live on draft day, possibilites still abound. But, because EG took his deal earlier, New York had no one to bargain with.

We, sometimes trash other bloggers points, when they make perfect sense. Give a guy his due. We make all these assertions/assumptions about what he is saying, but he is clearly not.

He is only saying that, had Ernie waited till draft day his bargaining position would have been stronger. That is it.

Give the guy his due.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 27, 2009 11:29 AM | Report abuse

the point of the whole matter is that if we had waited longer it would have made our bargaining position stronger. That is it in a nutshell.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 27, 2009 11:29 AM

Well, not really. I recommend reading what WizintheRockies wrote more closely. The point he made was that you actually have no way of knowing that holding onto the 5th pick would've made the Wizards' bargaining position any stronger. This is a point that I've tried to make, albeit less eloquently.

The Wiz knew their BATNA, and it got them to Yes.

Posted by: satchmore | June 27, 2009 12:13 PM | Report abuse

I think it's a matter that in hindsight, we can see that we would have had a stronger bargaining position.

but what if

-the wolves took another trade and got rid of the pieces we wanted, as previously suggested
-rubio hadn't fallen to 5 (which was previously thought unlikely) and our bargaining position consisted of players the wolves had less desire for

either one of those would have changed everything. ultimately, we're monday morning quarterbacking by saying they *should* have waited.

waiting was an option, yes, but not without its own risks.

Posted by: crs-one | June 27, 2009 12:42 PM | Report abuse

It is silly to sit up and say you don't know if our bargaining position would have been stronger had we held onto the 5th pick until draft day when it has ben proven it would have been. The Knicks want Rubio badly and it has been in print that they regret not dealing with us. They offered Chandler, Hughes and were willing to take Etan, James and either pech or songalia. I am positive that we could have made that deal and they would have caved in and gave us the 8th pick. The Twolves would have had no choice but to give in to our demands or lose out on what they wanted. Ernie is a moron he said in todays article they would be okay as if but the will look around and see what comes up. We are not getting a top quality big man. Rasheed is talking about going to Orlando. Gortat is not leaving Orlando who just played in the finals to come to Washington. He screwed up the draft.

Posted by: anacostia85 | June 27, 2009 12:45 PM | Report abuse

crs there was no other trade for the twolves to accept. the top four teams knew what they wanted and were unwilling to deal away their picks. Patience is what is needed to be a poker player or a nba gm never let them see you sweat. well erniw was sweating buckets and we got hosed

Posted by: anacostia85 | June 27, 2009 12:48 PM | Report abuse

Bbbbbut remember how bad the Wiz were before EG?

Remember how bad that job cleaning toilets was before you started flipping burgers? Be thankful that you're flipping burgers!

The Wiz, building a team to get to .500 while everyone else is trying to build championship teams

Posted by: ArlingtonHokie | June 27, 2009 1:12 PM | Report abuse

been saying this since the trade was made. for those of yall tha still don't get it, we didn'y have to take rubio at 5, just wait til our turn to pick and see what offers we wanted to accept.

there's talk now tha minny might trade rubio. i'm really interested in that trade if it goes down. the fact that minny still has options after the draft gives a bit of insight into the true value of our trade.we are still hoping and praying to make a move for a big, while i'm sure that minny is fielding offers for rubio.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 27, 2009 1:18 PM | Report abuse

is it far fetched to say that david lee could possibly be in play along with the other pieces the knicks have? now that they have hill trading him for an expiring lee and others (maybe hughes and/or chandler/jeffries/duhon?)minny would have to throw in something else (telfair back in ny, craig smith) but they are fwd and pg heavy after the draft and could use some wing players.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 27, 2009 1:23 PM | Report abuse

sorry bout the above post terribly vague. i was talking about a hypothetical trade b/w minny and the knicks for rubio and lee and whatever throwins are required.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 27, 2009 1:34 PM | Report abuse

Interesting nugget about Randy Foye he has Situs Inversus which means his organs are arranged as its mirror image of what a normal person's are his heart is on the right side of his chest rather than left.

Posted by: jeremydvid | June 27, 2009 2:22 PM | Report abuse

The Knicks turned down a deal that would have sent Larry Hughes and Chandler to Washington for Etan Thomas, Mike James, Oleksiy Pecherov and the No. 5 pick (New York would not have surrendered the eighth pick in that trade)

If this is the NY trade that was offered, I would have said hel no, too.
I still think we could have gotten Rubio and traded him to a big market team or a team that wants to run (Warriors, Suns, Knicks) for more than Miller and Foye but it's debatable.

Our bargaining position (aptly defined by PFunk1) would have been reduced by Rubio's fathers comments about going back to Spain. It was a crapshoot. If Rubio does indeed stay in Spain, EG looks like a genius. If he's traded to the Knicks for a crapload of stuff, EG looks foolish.

It apparently was a calculated gamble by Eg. At least we definitely have something to show for it.

Posted by: original_mark | June 27, 2009 2:55 PM | Report abuse

Minnesota's new GM seemed to be almost desperate to move up in the draft. If he hadn't dealt with us on Tuesday, I bet he would have traded with someone else by Thursday.*

If Minnesota had found a different trade partner, we would have lost out big time. Would you rather be going into next season with, say, rookie James Harden as our starting 2-guard, with Mike James getting major minutes as the primary backup at the point?


*(Maybe he would have had to give up one of his "untouchable" pieces, but I bet he would have found a way to get a trade done. Kevin Love and the #6 for Marc Gasol and the #2? That seems more than fair. Or maybe he would have settled for Darko instead of Gasol. Rubio-Foye-Miller-Jefferson-Milicic, even that pu pu platter is probably a better team than what they ended up with. Rubio would play in the U.S. with the salary of the #2 pick. Bottom line, it's all speculation, the load of crap I just laid out, or the equally crappy assumption that the draft would have played out exactly the same even if we hadn't done the trade.)

Posted by: yop32 | June 27, 2009 3:09 PM | Report abuse

I said it before but I like the trade.
There's no way of knowing IF we got the better of the deal or not.
We'll have to at least wait till the All Star break before there is enough data to say for sure.
Ernie got 2 experienced players that get about 25 pts/game between them. Gonna be hard to get that out of a rookie.
I'm looking forward to seeing what Flip does with this group. And if Abe loosens the purse strings and gets some help down low -- look out.

Posted by: VBFan | June 27, 2009 3:24 PM | Report abuse

How about James, McGee, Young and Blatche for Stoudemire. Saves them 3 mil in salary this year and much more next year and gives them young, CHEAP fits for Nash's offense. Gives us a freaking beast top 7 with Arenas, Foye, Butler, Stoudemire, Haywood, Jamison, and Miller (with Stevenson, Critt, McGuire and whatever budget backup center we can bring in to fill out the rotation). That's gotta be getting close to a championship right?

Posted by: GshawnJohnson | June 27, 2009 3:42 PM | Report abuse

"I said it before but I like the trade.
There's no way of knowing IF we got the better of the deal or not.
We'll have to at least wait till the All Star break before there is enough data to say for sure.
Ernie got 2 experienced players that get about 25 pts/game between them. Gonna be hard to get that out of a rookie.
I'm looking forward to seeing what Flip does with this group. And if Abe loosens the purse strings and gets some help down low -- look out.

Posted by: VBFan | June 27, 2009 3:24 PM "

This trade isn't about whether it's a good trade or bad trade with regards to whether Foye and Eminem are going to contribute. I think they will...easily.

The problem is that this trade did not address a huge need by Les BouleS and that is a lack of size, depth, inside scoring, and rebounding at the 4 position.

Not only did this trade not resolve that issue, but the draft didn't put Les BouleS any closer to looking for a resolution.

Again, EG is moving a lot of bodies around....getting rid of bodies he brought into the organization that didn't work, for other bodies that clearly exhibit an unnecessary overlap in skill and size.

Having Eminem and Foye in the mix will definitely decrease opportunities for the younger guys on this team to develop.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 27, 2009 5:09 PM | Report abuse

"Here's a glimpse of the mess the Wizards would've had to endure had they kept the pick and selected Rubio:

http://myespn.go.com/blogs/truehoop/0-41-157/Ricky-Rubio--Playing-Minnesota-Poker.html

Posted by: satchmore | June 27, 2009 10:39 AM "

Yeah, it's better to stick with Les BouleS mess instead....

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 27, 2009 5:16 PM | Report abuse

So what happened at the news conference?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 27, 2009 8:37 PM | Report abuse

It is silly to sit up and say you don't know if our bargaining position would have been stronger had we held onto the 5th pick until draft day when it has ben proven it would have been.

Posted by: anacostia85 | June 27, 2009 12:45 PM

crs there was no other trade for the twolves to accept. the top four teams knew what they wanted and were unwilling to deal away their picks.

Posted by: anacostia85 | June 27, 2009 12:48 PM

Ok fine. We know our bargaining position would have been stronger. Whats SILLY is to say that anyone could have *known* with any degree of certainty that our position would be stronger. Again, I point out that nobody thought Rubio would drop to 5. Call it silly all you want, but you're still playing monday morning quarterback.

As for your second statement, can you prove that? If not, I'll go with yop's reasoning. everybody has their price.

EG could have taken the risk, and it looks like it would have paid off. but you couldn't have known that then. And how many of us would be upset if he stood pat til the draft, rubio had been taken and we would have had to take someone less exciting? EG would have been criticized for being complacent and not getting a deal done. If you look for it, you can always find something to be unhappy about.

Posted by: crs-one | June 27, 2009 9:44 PM | Report abuse

"Again, I point out that nobody thought Rubio would drop to 5. Call it silly all you want, but you're still playing monday morning quarterback.

As for your second statement, can you prove that? If not, I'll go with yop's reasoning. everybody has their price.

EG could have taken the risk, and it looks like it would have paid off. but you couldn't have known that then. And how many of us would be upset if he stood pat til the draft, rubio had been taken and we would have had to take someone less exciting? EG would have been criticized for being complacent and not getting a deal done. If you look for it, you can always find something to be unhappy about.

Posted by: crs-one | June 27, 2009 9:44 PM "

EG gets paid to know this, or at least prepare for it. Otherwise, what value does he bring to the table?

EG should have had this deal discussed early, but not executed until after it was determined who would be available at the 5 spot.

This is the same thing they did with Dallas. Dallas had Les BouleS draft Devin Harris on draft night.

The same thing should have happened, or EG should have established a contingency on the trade executing only if RR wasn't available.

There was absolutely no urgency to execute the trade for Eminem and Foye way before the draft.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 27, 2009 10:16 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: PostSubscriber | June 27, 2009 11:11 PM | Report abuse

Everyone needs to stop hating on Grunfeld he knows what he is doing.

Rubio is all hype. Lets be honest the only real game we saw him play in was in the Olympics - which he did ok not great - other than that we all have seen the same 8 highlights of him: no look over the head, one hand from the hip, twice around the back - all against 30 year old slow white guys. The kid cannot shoot and looks like he weighs under 100 pounds. Sure in a few years he might be amazing but he will not help us win now. Foye (17 points - 4 assists last year - if Rubio does that I will never watch a game again) and Miller at least gives us a chance.

For those who say Abe is cheap: 2.5 million for a second round pick? Are you kidding me? Abe wants to see the BULLETS win again before something bad happens. (I love the guy but he is getting old) All this money will do is go towards a much much better players salary. How many owners have said they will go into the tax this year? So let the man save a little bit of money - no doubt in my mind he will spend more than 70% of owners this year.

To those who are going to say Spain is one of the best Euro leagues - it does not matter all of those leagues are much slower compared to the NBA ask Darko.

Posted by: bnamejko | June 28, 2009 12:00 AM | Report abuse

Pops

Posted by: Darnell1 | June 28, 2009 1:00 AM | Report abuse

Some FAs that could be in our price range...


Pops
Sheldon Williams
Wilcox
Hakim Warrick
Chris Mihm
Melvin Ely
Drew Gooden
Channing Frye
Stromile Swift
Joe Smith
Cedric Simmons

Posted by: Darnell1 | June 28, 2009 1:36 AM | Report abuse

The Wiz have as much as $7.5 million to offer a free agent. That opens up some options. If Rasheed Wallace is really looking to jump onboard an Eastern Conference contender, he might be willing to come back to DC. A rotation of him and Haywood at center would be pretty good, defensively. They could also easily both play on the floor together.

Personally, I still like the idea of trying to trade for Camby. James, Stevenson, and maybe that cash we got for the 32nd pick to sweaten the deal?

Posted by: segastyle | June 28, 2009 2:35 AM | Report abuse

Grunfeld is in trying-to-save-his-job mode, trying to put out a respectable, albeit mediocre team this year so the hammer doesn´t fall on him after a 19-win season. Problem is, he is no longer looking out for the long-term future of the team. He was willing to trade picks we could have used for Rubio and Blair for two average, but able to play now retreads in Miller and Foye. Niether of those two players is championship squad caliber. With the exception of being able to hit the three, which, if Arenas is healthy, we will be able to do anyway, none has the size or defensive skill we desperately need. Grunfeld is making desperate, head-scratching trades to save his job as the team he assembled has gotten progressively worse over the last three years. I don´t wan´t to hear about not having Arenas, Grunfeld signed Arenas to a six-year deal after all of his surgeries, knowing the risk). If you had told me we could have gotten Rubio AND Blair before teh draft, I´d have been ecstatic. Instead, we get mediocrity and absolutely nothing to be excited about next year. While I´m no season ticket holder, this team has lost my ten or season tickets a year.

Posted by: SammyT1 | June 28, 2009 4:01 AM | Report abuse

er, tickets...

Posted by: SammyT1 | June 28, 2009 4:02 AM | Report abuse

Next year's team should be better than mediocre.

Miller is 29 former 6th man of the year, and ROY. Yes, he's a great 3 pt shooter. But he's got a better skill set than just shooting from behind the arc. He's limited on the defensive end, but can contribute on offensive end -- especially in a Flip Saunders system.

Foye is also solid young player. Both would find a starting spot on most NBA teams. On elite teams they would find PT as primary back-ups, rotation players, and spot starters.

Time will tell, but Foye could turn out to be a sleeper in the Arenas mold. We'll find out whether Miller's down year last year was due to a decline in abilities, or the limits of being on a team that sucked.

Rubio could be a future All-Star, but the Wiz don't have the luxury of waiting and seeing for another three or four years. Blair could be a solid player too, but the Wiz probably can find a veteran through FA or a trade who can do more for the team this year.

A lot of this talk about going after sizzle and hype reminds me of the Snyder school of franchise building in the NFL. The Wiz dealt a somewhat risky prospect, one quality back-up, and two contracts in exchange for two solid NBA players with reality based contracts. My sense is that the Pros appreciate what EG has done. He's playing chess and the percentages. People think he should approach this like checkers and Mega Millions.

Posted by: JPRS | June 28, 2009 9:17 AM | Report abuse

This team right now (if healthy) can be very good. I think that we don't need some kind of blockbuster move for a big man. Big centers that score and lock down the opposition are $$$expenseve. All we need is a big body that can take the load off of Brendan for 10 - 15 min/game, play some D and get some boards. If he scores or not no biggie, that's not his job. We got a lot of scorers. Ernie can pick up someone like this for cheap. An undrafted FA, a foreigner, a D leaguer, all he has to do is play a little D & make life difficult for the Shaqs and Dwights for a few min/game.

Posted by: VBFan | June 28, 2009 9:53 AM | Report abuse

I think that we don't need some kind of blockbuster move for a big man.

Posted by: VBFan | June 28, 2009 9:53 AM

I agree 100%. I think that getting to the second round of the playoffs is way overrated. As long as we can put up a lot of points and get to the first round, I think it will be another blockbuster season for the Wizards. Love me some four-guard offensive fire.

Posted by: talent_evaluator | June 28, 2009 10:34 AM | Report abuse

Even though I am with the crowd that says Ernie pulled the deal too quick, I am not of the opinion it is a bad one. For sure, we should have gotten a lower 1st pick as a part of any deal, but the deal he made is not necessarily a bad one.

What do we have. BH/JM at 5. AJ/AB at 4. CB/DM/Miller at 3. NY/DS/MJ or Miller at 2 and GA/JC/Foye at 1.

The only dead weight left is MJ.

If JM is the real deal and I'm inclined to think yes, then the best piece we can add is a veteran power forward that can play good enough to give AJ time at the three, while AB and he handles the 4.

A good PF enhances this Team even more than what it is now. Ernie I believe did not want a rookie.

With our position now, we can offer any combination of DS, MJ, Foye, Miller for a vet PF.

JC I want to keep. The only big guy in the draft that can run and gun like I think this Team will be doing was Tyler Hansbrough. But the Wizards did not want him. He went 13. For, if they did want him, Ernie should have held his cards a little longer for a 1st rounder in return also.

However, the verdicts is still out on Ernie and my feelings is he will carry the day.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 28, 2009 11:29 AM | Report abuse

"you cannot disallow the fact if we had held fast till draft day, that it actually would have made our bargaining position stronger."

It's not a "fact" therefore it can quite easily be disallowed. If Rubio's agent followed through on his implied threat that he didn't want his client in DC and advised Rubio to stay in Spain (a la Juan Carlos Navarro) it would have obliterated any bargaining position the Wizards had. And there is absolutely no way to know which way it would have gone had they waited. You also have to consider the effect of the news regarding the Wizards trade had on other potential deals that were being discussed the day before the draft. If the Wiz had not made the deal, the landscape for deal making might have been quite different on draft day, and there's no way of knowing what else would or wouldn't have been on the table.

Strike while the iron is hot.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 28, 2009 12:33 PM | Report abuse

,i>"But we would have absolutely definitely positively been in a better initial bargaining position on THursday because we could guarantee that Rubio was there."

Wrong. Again. If you want to know why, re-read what I've already posted. or continue to live in ignorance and denial. All the same to me.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 28, 2009 12:35 PM | Report abuse

"But we would have absolutely definitely positively been in a better initial bargaining position on THursday because we could guarantee that Rubio was there."

Wrong. Again. If you want to know why, re-read what I've already posted. or continue to live in ignorance and denial. All the same to me.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 28, 2009 12:36 PM | Report abuse

Michael Lee's opening clause in his Sunday paper piece sets the wrong tone: "Since finishing a season that matched the worst in Washington Wizards history in mid-April, Ernie Grunfeld . . ." No one, I repeat, no one could have turned that season into a success in terms of wins and losses. Maybe more wins, maybe more development of the younguns and less PT for Jamison and Butler, but the freakish injury situation is NOT to be laid at EG's feet. I've come to expect such irrational blaming from a large percentage of the posters, but Michael Lee should be more measured. Yes, by article's end, Michael did balance things out, but that opening clause threw out the red meat for the "feel-first, think-not-at-all" crowd. I think it's in the interests of the team to have a smarter, more prudent and constructive fan base. The Wiz aren't the only ones with this problem. I have no doubt that the Knicks suffer worse. Those yahoos that booed Hill's being drafted Thursday hurt their team, I'm sure. Bad opinions expressed loudly and often enough can have an effect. I would wish that the team and its decision-makers would be completely uninfluenced by the negativity of the posters here. It has been suggested that some of these posters are really fans of other teams with a lot of time on their hands. Consider that as you read their negative posts.

I think EG and Flip are putting together a formidable team, and that Abe isn't being cheap at all. Barring another unusual injury situation, and assuming Gil's being back into something close to top form, this team is going to some noise. You downers out there will be required to post retractions. Get ready to eat the bird that sings "Caw! Caw!"

Posted by: 7snider7 | June 28, 2009 12:58 PM | Report abuse

"If Rubio's agent followed through on his implied threat that he didn't want his client in DC and advised Rubio to stay in Spain (a la Juan Carlos Navarro) it would have obliterated any bargaining position the Wizards had."

True that. But my point is to hold of on the deal til draft day. Actually drafting Rubio is not part of my Poker hand. Doesn't matter what Rubio's client advises; what matters is what the Wolves and Knicks think.

"Strike while the iron is hot."

True that also. But for sure the only thing that caused that iron to stop glowing was the deal.

If no deal done then the Iron would have continued to glow. Draft day/dealing was the only thing that could have turned the Iron cold and nothing else.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 28, 2009 1:38 PM | Report abuse

"True that. But my point is to hold of on the deal til draft day. Actually drafting Rubio is not part of my Poker hand. Doesn't matter what Rubio's client advises; what matters is what the Wolves and Knicks think."

Exactly my point. By making his pre-draft "comment" that he didn't think Rubio was a good fit in DC/playing with Arenas, Rubio's agent sent a very clear message to the Wolves, Knicks, and every other team in the NBA. The message being that his client would likely use the threat of staying in Spain to avoid playing for the Wizards. Once that was said, the Wizards bargaining position was severely and irrevocably undercut.

The only real leverage either side has in a negotiation comes from their ability to make the other side believe that they're willing to walk away from the table with no deal if they don't get what they want. The implied threat from Rubio's agent prior to the draft essentially robbed the Wizards of that ability. No GM was going to believe that they were willing to walk away from the table without a deal because they all knew that the Wiz would be running the very real risk of walking away with nothing in the event Rubio stayed in Spain: no trade, no Rubio, no pick, nothing.

Waiting until the day of the draft would not have changed that. In fact, the longer they waited/the closer the draft got, the worse their position would become. Because if they didn't make a deal before the draft, they'd have been forced into a position where they would have to either (A) draft a player they knew they had little to no chance to sign (and, as a result, had little chance to get a fair deal for in trade) or (B) pass on Rubio and draft another player who they didn't really want and then try to trade him for less than they could have gotten for Rubio before the draft .

If you don't think Grunfeld thought all of this through and that it factored into his decision to pull the trigger when he did, think again.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 28, 2009 2:03 PM | Report abuse

Fans are sleeping on Blatche. Does anyone remember how terrible he was when he first got here. He has clearly improved his game and there is potential for more. He can dribble a lil bit for a big. He's quick, young, and will soon be able to play good defense.

I just hope we hold onto him b/c he will blossom.

Posted by: Vicc | June 28, 2009 2:03 PM | Report abuse

As for big men:

Most of the names being thrown about are non-starters. They're either outside the Wizards' price range, unlikely to sing here to be backups whenn they could start elsewhere, or really not any good. (Seriously. Pops Mensah-Bonsu? Are we that desperate?)

One name that hasn't cropped up much but that could be both a solid fit and had for a reasonable price is Brandon Bass. He's be a very solid fit at backup PF. A bit undersized, maybe. But he's strong, quick, athletic, and tough. He's got a bit of Ben Wallace in him, except that he can actually shoot the ball. He should be very high on the shopping list.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 28, 2009 2:09 PM | Report abuse

To clarify:

When I said they were "non-starters" I didn't mean they couldn't start in the NBA. I meant that any effort by the Wiz to acquire them most likely weren't going to go anywhere.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 28, 2009 2:11 PM | Report abuse

"He's quick, young, and will soon be able to play good defense."

And you know this how?

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 28, 2009 2:12 PM | Report abuse

Yes, on second thought, a trade for either Amare, Chandler, or Kaman wouldn't be that sensible. Surely after making our big trade we are hoping that at least Foye will resign after the season, and between him, Haywood, Miller, and Butler next year, we will be strapped for cash. Maybe we can move Stevenson for a crappy expiring contract big man who can be pressed into service after our current 4. The only big name that makes sense, then, is Camby. A lesser player like Ike Diogu would please me as well.

Posted by: GshawnJohnson | June 28, 2009 2:28 PM | Report abuse

It's funny how haters love to diss a guy like Pops because he went undrafted and his NBA resume is paltry.

But there are dozens of undrafted guys who carve their way into the league and develop into quality role players for successful teams. Mike James was once that guy.

Why take the approach that we should only pay a proven vet? I'd rather have Pops on the upswing than hot-head RaWeed Wallace on the downswing. Again the Wizards only need a board-crashing, 240+ pound big to play spot minutes as long as Haywood, Jamison, McGee & Blatche are healthy.

What they don't need is a stubborn vet who wants to steal money on the backside of his career. Please spend wisely Big Ern!

Posted by: elfreako | June 28, 2009 2:32 PM | Report abuse

USA GOAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: jpt1002 | June 28, 2009 2:48 PM | Report abuse

"Exactly my point. By making his pre-draft "comment" that he didn't think Rubio was a good fit in DC/playing with Arenas, Rubio's agent sent a very clear message to the Wolves, Knicks, and every other team in the NBA. The message being that his client would likely use the threat of staying in Spain to avoid playing for the Wizards. Once that was said, the Wizards bargaining position was severely and irrevocably undercut."

The aforesaid does not validate your point atall, nor does it invalidate the point that the Wiz would not have had stronger leverage if they had waited til draft day.

Point is, it does not matter that Rubio has no intention of playing for the Wizards and would stay in Spain if they drafted him at the 5. Drafting him does not give the Wizards the leverage I am referring to.

What would have given the Wizards a stronger bargaining position on draft day is the simple fact that the Wolves and the Knicks wanted the Wizards position at the 5-slot to increase there chances of fulfilling there draft desires.

You are stuck on the fact of the Wizards actually drafting Rubio and then trading him. Thats not the deal. IT'S THE SLOT, not RUBIO. We are trading the 5-slot and we could have waited til draft day to do it and in a stronger position.

If your point about Rubio carried any water whatsoever, why would the Wolves agree to the deal in the first place. They agreed to the deal because they NEEDED the slot to get Rubio themselves. The Wolves/Knicks NEEDED the 5-slot. It had nothing to do with the fact that Rubio did not want to play here.

Come On Kal, Are You With Me Know?

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 28, 2009 3:26 PM | Report abuse

"He's quick, young, and will soon be able to play good defense."

And you know this how?

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 28, 2009 2:12 PM


There is an old adage: Practice makes perfect; it's how these athletes made it to the NBA if the first place.

Posted by: Vicc | June 28, 2009 3:29 PM | Report abuse

"But there are dozens of undrafted guys who carve their way into the league and develop into quality role players for successful teams. Mike James was once that guy."

Would this be the same Mike James who's spent his career being passed around like a bong at a frat party? James had exactly one season of any real impact in the NBA, as a short minutes, 3rd string PG on the Pistons title team. Since then he's been a vagabond journeyman who's build his "resume" by putting up numbers on lousy teams. Now, it appears, he can't even do that anymore. If he's the best you could come up with by way of example, you're in trouble.

"It's funny how haters love to diss a guy like Pops because he went undrafted and his NBA resume is paltry."

Couldn't care less about him being undrafted, but his NBA resume isn't just paltry. It's blank. He's done a grand total of nothing in the NBA. Does that mean he can't develop into something? Of course not. But then no one said that. The obvious point is that he is a project, and the Wizards are not in need of any more projects.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 28, 2009 3:32 PM | Report abuse

"There is an old adage: Practice makes perfect; it's how these athletes made it to the NBA if the first place."

Which assumes that Blatche has been practicing playing defense. His 4 years in the NBA to this point offer absolutely zero evidence of that.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 28, 2009 3:34 PM | Report abuse

"The aforesaid does not validate your point atall, nor does it invalidate the point that the Wiz would not have had stronger leverage if they had waited til draft day."

Actually, it does both quite well.

"You are stuck on the fact of the Wizards actually drafting Rubio and then trading him. Thats not the deal. IT'S THE SLOT, not RUBIO. We are trading the 5-slot and we could have waited til draft day to do it and in a stronger position."

Ridiculous. The slot is meaningless, in and of itself. The only reason they were interested in the slot was because it afforded a better chance to draft Rubio. Claiming otherwise is pure nonsense.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 28, 2009 3:37 PM | Report abuse

The closer the Wizards got to the draft without a deal, the closer they got to being in position where they'd have to draft Rubio and run the risk of losing all of their leverage if he tried to hold them hostage by threatening to stay in Spain. The longer they waited, the worse their position became. Simple and obvious, really.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 28, 2009 3:38 PM | Report abuse

"If he's the best you could come up with by way of example, you're in trouble."

Just using him as an example of a guy who was once quite cost effective per his production KRam.

Other undrafted studs include:
Brad Miller
Ben Wallace
Bruce Bowen
Udonis Haslem

Hopefully they bolster my point.


Also, keep in mind the Josh Childress factor. If a veteran guy feels snubbed this offseason with a low-ball offer he may bolt for overseas cash. I would advise Ernie & Co. to borrow the Dan Snyder model for next month's activities:

Target your guy and come strong.

Posted by: elfreako | June 28, 2009 3:52 PM | Report abuse

EG is not finished so don't judge the moves yet. Clearly he wants to get a big in free agency. If he had waited till the last minute for the trade, Wolves gotten a better offer and then he had to draft Rubio who would decide to stay in Spain, I can just hear all these posters whining about the act that EG is not aggressive enough. LET THE MAN DO HIS JOB. He has a plan.

I am convinced that he has targeted a big. As usual he is quite closed-mouthed about who it is... and that is probably good.

July is just around the corner. Patience people!

BmoreRev

Posted by: stanlong23 | June 28, 2009 4:39 PM | Report abuse

These guys really do, and did, their homework. Instead of all of the hacks recommending who the wiz should pick up, check this out.

http://www.bulletsforever.com/2009/6/28/928038/2009-unrestricted-free-agents-who

Posted by: Copious1 | June 28, 2009 4:55 PM | Report abuse

This trade worked for the Wizzies. Just like a lot of posters here wanted Etan Thomas, Darius Songaila and Oleksiy Pecherov are gone. The #5 pick is gone also. Wishing Ernie waited to trade the pick may have hurt his bargaing position. It looks to me that Minnesota had an inkling that getting Rubio to play there may not happen --- note their 6th pick. Maybe they think if Rubio won't play here then we have another rookie point we'll plug in. It was a good posture for them to take. Basically they are saying if you won't play here then we have a PG who will.
Aren't you happy that the Wizzies ain't in that position. I can't imagine this board if they hadda drafted RR.

Posted by: VBFan | June 28, 2009 5:01 PM | Report abuse

"As for big men: Most of the names being thrown about are non-starters. They're either outside the Wizards' price range, unlikely to sing here to be backups whenn they could start elsewhere, or really not any good." - kalo_rama

I agree, but I think none of the above applies to Camby or Wallace. Wallace can't make any more money signing with Boston or Cleveland, unless a sign-and-trade is involved. Both he and Campy would start for us, with Haywood then being a very excellent backup. Actually, even better, is that Camby or Wallace could play a more manageable amount of minutes, keeping them fresher for the offseason.

"One name that hasn't cropped up much but that could be both a solid fit and had for a reasonable price is Brandon Bass. He's be a very solid fit at backup PF. A bit undersized, maybe. But he's strong, quick, athletic, and tough. He's got a bit of Ben Wallace in him, except that he can actually shoot the ball. He should be very high on the shopping list."

I agree that he could be a solid backup PF. Though I'm not convinced that he would be any better than Blatche. More importantly though, seeing that he's 24 and there is some interest in him by multiple teams, his price could be higher than we want. We could find ourselves locking up an average backup player for 4-5 million dollars a year for 5 seasons. Whereas a trade for Camby would free us up after this season, or a signing of Wallace, while probably for the full 7.5 mil, would probably only be for 2-3 seasons, max. If we could land Brass for closer to $3 mil a year, I'd be all for it. I'd still suggest that we make overtures to LA for Camby in addition.

I'm also focusing on immediate impact over next season and maybe the season after that, since that seems to be the main goal of the Wizards at the moment. While we have capable starters at the 4 and 5 spots, we'd be a much better team finding a player even better at one of those spots and moving the current guy to the backup role than we would bringing in a guy who would merely be battling for the backup position. Since finding someone 'better' than Jamison at the 4 pretty much means finding a current All-Star level PF, the more realistic option is finding a guy better than Haywood. Since both Camby and Wallace can legitimately play the 4 and 5 spots, they become even that much more useful for us. We'd be able to but one of them and Haywood on the court together, creating a pretty formidable defensive front line.

Posted by: segastyle | June 28, 2009 5:21 PM | Report abuse

Kwame Brown is the best pickup this year. Eddie Jordan Regime is gone and i bet the core . Fits the budget fills the need.
I think from Day One Rubio would have been the most mature guard on the team. Bad luck that he fell.

Posted by: Chocolate_City | June 28, 2009 5:47 PM | Report abuse

Can definitely see the wiz signing Antonio McDyess. It's about time we took a former Piston and won with him, like they've done to us so many god damn times.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 28, 2009 6:23 PM | Report abuse

"EG is not finished so don't judge the moves yet. Clearly he wants to get a big in free agency. If he had waited till the last minute for the trade, Wolves gotten a better offer and then he had to draft Rubio who would decide to stay in Spain, I can just hear all these posters whining about the act that EG is not aggressive enough. LET THE MAN DO HIS JOB. He has a plan.

I am convinced that he has targeted a big. As usual he is quite closed-mouthed about who it is... and that is probably good.

July is just around the corner. Patience people!

BmoreRev

Posted by: stanlong23 | June 28, 2009 4:39 PM "

Patience? EG is not finished yet?

Yeah, not finished with getting rid of the people/contracts that he brought into the Les BouleS organization to begin with.

DSong - Yes, EG brought him here..gone.
OPech - Yes, EG drafted him here...gone.
ET - Yes, EG matched a ridiculous 40+ mil contract with poison pill trade clause...gone.

Mike James - Yes, EG brought him here after the failed experiment with Dee Brown Jr. after he let Mason walk...will be gone.

Dee Brown Jr. - Not more needs to be said except...gone.

Still here, but still ridiculous:

MeTawn - $50 mil..after signing this contract, helped Les BouleS head straight to the lottery.

Gilby - $127 mil max money offer by EG...after 2 knee surgeries...immediately had another one right afterwards.

MeShawn - $14 mil lottery ticket provided by EG after nobody else bid for his services...2 year shooting slump...ended early last season with bad back...notorious for calling LeBron overrated, but couldn't back it up.

AB - $14 mil lottery ticket also provided by EG after being arrested for soliciting prostitution and no other team bid for his services.

EG Draft hall of fame:

Peter John Ramos - Who dat?

Bill Walker - $750k cha ching in Abe's piggy bank

Ricky Rubio - $2.5 mil cha ching in Abe's piggy bank...don't count on any of this money being used for any MLE or such

Devin Harris - no comment

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 28, 2009 6:28 PM | Report abuse

Character, Commitment, Connection - Wiz motto

More like Cheap, Cheezy, and Confused

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 28, 2009 6:33 PM | Report abuse

Character, Commitment, Connection - Wiz motto

More like Cheap, Cheezy, and Confused

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 28, 2009 6:33 PM

Now now DC_MAN, you know Kal gets paid to be the Wizards PR man. You don't want to put him out of a job do you?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 28, 2009 6:56 PM | Report abuse

"Now now DC_MAN, you know Kal gets paid to be the Wizards PR man. You don't want to put him out of a job do you?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 28, 2009 6:56 PM "

Anybody working for the Les BouleS PR office will be earning their money this season in trying to dupe fans to come back.

Singles nights, family nights, 13 game see other team's all star packages, etc.

Next thing you'll see to attract more fans is a Sen. Craig bathroom hookup night, glory hole night, and Marion Barry crack pipe giveaway night.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 28, 2009 7:53 PM | Report abuse

I dont think Ernie is going to spend big on a big at this point--but maybe later in the season if conditions are ripe.
...I think its more than likely the Wiz are looking at adding tried and true 10+ year role playing veterans who can sit on the bench and be ready when needed and can be had for near the vet min. Now this may change come trading deadline time and the Wiz find themselves in one of the top 4 spots in the east, and somebody is looking for a MJames salary dump and/or an AB,JC, or NY package for a nice starting caliber PF or C. But I think for training camp and the start of the season the Wiz are probably looking at something like two of these type players:
PF Joe Smith - clutch rebounder and can still score when open
C Adonal Foyle - 6 strong fouls for Superman I & 6 strong fouls for Superman II
PF Antonie McDyess - still McNasty enough underneath to make WaaaBron weep

Or optimistically if our PF in waiting in Russia, V2, looks much improved during summer league, perhaps the Wiz partially guarantee his salary (can they do that?) and just take one of the above type players in FA.

Anybody know when the Wiz select their team for summer league and when the play starts?

Posted by: oddjob2 | June 28, 2009 8:29 PM | Report abuse

Mike- Any news on our Summer League roster? I hear we have signed PG, Tyrese Rice from BC, but that's about it

Posted by: mohammed10 | June 28, 2009 8:58 PM | Report abuse

i think foye and miller are going to play well for wiz, they both are in their contract season, They also do not have a pressure since they are playing along the so called big 3.
What i would like to see what flip is going to do in creating a system that improve perimeter defense and avoiding quick shoots.
There are a lot of big men as FA or by trade, it is fine to wait even until the trade dead line .They need two big men, one with veterans minimum like joe smith or any big body with good experiance from D legue. They have to shop very well for the FA. They will definately jump on a trade that could inviolve Ny or JC if the big man is some body that could try tostop shaq. or Haward.

Posted by: gtefferra | June 28, 2009 9:51 PM | Report abuse

"Would this be the same Mike James who's spent his career being passed around like a bong at a frat party?"

One of the better lines I've read on this board, Kal.

Posted by: Prazak | June 28, 2009 10:10 PM | Report abuse

p1funk

I said as you quoted:

I just think that teams will not be able to keep up with the Wiz offensively.

Yes, the defense is lacking. We do have 4 shotblockers to protect the paint in Haywood, McGee, Blatche, and McGuire so it aint like it will be layup city for teams.

The pressure will on other teams not to miss. Like the Patriots in football, you'd better score touchdowns cause field goals aint gonna help you keep up. The 49ers under Montana/Young were like that too.

Posted by: G-Man11 | June 26, 2009 1:37 PM

For whom exactly has the run-and-gun permieter philosphy worked well for in the NBA to deliver a championship? It didn't work for Ernie's Bucks, it didn't work for the Suns, it hasn't worked for Cleveland. And I'd say all those teams have more talent on the perimeter than we do.

posted by P1funk

My rebuttal: I never said the Wizards would employ a run and gun philosophy. What I mean is that teams will find it hard to "get stops" against the wizards. The Wizards have a hard time getting stops themselves, but with the offensive depth of the Wizards, thru the second team made up of 5 between these players: McGee, Blatche, Nick Young, Foye or Miller, Critt, McGuire, will increase leads against other teams second units and we already know what the first string is capable of offensively.

I don't mean to imply that they will employ a Paul Westhead Nuggets/Loyola Marymount offensive strategy. If teams first unit are good enough to keep up with the wizards first unit, there second units will have to keep up also. Keeping in mind the first unit will also have a legitimate offensive threat at two-guard now and an improved Haywood, something a healthy Big 3 never had.

With LeBron picking up Shaq, they will pose problems, but that is their first unit, what about the second unit? Same for Orlando and Boston.

Let me make clear that by my saying that

Posted by: G-Man11 | June 29, 2009 8:43 AM | Report abuse

chris sheridan's got a nice article bout the knicks looking to trade with minny. there's also a good article on there about minny's gm and why he took rubio. i forget the name of the writer for the second article, but they've both got some decnt info.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 29, 2009 9:56 AM | Report abuse

"I agree, but I think none of the above applies to Camby or Wallace. "

And, for the umpteenth time, Wallace is not going to play for Saunders and Saunders does not want Wallace playing for him. They couldn't stand each other in Detroit and Rasheed's visceral and visible lack of respect for Saunders' authority probably cost the Pistons at least on extra title. Add to that the fact that he's old and his skills and body have been visibly deteriorating for the last couple of years.

Not going to happen.

"I agree that he could be a solid backup PF. Though I'm not convinced that he would be any better than Blatche."

You would be if you watched him play. Bass has everything that Blatche notably lacks: toughness, aggression, a fast motor, and a work ethic on the court. Is he as talented overall as Blatche? Maybe not, but talent only counts when it's put to use. Blatche has spent most of the past 4 years pissing his away.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 29, 2009 10:35 AM | Report abuse

As for DaJuan Blair, if he racks up fewer that 45 DNP-CDs next season, I'll be shocked.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 29, 2009 10:45 AM | Report abuse

"Hopefully they bolster my point. "

Not really because, as I said, the fact that Pops was undrafted is irrelevant. The fact that he's a development project who's probably years away from being an NBA contributor (if ever) is highly relevant.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 29, 2009 10:48 AM | Report abuse

For those blasting EG about not waiting longer to pull the trigger on the trade, please consider how damaging it would have been to have been faced with the prospect of having RR available at No. 5. First, his agent had made it clear he did not him to play here. Second, other teams knew that he didn't want to play here and had the option of staying in Europe. The value of our No. 5 pick would have only cratered once we got to draft day and it was apparent that we'd have to pick RR.

It's also very telling that Minny picked Johnny Flynn at No. 6, likely knowing that they would be unable to sign Rubio or wanted some leverage if they decided to trade him. I seriously doubt Rubio will ever suit up in Minny and will end with a team of his choosing after a deal is worked out. I wouldn't be surprised if he ends in NY before the end of the summer.

Posted by: wizfan89 | June 29, 2009 10:52 AM | Report abuse

"You would be if you watched him play. Bass has everything that Blatche notably lacks: toughness, aggression, a fast motor, and a work ethic on the court." - kalo_rama

I have seen him play, which is what formed my opinion. He is a completely different type of player than Blatche. Regardless, it doesn't change the fact that he could be a relatively expensive and long-term contract pickup. And whether or not he improves the bench, that's not enough to make us a significantly better team.


"And, for the umpteenth time, Wallace is not going to play for Saunders and Saunders does not want Wallace playing for him. Add to that the fact that he's old and his skills and body have been visibly deteriorating for the last couple of years."

Old and deteriorating or not, he still performs better than Haywood on the floor. His superior quickness for his size has allowed him to be a player in his older age. Camby has the same physical gift and luck.

Whether or not the team wants Wallace along with his attitude, I can see being an issue. But my whole point was that if he signed here, it would be as a starter, and he would be fairly good at that. Camby would be my preferred route, as it would involve trading salaries, not adding, and wouldn't prevent us from also signing Bass to compete at the 4 spot, where he really belongs.

Posted by: segastyle | June 29, 2009 11:17 AM | Report abuse

"He is a completely different type of player than Blatche"

Exactly my point. Bass is the kind of player they need at PF, a tough, physical guy who does the dirty work inside. Blatche is a soft jumpshooter who thinks he's a guard.

"Regardless, it doesn't change the fact that he could be a relatively expensive and long-term contract pickup. "

Bass is coming off a season where he was making less than $1 mill/yr. And while he put up solid numbers in a supporting role, it's not like he had an all-star season. To suggest they'd have to break the bank to sign him is ridiculous. He'd be a solid, effective, low cost pickup.

"Old and deteriorating or not, he still performs better than Haywood on the floor."

That's debatable, at best. Last season Wallace averaged 12 and 7 and shot 42% in 32 mpg. When he was last healthy for a full season, Haywood averaged 10 and 7 and shot 53% in just under 28 mpg.

"His superior quickness for his size has allowed him to be a player in his older age."

And if you'd watched him play frequently the last couple of seasons you'd see that age and injuries have largely robbed him of that "superior quickness."

Wallace has been coasting on his rep for at least the past couple of years. His production has declined as has his effort, and he's gone missing in the playoffs when the Pistons needed him most. He's not nearly the player anymore that people who haven't been following the Pistons closely since they won the title seem to think he is.

"Camby would be my preferred route, as it would involve trading salaries, not adding, and wouldn't prevent us from also signing Bass to compete at the 4 spot, where he really belongs."

Now you're contradicting yourself. You just said you didn't want Bass because he'd be too expensive and wouldn't really improve the team. Now you're saying they can get Camby and sign Bass?

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 29, 2009 11:39 AM | Report abuse


http://www.bulletsforever.com/2009/6/28/928038/2009-unrestricted-free-agents-who

Posted by: Copious1 | June 28, 2009 4:55 PM

This is great...I like Nesto, Gooden and McDyess. I could also be wrong, but Birdman reminded me of Tyron Lue. Lue made his name in the playoffs getting as close to shutting down The Criminal as anyone could back then. Since that Finals, he has been a solid back up at best. Just sayin'.

Also, everyone is acting like last season's 19 wins was with our current roster available. What is the biggest turnaround in wins from one season to the next? 1997 to 1998, the season the Spurs drafted Duncan.

Yes Duncan was amazing right out of the gate, but remember why the Spurs qwere so bad - - The Admiral had been injured almost all or all of the prior season!

So, if your best player misses the season, you might expect to lose some games and if he returns healthy (from what I hear, he is), you can expect to win them again.

So what happens when you lose 3 starters for most of the season and another for 20 games? You get a 19 win season.

What happens when they come back healthy and you upgraded two positions? you win 50 + games and get to the conference finals.

Yes we need another big or two, but this is a good team.

Posted by: Blurred | June 29, 2009 1:40 PM | Report abuse

One more thing. I am not completely discounting McGee this season. I think he needs to next year to be a real presence, but I am hoping he comes around a little early. Can we get some reliable updates about him and Blatche? Those two are key for next year.

If McGee gets a little court sense and adds 20 lbs, he can more than hold his own. Blatche needs to figure out how not to foul. When he has gotten hot, the opponent just drives at him and he picks up 3 quick ones and has to sit.

Posted by: Blurred | June 29, 2009 1:58 PM | Report abuse

Run and Gun to the Hoop and if the Defense don't stop it, 2 points in Ya' face, and if the Defense is smart enough to stop it, we gonna go set on you and still score 2 points in Ya' face.

Don't worry about this Team be all Run and Gun and no substance/set, we gonna do both and we gonna do it well.

Its gonna' be shake and bake basketball baby and shake is my run and bake is my set and if you can't figure out how this is gonna get you to a championship, you beddar' look at some basketball history, or beddar' yet...

YA' BEDDAR' ASK' SOMEBODY'!

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 29, 2009 2:09 PM | Report abuse

Michael,
Can we get some new posts to your blog please. At least start a new thread about our search for a big man. Ivan kept it flowing, let's try and keep that same pace please.

We are dying to hear anything you are hearing about options for a Big. I am sure Ernie reads your entries so let's get some ideas flowing. Thanks.

Posted by: DeepThreat | June 29, 2009 2:53 PM | Report abuse


DeepThreat,

What else is there to say? Mike already laid out the Wizards are going to try and trade Mike James contract perhaps for a veteran older big-man and in the free agent market. Mike also listed the possible players the Wizards are targeting. Bottom line, Abe ain't going over the luxury tax!!! so don't expect Iverson, G. Hill, B. Gordon, Gooden or Odom to come to DC. David Alridge made a good point with the Wizards, they'll likely get a older vet in a Mike James trade and play with the team the way it's assembled. If Mike Miller doesn't pan out here Ernie will look to trade him (and possibly Stevenson) before the trading deadline....that's pretty much all the news for the summer.


Okay Mike, my question is when will the Wizards begin their summer league and who will be on the team?


Posted by: rcnasa | June 29, 2009 4:01 PM | Report abuse

Anyone know how much someone like Millsap will be asking for? I'm guessing $7.5 mil is not going to be enough.

Posted by: segastyle | June 29, 2009 4:13 PM | Report abuse

With the Wizards free agency, as I mentioned before, Abe is not going to pay over the luxury tax so I'm not expecting a huge name coming to DC. I am curious to know if the NY Knicks will let Wilcox walk, I don't think they will but if so, the Wizards should jump on him hard. Otherwise I see someone like Joe Smith or Mikki Moore coming to the Wizards. I would love to see the Wizards go after Rasheed Wallace. But Wallace will prob go to a team like the Orlando or Miami plus it would cost too much to get him...damn this off season sucks...we can only hope everyone is healthy this upcoming season.

Posted by: rcnasa | June 29, 2009 4:33 PM | Report abuse

Here's a guy that may be a fit for Les BouleS at the 4. He's got some size (height), but may be a bit light. He's not expensive, and has got good pedigree too.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4295423

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/stats?playerId=2792

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 29, 2009 4:51 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 29, 2009 4:57 PM | Report abuse

What's Charlie Villanueva cost now that he's out there?

Posted by: justice98 | June 29, 2009 5:11 PM | Report abuse

Go after Villanueva!! He's gonna be a free agent!!! We get younger, and get our PF/C that we need.

Get it done Grunfeld

Posted by: Broman17 | June 29, 2009 5:18 PM | Report abuse

Bottom line, Abe ain't going over the luxury tax!!! so don't expect Iverson, G. Hill, B. Gordon, Gooden or Odom to come to DC. David Alridge made a good point with the Wizards, they'll likely get a older vet in a Mike James trade and play with the team the way it's assembled. If Mike Miller doesn't pan out here Ernie will look to trade him (and possibly Stevenson) before the trading deadline....that's pretty much all the news for the summer.


Okay Mike, my question is when will the Wizards begin their summer league and who will be on the team?

Posted by: rcnasa

According to the "experts" last week, the Wiz will be paying the luxury tax.

Posted by: Lisa_R | June 29, 2009 5:39 PM | Report abuse

rcnasa,

Abe is already paying the luxury tax next season. You didn't know that?

That's why a first rounder who's not gonna see the court (at $2.7M a year, equivalent to $5.4M) makes no sense. That's why trading that pick (plus dead weight) in return for starting-quality vets makes sense.

That's why a second rounder that's not gonna see the court (for $800k a year, equivalent to $1.6M) makes absolutely no sense... That's why selling that pick for $2.5M (equivalent to $4.1M since you also don't have to pay aforementioned second rounder) makes sense.

Total savings: $9.5M. If you include the slight salary savings from the minny trade, its a grand total of $10.1M in savings.

the Wiz have $75M on the books next season. Projected lux tax threshold is $65M.

EG shrewdly paid for the lux tax hit while SIGNIFICANTLY upgrading the PG/SG/SF positions.

Posted by: jones-y | June 29, 2009 5:47 PM | Report abuse

Only thing remains is to get a quality big, and a roster-filling big.

Most likely EG trades salary for salary to get a quality big, and then brings in a roster filler like some veteran-minimum caliber guy, or Vermeenko, or maybe even an NDBL player.

The other option is for Abe to open the purse one more time to sign a good FA using the MLE.

They've got plenty of time to pull it off. The season doesn't start for another 4 months.

Posted by: jones-y | June 29, 2009 5:52 PM | Report abuse

The Wiz don't need anybody special, just a big body that can give just enough for 10-15 minutes a night. There's a ton of those guys out there. Drew Gooden, Zaza Pachulia, Sean May, Rasho Nesteroic, Chris Wilcox, Jamal Magloire, Chris Mihm, Brandon Bass. Any of those guys could be had for cheap.

I think Gooden would work best, he's big and productive off the bench and costs less than $2 mil.

Posted by: justice98 | June 29, 2009 6:09 PM | Report abuse

Don't forget that if we sign a FA for the full MLE, we will be paying more for him than we're paying for CB. And Drew Gooden therefore will cost $4M...

I really expect a trade or sign-and-trade.

Posted by: jones-y | June 29, 2009 6:17 PM | Report abuse

Brendan Haywood was on sports radio, 980 today and he seemed to be leaning towards us not really getting anyone. He basically said he hoped that McGee has improved, that he has been working out and all. And he said something about saving money, the economy, and having money for the players, vets?? He also said that Etan didnt really hang or socialize with the team and that, he stayed to himself and he thinks he will have a better chance in Minnesota. I believe his interview is on their website.

Posted by: washwiz | June 29, 2009 6:51 PM | Report abuse

Hmm, no insider update for three days?

Right after the draft? With teams making and contemplating moves. E.g, the Bucks with Villanueva?

Hmm, things can't be that slow, can they?

Posted by: SteveMG | June 29, 2009 9:19 PM | Report abuse

NEW THREAD PLEASE!!! GIVE US SOME KIND OF UPDATE.

Posted by: Copious1 | June 29, 2009 11:05 PM | Report abuse

Here's a potential big man pickup for the Wizards: Milwaukee is letting Charlie Villenueva walk so they can keep Ramon Sessions. 6'11" PF, averaged almost 17 ppg and 7 rpg last year. Really good shooting touch and a variety of face-up and post moves. Made $3.4 mil last year. The only problem is that he might be worth more money than the Wiz have available.

Posted by: pjkiger1 | June 30, 2009 12:08 AM | Report abuse

Villenueva would be a great pickup...but not exactly what we need, and the Cavs want him. We need a guy to rebound and defend, charlie is more a scorer.

thank God ernie was too smart to fall for the rubio NONSENSE. we need to make just one move for a cheap vet and we are better this season than ANY player in the draft would have made us.

Posted by: divi3 | June 30, 2009 12:51 AM | Report abuse

Do we have the money to make a play for Villanueva!??!?! He's exactly what we need!

Posted by: msveasey | June 30, 2009 1:53 AM | Report abuse

The Wiz don't need anybody special, just a big body that can give just enough for 10-15 minutes a night. There's a ton of those guys out there. Drew Gooden, Zaza Pachulia, Sean May, Rasho Nesteroic, Chris Wilcox, Jamal Magloire, Chris Mihm, Brandon Bass. Any of those guys could be had for cheap.

I think Gooden would work best, he's big and productive off the bench and costs less than $2 mil.

Posted by: justice98 | June 29, 2009 6:09 PM

I like what Justice98 said. Drew Gooden is my favorite for the Wiz. How good would it be for the Wiz to have Gooden to help beat the Cavaliers at playoff time. He played pretty well against us. He has size, can rebound, is physical, and can score. We should not wait until later to get him. Gooden would be less threatening to Haywood since he wouldn't be competing to be the starting center. We should get him at the beginning of free agency if possible.

A trade for Marcus Camby would be great also.

Posted by: JoeC2 | June 30, 2009 4:44 AM | Report abuse

There is a ton of vindication to go around for the Wiz and EG. Just the shear volume of names being tossed around as good and viable frontcourt backups is already some vindication for the supposed "blunder" in not drafting Blair. Also, Minnesota is just starting the process of dealing with RR and his ability to dictate whether or where he wants to play this season. This from an 18 year old with some great upside but no outside shot and limited athletic ability. He'll get destroyed on the offensive side of the ball as well for the foreseeable future. Nothing I want to deal with as a fan!

The final vindication will be when the Wiz end up with 50 wins and a solid 3/4 seed in the East. Sorry, but O'Neal to Cleveland does nothing to help their over the hill frontcourt and Carter to Orlando is suspect as well. I think Orlando is much better off with Turkoglu. Boston is going to be the head honcho again with health, but it's almost certainly their last hurrah. So, a solid run this year and a strong push to reach the finals the following season is not out of the realm of possibility. I think it's very possible if GA and the gang stay healthy.

Posted by: rphilli721 | June 30, 2009 5:47 AM | Report abuse

For whom exactly has the run-and-gun permieter philosphy worked well for in the NBA to deliver a championship? It didn't work for Ernie's Bucks, it didn't work for the Suns, it hasn't worked for Cleveland. And I'd say all those teams have more talent on the perimeter than we do.

And if you don't think Washington is lay-up city, you haven't been watching the team lately.

Posted by: p1funk | June 26, 2009 1:44 PM
_____

I generally agree with your perimeter philosophy comment, but I think your forgetting the team that just played the Lakers in the finals and if they had not blown the game in LA could have won it or taken it to 7 games. Orlando was as perimeter oriented as it gets. In fact, I don't see this team as being nearly as perimeter oriented as Orlando was. The Wiz have many more players capable of getting to the rim.

As for defense, McGuire is good, hopefully, DS can play well again and Haywood being back is a huge improvement in defending the paint. We may have a lot of Guards/SF's, but most are taller. For instance, a backcourt of GA and MM is a huge backcourt! Anyway, I look forward to a great season with a much deeper squad than we've seen here in a long time including the Hibatchi heyday.

Posted by: rphilli721 | June 30, 2009 6:15 AM | Report abuse

What do you guyes think about Charlie Villanueva of the bucks? the didn't extend his contract and he is a FA in 2009 and his salary is 3.5 mill... 16.2 points and 6.7 rebounds and he is listed as a 6'11.

Posted by: Goelez | June 30, 2009 7:02 AM | Report abuse

RPHILLI721. FOR SURE MATE.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 30, 2009 7:04 AM | Report abuse

I really don't think Charlie Villanueva will sign for 3.5 mil anymore...

Posted by: WizForLifePilipinas | June 30, 2009 8:01 AM | Report abuse

That was in response to Goelez's comment btw.

Posted by: WizForLifePilipinas | June 30, 2009 8:09 AM | Report abuse

Hey Wizard fans.....no news is good news since that means the Wizards will not have to spend anymore money!

Anyone who thinks they are going to use their full MLE on a big guy, I want you to know I have some ocean front property in Arizona for sale.

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 30, 2009 8:32 AM | Report abuse

I say we get Villanueva

Posted by: noluvdr | June 30, 2009 8:49 AM | Report abuse

"The Wiz don't need anybody special, just a big body that can give just enough for 10-15 minutes a night. There's a ton of those guys out there. Drew Gooden, Zaza Pachulia, Sean May, Rasho Nesteroic, Chris Wilcox, Jamal Magloire, Chris Mihm, Brandon Bass. Any of those guys could be had for cheap."

That is .500 ball thinking right there. Many talkbackers seem to think that assembling a team is just about filling in needs with competent/semi-competent players. Our team has sucked so long that too many fans now aspire to mediocrity. Meanwhile, teams with championship histories/ambitions, trade for the big boys - O'Neal, Jefferson, Gasol, etc. - or use draft picks to nab players with star potential.

Since July 2005 - four years ago, when he got us Butler - Grunfeld has neither brought in a single superior starting five player through a trade, nor drafted one. Think about it: (No) Pech (s), the still maddeningly immature Young, Mike friggin' James, Dom could-develop-into-an acceptable-role/bench-player Mcguire, Meshawn (nuff said), Javaris desperately-needs-a-jump-shot Crittendon and Mcgee, who doesn't have a pure position but could develop into something yet. Add to that a disappointing lottery pick Foye, who has a known, average ceiling and Miller, a slow,zero-D shooter on the downside of his career. That's it folks, that's what Grunfeld has done these last four years (not to mention signed some really awful contracts). GMs can have bad years, even two in row and still right the ship. But four? Honestly, how can anyone defend his performance? It has to be one of the worst 4-year runs by any current NBA team. People in here really need to demand more from our GM and this team, lest Abe & Co. continue to give us bunk product.

Posted by: SammyT1 | June 30, 2009 8:57 AM | Report abuse

Old Abe might be getting smarter. Putting that 2.5 mil in his pocket is looking better with each passing day. How much interest is that BF78.

BF78, looks like he might be cheap, but a dummy he ain't.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | June 30, 2009 9:00 AM | Report abuse

The acquisition of Miller and Foye is a very solid move from Ernie. They make us better right now, and are expiring contracts- players tend to have career years in that situation. No player in the draft aside from maybe griffin would have helped us as much as these two, this year.

Injury has derailed us for 2 seasons now, this is a 45-50 win team when healthy.

You wanna see a bad GM, look at what's happened in Minnesota

Posted by: divi3 | June 30, 2009 9:14 AM | Report abuse

ps- Foye is a very good defender at 1 and 2, while miller hits 40% from downtown.

Make that a 55 win team if we can get a workmanlike 6'10" PF!

Posted by: divi3 | June 30, 2009 9:18 AM | Report abuse

Larry,

The "modern" NBA salary cap began in 1984-85 and since this is considering this is the first year the Wizards are over the luxury cap, the other owners (who were willing to take a chance to win a championship) have subsidized Cheap Abe for 25 years!

It's not like they planned on going over the cap! Nobody knew revenues would fall last year. People have finally gotten smarter and quit giving up their hard earned money to support guys like Cheap Abe and the cry baby millionaires who refuse to play the game the right way (that means playing both offense and defense).

Yes, I know the Wizards posting boy kal will come on here and try to spin Abe’s cheapness the way Rush would try and tell you there are still weapons of mass destruction in Iraq!

Good luck kal, try to explain the last 25 years?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 30, 2009 9:31 AM | Report abuse

Brandon Bass is 6'6.25", 246. He's strong and athletic but undersized for PF. He's Maxiell Lite.
If we're gonna go for an undersized but strong PF, we may as well use our second round pick for DeJuan Blair because he's cheaper and not guaranteed.
Oh that's right, we PASSED on him.

BTW, doing a side by side comparison, Blair and Bass each have the same standing reach of 8'10.5".
They both were able to bench 18 times during the pre-draft test.
Their max vertical was identical at 33". Blair was slightly faster in the agility test while Bass was slightly faster in the sprint.

Sounds to me like if we're looking for a big man, we had a choice between a non guaranteed rookie player of the year candidate and a more expensive vet to be named later who will eat up cap space. We chose the vet. Is the 2.5 million we saved gonna pay for the veteran salary? Nope. We'll probably wind up paying the full midlevel.

Great job, Ernie.

Posted by: original_mark | June 30, 2009 9:36 AM | Report abuse

Milwaukee non-tendered Charlie Villanueva yesterday which makes him a unrestricted FA. He's definitely a cut above the current crop of available FA bigmen, although I would think he'd want the full MLE to play here. He's a legit 6 11" PF with good size who can score and rebound. I haven't seen him enough to evaluate his defensive skills, but would think he'd be better than AJ when matched against other large PF's. I hope EG has him on his radar screen as he's likely to get a lot of attention starting July 1st.

Posted by: wizfan89 | June 30, 2009 9:44 AM | Report abuse

Marcin Gortat should be on the list with Drew Gooden and Marcus Camby for big man help for the Wiz. There probably will be more competition for Gortat and for a trade for Camby. In free agency I know the longer they wait the lower the price. But the longer they wait the less desirable the player will be. I hope they can get a good player soon. How about Gooden?

Posted by: JoeC2 | June 30, 2009 9:59 AM | Report abuse

wizards 08-09 roster and starting 5

Gilbert Arenas**
Andray Blatche
Caron Butler
Javaris Crittenton
Dee Brown
Juan Dixon
Dominic Mcguire
Antawn Jamison
Brendan Haywood**
Deshawn Stevenson
Mike James
Nick Young
Olesky Pecherov
Darius Songalia
Etan Thomas**

starting 5

mike james
dominic mcguire
caron butler
Antawn Jamison
Darius Songalia

what does that equal? 19-63 with an interim coach **- injury for season

flash foward to 2009-10 roster
Gilbert Arenas
Caron Butler
Brendan Haywood
Nick Young
Antawn Jamison
Javaris Crittenton
Andray Blatche
Dominic Mcguire
Randy Foye
Javale Mcghee
Mike Miller
deshawn stevenson**
mike james**
Juan Dixon***
**- might not be here before reg season starts, *** will not be here when reg season starts.

Starting 5

Arenas (even at 93% healthy)
Foye
Butler
Jamison
Haywood

proven coach, veteran assistants and developed players that will know their role and play within their roles. And that roster is still not complete add another piece like Drew Gooden or Brandon Bass.

now tell me what is all the bickering about? who cares about ricky rubio hes not going to produce as much as both players we brought in. were not trading aj,cb so get over it were not getting bosh,stoudemire,boozer,milsap none of them. what we have is better than what weve had last year and better since 04-05. be fans and lets support our team. Because it is heading in the right direction!

Posted by: mrhney03 | June 30, 2009 10:10 AM | Report abuse

I will have Charlie Villanueva on the bottom of my list for FA pick-up. The last thing we need is another 3 point shooting PF with no defense.

Posted by: Dave381 | June 30, 2009 10:16 AM | Report abuse

Villaneuva has a rep dating back to college of not playing hard. I'm not sure we need another one of those on our roster.

Posted by: original_mark | June 30, 2009 10:20 AM | Report abuse

It's not like they planned on going over the cap!

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 30, 2009 9:31 AM

Yes they did.

And by the way: EG shrewdly paid for the lux tax hit while SIGNIFICANTLY upgrading the PG/SG/SF positions.

Posted by: jones-y | June 29, 2009 5:47 PM


I think Abe's weakness is in front office personnel. If he'd had someone as good as EG, he may have splashed more often over the last 25 years, because he would've had teams worth spending on... Of course that doesn't negate his history as it stands... But also take into account that Abe must have been doing something right, with his franchise now in a position to absorb a huge financial hit during the worst recession/potential depression in decades! You can't deny that.

Granted, the work is not finished for EG...

We'll probably wind up paying the full midlevel.

Great job, Ernie.

Posted by: wizfan89 | June 30, 2009 9:44 AM

Don't forget that if we sign a FA for the full MLE, we will be paying more for him than we're paying for CB. And Drew Gooden therefore will cost $4M...

I really expect a trade or sign-and-trade.

Posted by: jones-y | June 29, 2009 6:17 PM

Posted by: jones-y | June 30, 2009 10:25 AM | Report abuse

Gortat is the only reasonable pickup up as far as I can see. I see a lot of PF's being mentioned but we really need a C. BTH is the one coming off an injury and our 2 young guys aren't really centers. It would be easier for JM and AB to play PF than C so C should be our position of greatest need.
Lie to Gortat and tell him he will get a chance to start. then sign him to a 4 year 15 million dollar deal and call it a day.

Posted by: original_mark | June 30, 2009 10:31 AM | Report abuse

Arenas (even at 93% healthy)
Foye
Butler
Jamison
Haywood

Posted by: mrhney03 | June 30, 2009 10:10 AM

mrhney03,

I really think Mike Miller will be the starter. He's better for the pick-n-roll game, both as the one setting the pick for GA or CB, and as the ball-handler with any of the bigs (AJ, BTH, AB)

He's also probably better for Flip's defensive schemes than Foye, due to his height and length. And he's a better 3pt and spot up shooter than Foye. The only drawback is that Foye is more inclined to play tough perimeter man-up D than either GA or Miller.

Foye is more of a player who needs the ball to score. Which makes him almost perfect as a backup to both PG and SG.

NY and/or JCritt (if each remains on the roster - i really see one of them getting traded) will get spot duty, depending on matchup/need/game situation.

Posted by: jones-y | June 30, 2009 10:44 AM | Report abuse

mark, i can dig what u r saying, but do you really think orlando will let him go? if turkey leaves then they can definitely afford to overpay gortat. i don't know their whole cap situation in orlando but i'd guess they could afford to pay them both.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 30, 2009 10:47 AM | Report abuse

jones-y,
Miller grabbed close to 7 rebounds per game. We need that from our SG since our C is average at best on the glass. It oughtta be rebound by committee. So I agree with you that Miller should start at SG. He and CB will have to switch on defense, though.

If we do start Miller, we've lost even more perimeter quickness. This in turn will put more pressure on our interior defenders. Our offense should shine but our defense may have gotten worse.
This should be an interesting season.

Posted by: original_mark | June 30, 2009 10:50 AM | Report abuse

lilhollywood10,
Based on what I read from Chad Ford, the magic may not be able to match a MLE offer. You know they have to spend to keep Turkoglu. I hate offering so much money to a backup but this is the corner we've painted ourselves into.

Ok I know this is a stretch but is there a chance we do a sign and trade with Houston for Artest? CB for Ron? Or is that impossible because Artest is an UFA?

I just see a much tougher team with Gil, Miller, Artest, AJ and BTH. That's actually a REALLY good playoff roster.

A player's coach like Flip might be able to relate to Ron and Ron has no incentive to go back to a Rockets team that will not contend with Yao out.

Posted by: original_mark | June 30, 2009 11:01 AM | Report abuse

"Brandon Bass is 6'6.25", 246. He's strong and athletic but undersized for PF. He's Maxiell Lite."

Bass is 6' 8" with very good athleticism, quickness and hops.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 30, 2009 11:02 AM | Report abuse


Bass is 6' 8" with very good athleticism, quickness and hops.

Then let's call him Maxiell. Is he what we need?

Posted by: original_mark | June 30, 2009 11:04 AM | Report abuse

Blair, on the other hand, who is 6' 6" (maybe) with limited hops, a weight problem, and two bad knees.

"Oh that's right, we PASSED on him."

So did every other team in the NBA. Most of them twice.

"They both were able to bench 18 times during the pre-draft test. "

Which might mean something if they were both drafted this year. But they weren't. Bass is a 4 year vet who has proven, without question, that he can play and compete with the big boys around the rim in the NBA. Blair has proven a grand total of nothing.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 30, 2009 11:06 AM | Report abuse

Although Maxiell is only 6'5"....

Posted by: original_mark | June 30, 2009 11:07 AM | Report abuse

"Then let's call him Maxiell. Is he what we need?"

I have no idea what your obsession with Maxiell is about, so I'll just ignore it.

As for what the Wizards need:

A tough, rebounding, physically aggressive PF who defends in the paint, battles on the boards, and can provide some complimentary offense off hustle inside?

Well . . . yes, that is just what they need in a backup PF.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 30, 2009 11:09 AM | Report abuse

I have to mention others POY types who were deemed too small that a lot of teams passed on like Jameer (All Star ) Nelson.

Of course, Jay Williams also comes to mind. But for a 2nd rounder? I think AB was a bigger gamble and we took HIM. I don't recall any knee issues keeping Blair out in college but perhaps I'm unaware.

I also read somewhere that John Elway played without ACL's because he tore hem in high school. My point is that college production should count for something.

Posted by: original_mark | June 30, 2009 11:10 AM | Report abuse

yeah just confirmed that Elway played college and pros without an ACL in one of his knees. Different sport but still....

I think Blair got jobbed. Of course if he averages 1.4 rebounds this year in 25 mpg, I'll shut and and say I was wrong.

Posted by: original_mark | June 30, 2009 11:12 AM | Report abuse

Nelson and Williams are PGs, not PFs. Size is a different issue with different implications between the two positions. And the fact that Nelson made 1 all-star team doesn't mean a whole lot. If he keeps going back year after year, then it might mean something. Until then he just had a good year. And Williams only played one (mostly disappointing) season before he foolishly ended his career in a moped crash, so it's not like he proved anything. Elway played football not basketball, so his inclusion is pretty much irrelevant.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 30, 2009 11:17 AM | Report abuse

And Elway's inclusion is made even more irrelevant by the fact that Blair has two bad knees (and a weight problem).

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 30, 2009 11:18 AM | Report abuse

And Villanueva is basically Jamison with a couple of extra inches of height and less of a work ethic.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 30, 2009 11:21 AM | Report abuse

I have no obsession with Maxiell. I wouldnt want him here in DC. You seemed to have a jones for Bass. I was just naming a guy who's similar physically.
You consistently fail to see any relevant points when they are not congruent to your own.

To quote you...

"In other words, business as usual."

Posted by: original_mark | June 30, 2009 11:22 AM | Report abuse

And Villanueva is basically Jamison with a couple of extra inches of height and less of a work ethic.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 30, 2009 11:21 AM

If AJ had any "work ethics" he would play "D" instead of making sure he saves his energy to score his 20 a night.

MJ, Kobe, Larry Bird and I can name at least 100 players who either have or had the work ethic it takes to become a great player.

Too bad the players on this team take after their owner and live by his motto...do as little as you have to and make as much money as you can!

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 30, 2009 11:43 AM | Report abuse

"I was just naming a guy who's similar physically. "

For what purpose? Absolutely none, as far as I can see. Just because they have similar builds says nothing about who they are as players, any more than pointing out that Blair is (supposedly) the same general body type as Wes Unseld means he can do the things Unseld did. It's a functionally meaningless comparison. Apparently your stock in trade this days.

"You seemed to have a jones for Bass."

That's hilarious, coming from the guy who's practically walking around holding onto DuJuan Blair's out turned pants pocket.

Prior to responding to your little rant here, I've mentioned Bass in about 3 or 4 posts. You've been pumping Blair nonstop for almost a week, like his getting drafted in the 2nd meant he wouldn't have the cash to pay you money he owed. Like I said, every GM in the NBA passed on your boy (most of them twice) for a reason.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 30, 2009 11:44 AM | Report abuse

Like I said, every GM in the NBA passed on your boy (most of them twice) for a reason.


Posted by: kalo_rama | June 30, 2009 11:44 AM

Except San Antonio who have won how many titles compared to the Wizards and EG=1 in 70 years?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 30, 2009 11:48 AM | Report abuse

Valid point, bulletsfan78,.
Just because others passed doesn't mean squat. Lots of teams passed on Gil, too.

Posted by: original_mark | June 30, 2009 11:50 AM | Report abuse

"Just because others passed doesn't mean squat. "

Of course it means something. It means that they didn't think he was worth taking a risk on. Could they be wrong? Sure. But, and I know this will come a shock to you, so could you. But between the two of you, I think the paid pros who make their living at this have better odds of getting it right.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 30, 2009 11:52 AM | Report abuse

Or, to put it another way, the fact that you've got the hots for the guy doesn't mean squat either.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 30, 2009 11:53 AM | Report abuse

Of course it means something. It means that they didn't think he was worth taking a risk on. Could they be wrong? Sure.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 30, 2009 11:52 AM

original_mark

Don't you know the Wizards are never wrong that's why they have so many championships....wait I'm sorry when have they ever been right?

Signing Gil who hasn't played in years
Signing ET to his contract
Signing DS squared
Drafting OP
Who have they drafted that you would is a starter on this team?

I think the paid pros who make their living at this have better odds of getting it right.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 30, 2009 11:52 AM

Sure you do since you get paid (by the Wizards) to agree with them.

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 30, 2009 12:04 PM | Report abuse

As surprised as I was that we made a trade two days before the draft and that we gave them every big body on the bench, (maybe the Wiz are planning on buying less sturdy chairs for next season), I disagree that we COULD have gotten a better deal.

Remember, there was NO WAY to know that Ricky Rubio would fall to #5. NO WAY. As soon as we knew that we had lost the Blake Griffin sweepstakes, the message boards were lit up with folks raving about Ricky. But we ALL assumed that Rubio would be gone no later than #4 (SacTown).

Even Minny, after acquiring the 5 spot, were genuinely surprised that he got there. My guess is that snapped him up and seeing that Evans was gone, just jumped on the next guy on their draft board (a draft board that did NOT include Rubio since they probably also assumed that he would be gone no later than 4). I can see someone in the back of the Minnesota war-room saying as Stern walks away from the podium going "Uh, did we just draft two point guards?". Wouldn't be the first draft day mistake from the Land of a Thousand Lakes. (refresher: Mike Tice of the Vikings took too long getting their selection to the Commish, and therefore forfeited their FIRST ROUND pick).

So, lets leave the T-Wolves to spin their own misfortune. (Although, truth be told, they did really well for themselves in that they now have plenty of chips to play after July 8; low value chips, but lots of them nonetheless). And it turns out that if Rubio stays where the rain falls mainly on the plains, they have a PG to develop (Bassy doesn't seem to figure in anyones plans any time soon).

Again, EG did good with the trade. The offseason grades are incomplete because we are too guard heavy. Get quality big men and we're looking at a B+ summer. If the roster we have today is the roster we have at training camp, it's a C-.

Posted by: mabkhar | June 30, 2009 12:10 PM | Report abuse

"If the roster we have today is the roster we have at training camp, it's a C-."

It's a little better than that. Yes, they still need help up front, but the fact remains they traded one marginal contributor and two noncontirbutors for two guys who can contribute in multiple ways. That's a net plus, overall.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 30, 2009 1:23 PM | Report abuse

"Remember, there was NO WAY to know that Ricky Rubio would fall to #5. NO WAY. As soon as we knew that we had lost the Blake Griffin sweepstakes, the message boards were lit up with folks raving about Ricky. But we ALL assumed that Rubio would be gone no later than #4 (SacTown).

Even Minny, after acquiring the 5 spot, were genuinely surprised that he got there. My guess is that snapped him up and seeing that Evans was gone, just jumped on the next guy on their draft board (a draft board that did NOT include Rubio since they probably also assumed that he would be gone no later than 4). I can see someone in the back of the Minnesota war-room saying as Stern walks away from the podium going "Uh, did we just draft two point guards?". Wouldn't be the first draft day mistake from the Land of a Thousand Lakes. (refresher: Mike Tice of the Vikings took too long getting their selection to the Commish, and therefore forfeited their FIRST ROUND pick).

Posted by: mabkhar | June 30, 2009 12:10 PM "

So what was the reason for the rush to trade the 5th for Foye and Eminem?

There was none.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 30, 2009 4:44 PM | Report abuse

"And Villanueva is basically Jamison with a couple of extra inches of height and less of a work ethic.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 30, 2009 11:21 AM "

MeTawn has absolutely no post game and can't play defense..

At least CV has some sort of post game, and can defend in the post...at about 1/4 the cost.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 30, 2009 4:47 PM | Report abuse

elfreako: "That security guard knows what's up."

I had to laugh. That's why he's a $5/hr security guard elfreako. Because he clearly knows what's up.

Posted by: precaryus1 | July 1, 2009 11:42 AM | Report abuse

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