Wolves-Wizards Deal In The Works

A league source just informed me that the Washington Wizards are closing in a deal that would send the No. 5 pick, Etan Thomas, Oleksiy Pecherov and Darius Songaila to the Minnesota Timberwolves in exchange for Randy Foye and Mike Miller. When asked on Tuesday if the talks between the teams were heating up, the source said, "It's boiling."

The Timberwolves also hold the sixth pick in the draft. The deal isn't expected to be finalized until Wednesday, the source said.

By Michael Lee |  June 23, 2009; 7:46 PM ET
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A solid young guard and a three point shooter for one guy who can no longer play, one guy who could never play and one guy who's a nice #3 center/forward and a #5 pick?

That's theft unless that #5 turns out to be Michael Jordan II.

Now, if they can find a big body that can just hammer people, scrap for rebounds and hit an occasional shot, they'd be in excellent shape.

Barring the you-know-what.

Posted by: SteveMG | June 23, 2009 8:01 PM

I like it. Sure would like their #18 pick, as well. But I'm just being greedy :)

Posted by: creativefunk | June 23, 2009 8:03 PM

If Miller rebounds from an "off" year by returning to his previous 3pt stroke, then he adds a great deal to this team. Randy Foye is the "wild card" in this deal in terms of his future impact. Does he continue to improve and live up to his potential or does he remain as if...?

Interesting...so far I like it.

Posted by: humen8r | June 23, 2009 8:03 PM

I agree, good trade for both teams. Wolves is looking to rebuild so they get what they want, the 5th pick. As for our Wiz, we get the 3pt shooting we need and a young athletic combo guard who was a # 7 pick just 3 years ago. Good move for EG so far but something tells me he is not done cooking :)

Posted by: Bullzards80 | June 23, 2009 8:04 PM

When I tried running this through RealGM, it said that Etan Thomas has a trade clause that blocked the trade... if his salary is part of this deal, I'm all for this. Gives us some good depth, and we still have Haywood's expiring contract for the deadline.

Any thoughts on Thomas's contract?

And let me just say I'm very relieved they walked away from the Amare deal.

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/59995/20090623/wizards_walk_away_from_proposed_amare_deal/

Posted by: apoollo13 | June 23, 2009 8:05 PM

Please tell me one of the two non lottery picks is involved in this deal....

Posted by: wizfan305 | June 23, 2009 8:07 PM

Right don't they have a total of 4 picks? I would be happy if they threw in # 18 to us...heck at this point I'll take their 2nd round pick lol

Posted by: Bullzards80 | June 23, 2009 8:08 PM

NOOOOOOOOO!!!!! Please NO!

Posted by: BillEmm | June 23, 2009 8:10 PM

Looks like a solid deal. We get rid of dead weight and in return receive a 6-8 established shooter plus someone who can push Nick Young (if he sticks around) at the back up spot. Might have been nice to get Steph Curry, but instead of waiting for young curry to figure out the game, Miller can step right in...

Posted by: BigNasty | June 23, 2009 8:10 PM

This a typical panic move. Why not wait and see who falls us at 5 and then work a deal on the clock. Why panic and accept foye and washed up mike miller sheesh

Posted by: anacostia85 | June 23, 2009 8:15 PM

Now can we see Jamison, James and Crittendon to Phoenix for Amare?

Arenas
M.Miller
Caron
Amare
Haywood

Foye
N Young
Maguire
Blatche
McGee

Posted by: ThePat | June 23, 2009 8:19 PM

You're right, the timing was a little strange... it seemed like it was right after Richard Jefferson was off the table they pulled the trigger on this. In terms of salary though, this allows EG to give someone else a max deal... here we go again.

Posted by: apoollo13 | June 23, 2009 8:20 PM

Or youd probably start Foye and move Gil to the 2 and bring Miller off the bench

Posted by: ThePat | June 23, 2009 8:21 PM

As a Wolves fan living in DC, I'm positively gleeful over this trade! Thanks!

Posted by: saudagg | June 23, 2009 8:25 PM

initially, i was not a fan of this deal. but maybe it could work out well. Miller will provide more production than anyone they'll get at 5, and Foye is a nice back up.

Where does miller play? The 2 or the 3?

Posted by: ZardsFan1 | June 23, 2009 8:28 PM

Don't understand the hurry to make this trade. Mike Miller has not played well recently, and though he still has his skills and could put together a nice year I worry we appreciated his 9 million dollar expiring contract at least as much. Foye is a nice fit as a scorer from the bench and backup point guard but has not been efficient to this point in his career and depending the progression of him and the rest of the backcourt may not be an upgrade from Crittendon or Young.

In short these are players that can help us but I had hoped our expiring contracts, prospects and picks would have brought back something better and it may have been best to wait until the eve of the draft for better offers, if not all the way until the trade deadline.

Disappointing, but I definitely hope this works out for us and I'm rooting for the new players!

Posted by: GshawnJohnson | June 23, 2009 8:28 PM

Good bye Etan Thomas, you sucked!

Good trade. I'm tired of the Wiz drafting guys who don't pan out in the NBA, or in some cases don't live up to their potential.

The list is pretty long.

Posted by: isnadd | June 23, 2009 8:30 PM

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4282279


Big deal, really. With Mike Miller, you get another scorer. Now, will he be 2 or 3 with Caron?

Now what to do with Foye, MeShawn, DMac, and Nick Young?

They should have held onto ET and use him with James to clear up major space or trade them down the line to another team for next offseason's FA class.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 8:30 PM

And by the way Mike, is your "league source" named Ric Bucher, by chance?

(just kidding boss I really appreciate your work on this blog)

Posted by: GshawnJohnson | June 23, 2009 8:30 PM

I'm having a hard time understanding this trade for a variety of reasons.

First off, let's assume Foye is a PG:
The Wizards have already stated they won't be drafting a 3rd string point guard due to Crittenton and Gilbert already being on the roster. I doubt Gil would move to the 2, but if he were -- the Wizards have just created the logjam of 3 PG's.

Second, let's assume Foye is a SG -- more likely:

You now have Stevenson, Foye and Nick Young all making starter money along with needing minutes to play. Stevensons deal looks awful right about now, and Nick Young sure ain't getting better after this deal. What gives?

There's got to be something else tied onto this deal -- either a future move or another pick that we haven't heard of yet, because roster wise we eliminated bad contracts and replaced them with logjams at positions where we didn't need the problem, minus the outside shooting.

Posted by: wizfan305 | June 23, 2009 8:31 PM

The timing is likely because MN is trying to maneuver in the draft for a higher position and they needed the #5 pick to do it.

Posted by: isnadd | June 23, 2009 8:31 PM

Who the he'll is gonna be our backup 4/5? I know what your thinking but Blatche sucks.

Posted by: theredskin | June 23, 2009 8:32 PM

Ton of mixed reaction on this one. Not even really agreement (on first glance) among "basketball experts."

Seems to me that getting the 2006 No. 7 pick for the 2009 No. 5 for a team that probably doesn't have time to wait for another young guy to develop is a Wise move ... though there are certainly those who say they would prefer Stephen Curry (or Tyreke Evans or Harden) to Foye.

Miller seems like exactly what this team needed last year, a dependable three-point shooters.

Certainly the two of them don't compare to some of the more accomplished players whose names were being bandied about (Stoudamire, Ray Allen, Richard Jefferson), but they also managed to add two players who can help without giving up any of their key starters, rotation players (save maybe Songaila) or their young developmental players.

And this might not be the end of the trading.

Posted by: KeithMcMillan | June 23, 2009 8:34 PM

Miller had one bad year coming off his 2 best years of his career. He's 6'8", a 40% career shooter from 3. Rebounds decent for his position. Foye is 25 and better than stevenson in arguably every capacity. Miller as a 6th man at the 2 or 3. Im finding it hard to dislike this at all.

Posted by: BMorrison808 | June 23, 2009 8:34 PM

I'm a fan of Mike Miller, but we seem a bit small now.

Blatche, Jamison, McGee and Haywood, thats it at the 4 and 5. Pretty thin IMO

Posted by: tblaz | June 23, 2009 8:34 PM

Randy Foye is 1000x better than Crittendon.

Posted by: KShark28 | June 23, 2009 8:34 PM

Funny, EG paid ET big money to stay, and now he's paying him an extra 1.2 mil to go away. EG doesn't care, not his money.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 8:35 PM

Hmm, it seems to me that another trade is in the works.

The pieces are there for another move.

Posted by: SteveMG | June 23, 2009 8:36 PM

I guess we'll be going after Sheed in free agency... Bad Deal for Wiz could of gotten so much more. Any deal with Amare on the table should have been taken

Posted by: cgshelton | June 23, 2009 8:36 PM

It is nice getting rid of dead weight and picking up 2 solid players, but still not sold on this trade.

Miller will only be around for a year, and foye for 2, then what? I wouldnt mind seeing curry around here for 3,4 years.

Posted by: seanmo1 | June 23, 2009 8:37 PM

Could be good... if we can get one of Minny's non-lotto picks of the future. Foye is the key in my mind (solid ball player/ could be a point in Saunder's system?..?) Miller gives us a possible outside threat; plus he comes off the books at the end of the year or is a trade-peace at the deadline if things don't work out... and it opens another roster spot (2 opening if I'm counting right)

Now, if Ernie can just work James' expiring contract and or Critt's (comes off the book at the end of 09/10 if team doesn't make the 'qualifying offer' [based on what he's done to date... you got to be crazy to given him that much money in this economy...]) into a 'big with a pulse' (hello Mr. Donnie Walsh of the Knicks... can we get the Jeffries for James trade please... if you want we can throw in a side of Critt... or even a sign and trade for Wilcox) and we are set.

Hello NBA Playoffs... the WIZARDS are back!

Posted by: fishin41 | June 23, 2009 8:39 PM

Good thoughts everyone (fun to see you on here Keith!). Perhaps we plan to play out the first half of the season, see where Arenas is at, see how the young guys have developed, see how the squad is fitting with Flip, and then use Mike James' (or Miller's) expiring contract and our prospects to tidy up.

Posted by: GshawnJohnson | June 23, 2009 8:39 PM

Great Trade for the Wizards:

Foye will fit in perfectly with Arenas as a combo guard similar to the way Larry Hughes did.....if one were to look at Foye's production since he came into the league, one would notice he has increased his scoring average from 10 to 13 to 16 points per game....hes going to be the fourth option here

Mike Miller will be great coming off the bench backing up Caron

Overall, great trade for the Wizards!

Posted by: askhosh10 | June 23, 2009 8:41 PM

It's only Tuesday . . .

Posted by: dabing | June 23, 2009 8:44 PM

This will only be a good trade if Les BouleS get the Wolves 18th pick, two ahead of Utah, who are sure to want Tyler Hansborough.

In fact, I would give up the 2nd round pick to add to the package just to get TH.

With Les BouleS trading 3 bigs for smalls, gone is any size for backup in the paint.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 8:44 PM

Not sure why anyone would be down on this deal as presently constituted:

- Wizards get a totally legit third guard in Foye who can step in and start if Arenas misses any time. Think Mo Williams-ish. Plus, gives them insurance in case Stevenson's injury is more severe than we think (and i think it is).

- Unload two big contracts without taking any on. Miller makes a lot, but is done after this year and Foye is relatively cheap for another couple of years

- Miller is horrible as a top-3 for a team, but is money as a the 3-point shooter in a 8-man rotation.

- Pech is irrelevant

- The Wiz still have that early #2 they can use and in this draft, picks 24-35 are comparable depending on position

- still have Mike James' expiring deal to unload

Posted by: b_standig | June 23, 2009 8:44 PM

I expected a trade about now, they were only working out second-stringers the last few days. Ernie's the man. Foye is better than any guard in this draft. And Miller, though declining in production of late, is a serious veteran contribution. He's big, he can spread the floor with his range, and he can do a lot of the little things well. I liked Curry a lot, but I love this trade. Assuming Foye's hip is o.k. from that surgery.

This is a significant upgrade for the Wizards team, guaranteed. There are no such guarantees with rookies. Sorry to see Songaila go, though, he's a hustle player who deserves better than the T'Wolves. Foye and Miller must be thrilled, though.

So, who do they take in the second round?

Posted by: satchmore | June 23, 2009 8:44 PM

if this deal goes through, we should try to trade crit and MJ for a solid backup 4-5 guy. this would clear our logjam at the guard and we would have more depth at the big man position. also, im sure we can get good value from a blossiming crittenton and MJ's expiring contract

Posted by: bullets8890 | June 23, 2009 8:48 PM

Miller is in the last year of his deal & will make $9.75M, that will be more than Thomas' $7.35M that was coming off the books (ESPN reports that Thomas will get an extra $1.5M or so b/c of the trade kicker. Like Apoolo, I have no idea how/if that kicker plays a factor in this trade). Pesh is basically in the last year of his deal, though his team has until 7/1 to pick up a $2.3M option for the '10-'11 season (not happening). That said, this team still has some valuable expiring salaries (Haywood $6M, James $6.5M, & Miller $9.75M) to make some moves. This team got a lot smaller, though Songalia was the only player of substance, but now this team has a TON of depth in the backcourt:
PG: Arenas, Crittenton, James
SG: Foye, Stevenson, Young
SF: Butler, McGuire
PF: Jamison, Blatche
C: Haywood, McGee

I may be missing a guy or two, but this leaves the front court thin and I don't recall too many big guys coming in for draft workouts. Foye & Arenas make a formidable backcourt as both could handle the ball. We know what we're getting with Foye & Miller (both guys are under 30, with Foye being about 26), they'll give about 25-30 points, 10 assists and 10 rebs. I would take that since the #5 pick's contribution is anyone's guess, but we know Pesh, Songalia, & Thomas will chip in 12 pts, 10 rebs & 2 assists and a ton of DNPs and missed 3 point shots (by way of Pesh).

Foye doesn't have a killer contract yet, though he is up for an extension next summer, but the team can tender an offer to keep him restricted...

Posted by: -CN- | June 23, 2009 8:51 PM

Horrible, horrible idea. We get nothing at all remotely for the #5 pick????? Wow, those trade "rumors" must have been all bs if this is the best we could do. I thought the whole idea is to add someone decent, not another scrub. Foye is nowhere near as good as Young or Crittenton. He is a total scrub. Miller is washed up. I'd do Foye for Pech straight up, but that's about it.

Posted by: Urnesto | June 23, 2009 8:52 PM

In the words of George Allen Sr."The future is now."
We need to try and add a Taj Gibson type Power Forward/Center with pick #32 (which we will now have the room to actually use).
I do like Randy Foye's free throw % at 84.5%.
I'm not sure about what this means for Crit but as long as we got rid of a bunch of bad contracts I am ok with the move.
The Wiz will be in the Eastern Semifinals in 2010.

Posted by: jeremybozz | June 23, 2009 8:53 PM

niiiiiiiice. see you in hell Etan!!

Posted by: SadieV | June 23, 2009 8:54 PM

Clearly, Ernie isn't done.

With Gil, Foye, Miller, Crittenton, James, Stevenson, and Young, that is 7 guards. Surely we can put together a package - perhaps include next year's number one if necessary - to send some excess backcourt talent out for a #4.

If there is any way to send Jamison, backcourt players, and a future pick to Phoenix for Amare, the Wiz would be a very dangerous team in the East next year. Just don't see Phoenix giving Amare away like that, so we're going to have to find another power forward via trade.

Posted by: knk4jack | June 23, 2009 8:54 PM

Horrible, horrible idea. We get nothing at all remotely for the #5 pick????? Wow, those trade "rumors" must have been all bs if this is the best we could do. I thought the whole idea is to add someone decent, not another scrub. Foye is nowhere near as good as Young or Crittenton. He is a total scrub. Miller is washed up. I'd do Foye for Pech straight up, but that's about it.

Posted by: Urnesto | June 23, 2009 8:52 PM

---------------------

Wow, please get off the crack! Just teasing, but if you do not not think Foye isn't better than Crittenton, your real name must be John Nash or Chris Wallace.

Posted by: b_standig | June 23, 2009 8:55 PM

Foye is nowhere near as good as Young or Crittenton. He is a total scrub. Miller is washed up. I'd do Foye for Pech straight up, but that's about it.

Posted by: Urnesto | June 23, 2009 8:52 PM

Go to NBA.com, look up both of their stats, and then take a deep breath.

Posted by: KShark28 | June 23, 2009 8:55 PM

How many 2 guards can we play at one time? I hope there is something else in the works. Please don't tell me Ernie thinks McGee is a viable backup at center.

Posted by: Boogadiggy | June 23, 2009 8:55 PM

@DC Mann

Minn will be paying the trade kicker to Thomas, not Wash. That's why Ernie doesn't care, it's not his money, it's Minn...

Posted by: -CN- | June 23, 2009 8:56 PM

Not the most spectacular trade Ernie could have made, but I like it. Foye can really shoot and he's a decent defender. I can see him and Gilbert splitting the point responsibilities, the way Gil did with Larry Hughes. Mike Miller had an off year on a bad team, but he's still a really solid player. I've always wanted to see him in a Wizards uniform.

Posted by: pjkiger1 | June 23, 2009 8:56 PM

The hole in their lineup was at the two. Now they have resolved that and they have bolstered their three point shooting off the bench, another weakness.

And they have done it with veterans so they can better win now, and have gotten rid of some dead weight on their roster and replaced them with guys who can contribute.

Miller could also backup Caron at SF if they want scoring there rather than with McGuire, and remember Caron tends to get injured about 15-20 games a year.

McGuire can still backup Caron some, but at 6-9 could also give some depth at PF behind AJ and Blatche as well.

This is seemingly a good trade for the Wiz. We have bolstered our team weaknesses with players who can help us win now.

Posted by: cannontl | June 23, 2009 8:57 PM

Here's the worst kept secret for this trade.

Abe doesn't want to go over the cap, and if he had kept the 5th place lottery pick, he would have had to.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 8:58 PM

Miller's locked in for one year and Foye for two. so it's a trade of those two relatively short-timers for the salary dumps plus the #5. Might work out OK if the #5 is not much.

Posted by: EdDC | June 23, 2009 8:59 PM

Great Trade. It is time for Drew Gooden to come as a free agent. We need more bigs: size, ability, and strength.

Posted by: JoeC2 | June 23, 2009 8:59 PM

miller hit 85 treys in 73 games last year so please don't tell me how great he is. He is a relunctant shooter these days his heart no longer seems to be in it. Foye failed at pg and joins the log jam of stevenson young james and critt. I don't see why you don't let the twolves squirm until draft day and get at least the 18th pick if no other teams wanted the pick but let's imagine rubio or curry fell the wiz could have cleaned up. Unless Ernie has a move up his sleeve this was a monumental failure.

Posted by: anacostia85 | June 23, 2009 9:00 PM

niiiiiiiice. see you in hell Etan!!

Posted by: SadieV | June 23, 2009 8:54 PM

Yes, Etan Thomas, outspoken community advocate and volunteer, is going to hell.

I was wondering when the Republicans would show up. Seems there aren't as many around as there used to be. Imagine that.

Posted by: bryc3 | June 23, 2009 9:00 PM

I think Ernie and Flip have reached the conclusion that they can't pair Arenas with a pure PG like Curry or Lawson, so they're going to try to recreate the Larry Hughes situation with Randy Foye.

I would have been more interested to see them keep the pick and try to bring in James Harden to solve their SG problem, but I guess not. Maybe they're convinced he's going to go at #3 or #4.

Posted by: drischord | June 23, 2009 9:01 PM

If this goes through, I'm wondering where the improved defense is going to come from. I'm not sure about Foye, but Miller is not going to be a lockdown guy on the wing. But when on, he can certainly stroke it.

I wonder if something may be up for Jamison. It seems like they duplicate the outside shooting at the forward spot, leaving the middle open where the Wizards really don't have a post-up threat who could get them open. So is the offense going to be a dribble/motion variation to try to generate the open outside shot?

Posted by: grounder | June 23, 2009 9:03 PM

I think the players involved in this trade are great. Songaila was a terrible pickup for us from the very beginning. Miller is solid now, even after his down year. His production dip seemed to be a result of taking a lot less shots. Why that happened I'm not sure, as I didn't watch much of the Timberwolves.

Foye on the other hand I am very excited about. He's a very good 3pt shooter, great off the dribble, and a very good defender. He would be great next to Arenas in the backcourt, or as the first guard off the bench (I hope he starts).

The only thing I wish is that we picked up their 18th pick. We should really find a way to include that when finalizing the deal.

Posted by: segastyle | June 23, 2009 9:03 PM

So apparently Randy Foye's organs are in the opposite position as those of the average person.. "situs inversis", they call it. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randy_Foye under "Medical Notes".

Well, apparently it hasn't affected his play, so it's cool.

Posted by: satchmore | June 23, 2009 9:05 PM

don't pull the check the stats out your a$$ homie. foye and miller were both good players on an awful team last year. i can't say either is really impressive, especially not miller. i don't see the point in trading away the no 5 selection for two role players unless you really just don't want to draft.

neither miller nor foye is an upgrade to what we have at their positions. whatever miller scores he gives up, and foye's numbers are fools gold. 16ppg as a starter is cool but foye won't start here will he produce off the bench? who knows.
Miller and foye are no more a "sure thing" good pickup than curry,evans,derozan etc.

Isn't mike miller like 30ish ?

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 23, 2009 9:05 PM

askhosh10

"Great Trade for the Wizards:

Foye will fit in perfectly with Arenas as a combo guard similar to the way Larry Hughes did.....if one were to look at Foye's production since he came into the league, one would notice he has increased his scoring average from 10 to 13 to 16 points per game....hes going to be the fourth option here

Mike Miller will be great coming off the bench backing up Caron

Overall, great trade for the Wizards! "

Ditto, provided Miller gets a decent hair cut.

Posted by: Izman | June 23, 2009 9:09 PM

anacostia is hitting the nail on the head.

it's too early to make a trade like this one. the no 5 pick still has value, hell minnesota could package the 5 and another of their players or picks to try to get the no 1 or 2. there's too many possibilities for a better deal than those two cats who've never been on a winner, never led a team anywhere. what about those two screams championship.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 23, 2009 9:13 PM

we need amare stoudamire not randy foye or mike miller...well miller will be a good fit if he can hit them three's

Posted by: fsouderiv | June 23, 2009 9:13 PM

So apparently the Wizards walked away from Amare & the 14th pick for Caron, 5th pick and Nick or Javaris. If I were a GM, I'd be tempted, but I'm glad Ernie walked away from it. Teams that break up routinely are constantly in a reorganizing phase, trying to see what works (see, e.g., Shaq in Phoenix). When you know what works, you stick with it, and find ways to make it better. I think Foye could be a tremendous addition to this squad.

Posted by: satchmore | June 23, 2009 9:14 PM

People I kept my word but if this move is true it's because ABE IS CHEAP and he doesn't want to go over the luxury cap!

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 23, 2009 9:14 PM

I really like this move. I would like it more if we got their #18 pick, or even their #26 pick but maybe we are not done dealing yet.

Miller (excluding last year) is the perfect compliment to Gilbert. He passes extremely well, can shoot the 3, rebounds well. He is that really solid all around player we need in the starting lineup. His D is suspect, however.
Foye is a great backup for Arenas. The kid can really play and I have been researching him lately and am really liking what I am seeing. Plus he gives us insurance if Gil goes down
Here is one article:
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/194729-why-people-dont-like-randy-foye-and-why-they-will-next-year

If all the reports are true that Blatche is significantly improving I think this team is set.

Arenas- Miller- Butler- Jamison- Haywood

Foye- Young- McGuire- Blatche- McGee

What do we do with Stevenson though?

Posted by: jeffco01 | June 23, 2009 9:14 PM

This pretty much leaves James as our remaining "trade asset" and Stevenson as a salary filler. That's a little under $10 mil in salary. Not sure who or what they could get with that without including something else. Adding young would entice other teams, but certainly not net a big man who would supplant one of our 4 remaining.

Ford's article mentioned that Minnesota still had some time to try and find a third team to involve in the trade. I wonder what the stakes would be then? More salary dumping for the Wiz? Adding a pick in return?

Posted by: segastyle | June 23, 2009 9:15 PM

And by the way Mike, is your "league source" named Ric Bucher, by chance?

In Lee's defense, I was on the phone with him about the deal before ESPN or Yahoo! reported it. He -- showing good journalistic instinct -- was uneasy about going with it until he had a second source on it, which he had within 20 minutes.

Time vs. Accuracy is something we'll always be wrestling with in this day and age ... Especially when you have some info and feel inclined to rush it out to the masses, it's still good to keep in mind that it's more important to be accurate than first by a few minutes.

I know you were kidding, but it never hurts to let you know where we're coming from on some of this stuff, and why you see our blog post timestamped a few minutes behind others from time to time.

Posted by: KeithMcMillan | June 23, 2009 9:19 PM

Wolves-Wizards Deal In The Works

A league source just informed me that the Washington Wizards are closing in a deal that would send the No. 5 pick, Etan Thomas, Oleksiy Pecherov and Darius Songaila to the Minnesota Timberwolves in exchange for Randy Foye and Mike Miller. When asked on Tuesday if the talks between the teams was heating up, the source said, "It's boiling."
The Timberwolves also hold the sixth pick in the draft. The deal isn't expected to be finalized until Wednesday, the source said.

By Michael Lee | June 23, 2009; 7:46 PM ET

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!!!

How many man hours have been wasted pondering and writing and discussing who the Wizards are going to draft with the 5th pick?? Even when it was so obvious a toddler could figure out we were trading the pick, the articles and blog entries and comments kept coming. Someone needs to conduct a study on how many hours were wasted...simply hilarious.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 23, 2009 9:19 PM

By the way, I like this trade though it would be nice if Michael Lee indicated the salaries and years left on the incoming players contracts. Too busy figuring out who we're going (not) draft to find that out?

Posted by: Barno1 | June 23, 2009 9:20 PM

It's funny how the players that EG got rid of today, are the same ones that he brought here for his "masterpiece."

Drafted OPech.

Signed DSong.

Matched a contract offer for ET.

Now they are gone.

Just like others who have come and gone via EG, including Dee Brown, Peter John Ramos, etc.

Mediocrity + Mediocrity = More Mediocrity

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 9:22 PM

realgm.com & yahoo reporting deal is done.

Posted by: Darnell1 | June 23, 2009 9:24 PM

The spirit of Wes Unseld has returned...please no. We need a promising young point guard. Not players who show no promise. I'd rather take an loss on the fifth pick than see this trade go through.

Posted by: swoop_0017 | June 23, 2009 9:24 PM

Ladies and Gentlemen, we are less than 24 hours until Etan Thomas's reign of terror in our nation's capital is over!!!

The most despicably bigoted, pitifully ignorant man in the NBA is finally on his way out. And his time poisoning our city's youth with his hate is over.

HALLELUJAH!!!

Posted by: Barno1 | June 23, 2009 9:26 PM

"HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!!!

How many man hours have been wasted pondering and writing and discussing who the Wizards are going to draft with the 5th pick?? Even when it was so obvious a toddler could figure out we were trading the pick, the articles and blog entries and comments kept coming. Someone needs to conduct a study on how many hours were wasted...simply hilarious.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 23, 2009 9:19 PM "

Even more funny is the number of $$$ wasted buying Les BouleS tickets, $10 beers, $8 hot dogs, and $5 popcorn.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 9:26 PM

In other news, another one of our pretty plugged-in guys is convinced this is not the last move, which would explain why the deal is agreed upon two days before the draft instead of while the Wiz were on the clock.

If the Wizards are guard-tight now, or have way too many perimeter players than they can give minutes to, might they be looking to package two or more of them for an available big?

I'm sure Mike will discuss salary ramifications in his story, but looks like Miller's $9.75 mil comes off the books the same time as Etan's $7.35 (at the end of this season).

Songaila, if he picks up a player option for 10-11, matches Foye's salary for that year. So if there's any savings for the Wiz at all, it's the $2.386 Pech is owed in 10-11 and the $3.377 in 11-12.

Posted by: KeithMcMillan | June 23, 2009 9:26 PM

Thanks Keith, and I would add to Mike and your defense (against myself...) that ESPN has blown stories by rushing stories exactly as you describe. The most egregious example I can recall was the misguided report of a Terrell Owens suicide attempt. We appreciate not reading that type of "breaking news" here.

But back to the matter at hand...

Posted by: GshawnJohnson | June 23, 2009 9:27 PM

jeffco01, I see a lineup more like this: Arenas, Foye, Butler, Jamison, Haywood

Foye instantly becomes our best defender at the guard position, and best offensive player at that spot, after Arenas.

Blatche and McGee filling in at the 4 and 5 spots, respectively. Crittenton, Young, Miller, and McGuire at the guard and wing spots, rotating depending on what is needed that game.

Stevenson still has not recovered from his bad back. There's a possibility he may never fully recover from that. Back injuries can be reoccurring.

Posted by: segastyle | June 23, 2009 9:28 PM

Miller came to Minnesota from Memphis nearly one year ago in a package that included Kevin Love in exchange for O.J. Mayo and a handful of retreads.

Viewed as one of the best perimeter shooters in the game, Miller played a far more passive game in his only season with the Wolves. He averaged a career-low 9.9 points per game and frustrated fans with his seemingly stubborn refusal to shoot the ball.

that about sums it up once again the wiz screwed it up

Posted by: anacostia85 | June 23, 2009 9:29 PM

"I'm sure Mike will discuss salary ramifications in his story, but looks like Miller's $9.75 mil comes off the books the same time as Etan's $7.35 (at the end of this season).

Songaila, if he picks up a player option for 10-11, matches Foye's salary for that year. So if there's any savings for the Wiz at all, it's the $2.386 Pech is owed in 10-11 and the $3.377 in 11-12.

Posted by: KeithMcMillan | June 23, 2009 9:26 PM "

Unfortunately, for real NBA teams, it's about winning rings and making money from success...not about moving players around to go from a suckee team to a gawdawful mediocre team.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 9:30 PM

DC_MAN88,

Team can only trade the players that they have contract with. So you are basically just stating the obvious, any player any team ever trade was the player that they have signed at earlier time. I do get your point!

BTW, I feel another trade may be in the working, since now we have log jams at guards.

Posted by: sagaliba | June 23, 2009 9:32 PM

I'm going to hurl if anyone comes on this blog and says that Gilby and Eminem (Mike Miller) will be battling for the comeback player of the year award.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 9:33 PM

All the time that Foye's been with the T-Wolves, he's been the go-to man, the guy who other teams lock down on. What do you suppose he could do with a few All-Stars on his squad?

The Wizards may well have Four All-Stars on their squad in 2009-10.

Posted by: satchmore | June 23, 2009 9:35 PM

Looks like the next poll will be "Who is the worst Bullets/Wizards GM?

Looks like Ernie is about to take the lead from Wes!

Posted by: Boogadiggy | June 23, 2009 9:36 PM

Ladies and Gents, relax...the chef is not done cooking. The kitchen is still open!!

Posted by: Bullzards80 | June 23, 2009 9:40 PM

keep dreaming satchmore. this team even when healthy was not a title contender. Scoring was never our problem Foye and Miller are just more scorers who can't stop anyone we have the worst gm and owner in the league and by the way the worst insiders as well

Posted by: anacostia85 | June 23, 2009 9:41 PM

Not sure what to think of this yet...

We move Etan, Darius and Pecherov all of which is good. Pick up as solid player in Miller who can shoot and adds some size to our backcourt. Foye don't know too much of not watching many Twolves games last couple years. Looks like he's a FA in '10 so he could leave after 1 year, as could Miller.

Foye listed as 6-3 PG... not sure if he can play with Gil. Also not sure what him coming does to Crittenton. It also seems to me we need to move Mike James one way or another.

Posted by: Darnell1 | June 23, 2009 9:41 PM

Looks like the next poll will be "Who is the worst Bullets/Wizards GM?

Looks like Ernie is about to take the lead from Wes!

Not possible. Wes was given the lifetime achievement award for being a horrid GM.

Posted by: BMorrison808 | June 23, 2009 9:41 PM

I'm going to hurl if anyone comes on this blog and says that Gilby and Eminem (Mike Miller) will be battling for the comeback player of the year award.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 9:33 PM


Gilby and Eminem (Mike Miller) will be battling for the comeback player of the year award and win it together!!!


Now please hurl....

Posted by: Bullzards80 | June 23, 2009 9:42 PM

"Ladies and Gents, relax...the chef is not done cooking. The kitchen is still open!!

Posted by: Bullzards80 | June 23, 2009 9:40 PM "

Yes, who wants more Mickey D's dollar value menu? Raise your hands.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 9:42 PM

OK - it's true that we gave up pieces that weren't too productive (though DSong is a decent bench player) for a couple of guys who fill a need for us.

But how many freaking guards do we now have on the roster?

-- Gil
-- Deshawn
-- Crit
-- NY1
-- Mike James
-- Foye
-- M. Miller

I hope the Wiz aren't done. We need to trade in a couple of reserve guards for some emergency big - doesn't have to be anything fancy. Just a Songaila type.

Posted by: Hawaiiexpat | June 23, 2009 9:42 PM

"Now please hurl....

Posted by: Bullzards80 | June 23, 2009 9:42 PM "

I did, but the only thing that didn't change was that Les BouleS suck.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 9:43 PM

OK Barno and dc man...we get it...you hate the wizards and EG and the fans and Abe and the writers and especially etan...Now let me see what others have to say.

Mike Miller? Maybe he just hated Minnesota and wanted to get out quickly. back in the day, that's what GB Packers players did...lay up and get out. I can hope.

Can anybody figure out what David Lee's guarantee is? Do Miller and James contracts work out about right for that trade? How about james and Deshawns?

I don't hate DeShawn and James nearly as much as everyone else does. DeShawn was pretty solid player until he tried to play through his injury last year and effed himself up worse. Gotta give give it too him though, he manned up to try to help the team when it was down 2 starters...may have wrecked his perfectly passable NBA career because of it. That takes a big sack.

James is a career scorer that is on the wane, but he shot way below his average last year, as did dixon, young and pretty much the whole guard lineup. I wouldn't hate to see any of them go for a good big man, though.

What does Toronto need to do to clear space to try to keep Bosh and attract someone to play with him? (the only way he would stay is if they could get a Wade or such in with him).

And lastly, I was an Amare fan, but I think he's career will now consist of yearly trades as teams keep hoping he will be "back to normal" and he won't be. think Ralph Sampson from 1984 til - oh shiiiii...his time with the Bullets.

DC man...you are right, we are SCREWED!!!!

Just kidding.

Posted by: jefsadler | June 23, 2009 9:44 PM

Was hoping for Vince Carter, or Richard Jefferson.

Posted by: Darnell1 | June 23, 2009 9:45 PM

I am having a tough time choosing a side when evaluating this "possible" trade. And remember folks in the NBA these trades that are said to be agreed to in principle usually have some minor changes to the details before it becomes official.

Personally, I agree w/others here. I will feel better about it if the Wiz get one of the lower picks, too. I like Miller's skill set and I was a huge fan of Foye when he was coming out of college. I saw him as a poor man's D.Wade because he is a talented slasher who plays much bigger than his height (he had to guard PFs at NOVA).

Unfortunately, so far Foye has been a guy that I point to as someone I was wrong about when they were drafted. Here's hoping he lives-up to previous expectations and lets hope the pie gets sweeter by Thursday.

Posted by: SportzWiz | June 23, 2009 9:45 PM

"...Foye and Miller are just more scorers who can't stop anyone..." - anacostia85

Foye is actually a very good defender, capable of defending both the 1 and 2 guard positions.

Posted by: segastyle | June 23, 2009 9:46 PM

alright, assuming there is another trade to get a big...who goes? mike james sounds good, but it will probably take more. is it time to give up on young guys like ny, crit, and mcguire?

Posted by: hibachi | June 23, 2009 9:47 PM

Atlanta has been rumored to be trying to drop Smith in a cost cutting move, and the clippers want to get rid of one of their big men.

I don't want Randolph, but if the Wiz are really making a run next year, Marcus Camby at the center spot could go a long way to getting us there

While Smith is a great young PF, I can't see trading for him without also letting go of Jamison, and it sounds like Grunfeld doesn't want to break up his top 3.

Posted by: segastyle | June 23, 2009 9:49 PM

Ladies and Gentlemen, we are less than 24 hours until Etan Thomas's reign of terror in our nation's capital is over!!!

The most despicably bigoted, pitifully ignorant man in the NBA is finally on his way out. And his time poisoning our city's youth with his hate is over.

HALLELUJAH!!!

Posted by: Barno1 | June 23, 2009 9:26 PM

i dont understand y many ppl have so many neg comments to say bout this guy. this guy helps out the community so much and even try to come back from heart surgery and all u do is say pretty bad stuff bout him. he cant play anymore but that got nothin to do with what u said right here

Posted by: forbid | June 23, 2009 9:49 PM

segastyle I have seen Foye play quite a bit and the last time he stopped somebody was at Villanova

Posted by: anacostia85 | June 23, 2009 9:49 PM

DO IT NOW!

- Ray

Posted by: rmcazz | June 23, 2009 9:49 PM

I absoutely hate this trade...call me crazy but I like Pesh. Just know you heard it here first. We could have gotten more for the #5. WTF Ernie?

Posted by: Gooddad | June 23, 2009 9:50 PM

BTW, we all seem to forget that Haywood is in his last year under contract. A legit starting center, are a very good backup center at $5.5 mil in his last year is an attractive trade asset to teams.

Posted by: segastyle | June 23, 2009 9:50 PM

At first glance, this looks like a good deal for the Wiz and clears bad contracts and dead weight minus MJ.

My concern is we are going from a fairly lengthy team to a small team. Other than Haywood, there is zero "power" and/or size on the frontline. Someone pointed out that we are left with 7 guards and Blatche, Haywood, McGee. I don't like losing Songalia either. Trading big for small rarely works out well in the NBA. We'll see. If this happens, we definitely have to make further moves to balance the roster.

Posted by: rphilli721 | June 23, 2009 9:50 PM

maybe we made this move so we could go through with that Amare/Caron trade after all? we could send Butler, James' expiring contract, and Javale McGee (a cheap, young, athletic big to replace Amare) to the Suns, and we'd have Foye/Miller now to take Caron's place. Arenas, Foye, Miller, Jamison, Amare would be pretty nasty!

Posted by: brianc2540 | June 23, 2009 9:52 PM

Mike Miller and Mike James for Larry Hughes and Jared Jeffries.

Posted by: Darnell1 | June 23, 2009 9:53 PM

OK Barno and dc man...we get it...you hate the wizards and EG and the fans and Abe and the writers and especially etan...Now let me see what others have to say.

Posted by: jefsadler | June 23, 2009 9:44 PM

Dude what are you talking about? There is no bigger fan of Ernie Grunfeld and no bigger fan of the Wizards than me. Yeah I despise Etan Thomas because he is one of the worst human beings in professional sports. But I love Ernie and I love my Wiz, don't get it twisted.

And I really like this trade as well.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 23, 2009 9:54 PM

"BTW, we all seem to forget that Haywood is in his last year under contract. A legit starting center, are a very good backup center at $5.5 mil in his last year is an attractive trade asset to teams.

Posted by: segastyle | June 23, 2009 9:50 PM "

Let's see if EG can resign him before he hits the market.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 9:54 PM

I absoutely hate this trade...call me crazy but I like Pesh

Please tell me that was a typo.

It was Posh as in Posh Spice, right? Not Pesh.

Posted by: SteveMG | June 23, 2009 9:55 PM

"Mike Miller and Mike James for Larry Hughes and Jared Jeffries.

Posted by: Darnell1 | June 23, 2009 9:53 PM "

LMAO!

EG trades for guys to come back who left b/c EG didn't step up in the first place.

Classic.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 9:55 PM

this seems like a fair deal...Foye is better than Minn Fan thinks he is due to the bad trade that brought him to Minn. Miller is past his prime, but hopefully will regain his edge on a playoff team. If the Wiz do get a mid 1st round pick as well, then it becomes a steal for the Wiz. It would be nice to find a low post scorer as well, but I dont think the Wiz will spend much on free agency (picking up a Drew Gooden type would be sweet and really is what they need to get by Orlando and Boston). It will have to come via a second trade, though I dont know what they really have to offer now to make it happen, except maybe NY and an expiring contract of MJ and that mid first round pick they hopefully can get from Minn...So I think they are probably done after this trade with Minn. Ernie seems to like going into to training camp with 2 open roster spots and thats what he now has.

Posted by: oddjob2 | June 23, 2009 9:56 PM

Could'nt we have gotten a lot more than just those two?! We gave up the FIFTH overall pick AND 3 players for 2 players? Ugh, no improvement, can't win with these players, first round exit.. I'd rather have Steph Curry instead.

Posted by: rachel216 | June 23, 2009 9:57 PM

Boy, losing Darius would tough sentimentally. That guy made me proud to be a wizards fan. A true professional. Always did what was best for the team, even if it wasn't a desirable assignment.

Posted by: arn3z | June 23, 2009 9:58 PM

I sure hope another deal is in the works, because this is very very uninspiring.

The Spurs manage to pull off a move and get RJ, and us...Randy Foye and Mike Miller?? These are supposed to the be the guys the push the Wiz over the top in the East??

This move does not help us catch any of the teams that were already better than us before this trade occured. I'm not even sure if either of these guys crack the starting lineup.

Posted by: p1funk | June 23, 2009 9:58 PM

There is absolutely no way Foye and Arenas can play in abackcourt together. Both are pg's. Arenas healthy can;t guard 2's coming off a suspect knee he'd get posted on every possesion.

Foye is decent knows how to play but limited athletically. Type of player that could develop ala Billups in time.

Miller isn't worth the trade you're basically trading the 5th pick for Foye and the ability to dump salaries. No way we re-sign Miller so Foye for the 5th is the deal which is a bad bad move.

Posted by: jrwalkerivory | June 23, 2009 9:59 PM

If this is true. It's a deal to cut salary and not make the team better.

Posted by: 33dgriffin | June 23, 2009 9:59 PM

To address something somebody raised earlier about the number of guards: Miller is going play the role of backup SF. And with his passing ability and ability to spread the court, I can see him making Young, Crit, McGee and Blatche look very good.

Posted by: satchmore | June 23, 2009 9:59 PM

I think Ernie and Flip have reached the conclusion that they can't pair Arenas with a pure PG like Curry or Lawson, so they're going to try to recreate the Larry Hughes situation with Randy Foye.

Posted by: drischord | June 23, 2009 9:01 PM

Curry is a pure point guard?

http://www.nba.com/2009/news/features/vince_thomas/06/23/draft.curry/index.html

Posted by: crs-one | June 23, 2009 10:00 PM

"EG trades for guys to come back who left b/c EG didn't step up in the first place."

Classic.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 9:55 PM

You don't mean Jared Jeffries the guy in NY who hasn't done crap ever since he left DC do ya?? Oh crucify EG already for not stepping up!!

Oh and Larry Hughes?? You mean the guy who continued to get hurt and decline ever since he left DC....AND the guy who was eventually replaced by Caron Butler by not having to sign him to a long term deal.

Oh no EG why aren't you stepping up!!! Noooooooo!!

lol @ u

Posted by: Bullzards80 | June 23, 2009 10:02 PM

Yeah, if this trade goes thru, I think NY is gone. Don't see who else in the logjam would entice a trade for a decent big.

Posted by: rphilli721 | June 23, 2009 10:04 PM

I absoutely hate this trade...call me crazy but I like Pesh

Please tell me that was a typo.

It was Posh as in Posh Spice, right? Not Pesh.

No mistake...with the right coach and PT, Pesh will do just fine. Also, Caron for Amare...stick to doing whatever you do, trades are not your thing.

D Song and not Mike James...WTF? I HATE this trade. I hope the dealing is far from done...the 5 for Foye and Miller..are you kidding me? Tell me this is a bad dream

Posted by: Gooddad | June 23, 2009 10:04 PM

"You don't mean Jared Jeffries the guy in NY who hasn't done crap ever since he left DC do ya?? Oh crucify EG already for not stepping up!!

Oh and Larry Hughes?? You mean the guy who continued to get hurt and decline ever since he left DC....AND the guy who was eventually replaced by Caron Butler by not having to sign him to a long term deal.

Oh no EG why aren't you stepping up!!! Noooooooo!!

lol @ u

Posted by: Bullzards80 | June 23, 2009 10:02 PM "

So why the heck would EG want these guys back?

BTW, Les BouleS have gone on a downward spiral since LH left.

In case your pea brain is hung up, LH's last season here was when they last made it to the 2nd round of the playoffs.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 10:04 PM

bryc3, while SadieV might have just served as a clear-cut example of how ridiculous we are in viewing our local athletes more as stat lines than human beings, I fail to see a political position taken. Unless, of course, it's yours. Do 6'10", dreadlocked, poetry-inclined Democrat volunteer activists have a corner on the market for charitable works and service?

Posted by: birk1666 | June 23, 2009 10:06 PM



Boy, losing Darius would tough sentimentally. That guy made me proud to be a wizards fan. A true professional. Always did what was best for the team, even if it wasn't a desirable assignment.

Posted by: arn3z | June 23, 2009 9:58 PM

Darius was really under-appreciated, a guy who would play out of position at Center, muscle much taller players out of the way, and play the best closeout defense on the perimeter of any player on the Wizards team. He's an x-factor, and I'm sorry to see him go.

Posted by: satchmore | June 23, 2009 10:06 PM

Ladies and Gentlemen, we are less than 24 hours until Etan Thomas's reign of terror in our nation's capital is over!!!

The most despicably bigoted, pitifully ignorant man in the NBA is finally on his way out. And his time poisoning our city's youth with his hate is over.

HALLELUJAH!!!

Posted by: Barno1 | June 23, 2009 9:26 PM

Let it go. It's getting old.

Posted by: crs-one | June 23, 2009 10:07 PM

with this trade we lose all leverage in the next trade if there is one. we'll have no first rounder this year nor a high projection for next year. we'll have a roster of "untouchables" (GA,CB?,AJ)and second tier guys to offer up. ernie will have to give up one of the big three or some of our young talent. i think we can get the same value of this trade if we hold out or even use the pick.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 23, 2009 10:07 PM

No trade, take James Harden, and hope for an injury-free year the Wizards are due.

Posted by: clandestinetomcat | June 23, 2009 10:08 PM

I was disappointed to see Songaila's name included. The trade should probably still be done, but I had the same feeling when AD was moved. I just like the guys, but I guess you can't get something for nothing.

Posted by: crs-one | June 23, 2009 10:09 PM

I absoutely hate this trade...call me crazy but I like Pesh. Just know you heard it here first. We could have gotten more for the #5. WTF Ernie?

Posted by: Gooddad | June 23, 2009 9:50 PM

You shouldn't be allowed to post here after that Pesh comment.

Posted by: dominic10464 | June 23, 2009 10:10 PM

NO! TERRIBLE!!!

This is NOT the deal we wanted/needed.

Posted by: msveasey | June 23, 2009 10:11 PM

Foye and Miller are both expiring contracts, so EG was able to turn Songaila's multiyear contract into expiring contracts. Don't judge this trade until after the trade deadline.

Posted by: yop32 | June 23, 2009 10:11 PM

"segastyle I have seen Foye play quite a bit and the last time he stopped somebody was at Villanova" - anacostia85

Multiple outside sources tend to disagree with you about his defensive ability. But I'm not saying he's a top flight defender in the league. I'm saying he's better than anyone else we currently have at either guard position.

I said early he was a very good defender, maybe I should have added that I was comparing him to our current roster.

He's an above average defender at his position. For us that's a plus.

Posted by: segastyle | June 23, 2009 10:15 PM

I don't get it.

Randy Foye will basically give us what we had in DeShawn Stevenson when he was healthy. It's not like Foye is gonna get a ton of shots over/against GA, CB and AJ. We'll ask him to score some points and play D, maybe spell GA for some minutes. That's it.

Then we add a 3-point shooter with a 50-50 chance of being washed up.

In exchange, we give up all of our veteran big-man backups AND the #5 pick? I don't see how we have strengthened our team overall with this move.

Posted by: p1funk | June 23, 2009 10:16 PM

What I don't understand is how so many fans on here lack faith in Ernie Grunfeld, a man who is universally accepted as one of the best GMs in basketball and a man who completely turned around this team from a decades long rut to a team that made the playoffs in 4 consecutive years. It's simply ludicrous that he hasn't earned a helluva lot of respect from Wiz fans.

But that's just the nature of fans...most are idiots.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 23, 2009 10:18 PM

What is the fascination with Amare? Two microfractures and a detached retina are extremely risky. I think we have enough medical issues with this roster!

Posted by: rphilli721 | June 23, 2009 10:18 PM

This is the thought process of a loser led organization. Totally soft down the middle on defense and this is the solution?
I would rather trade Ernie Grunfield and keep the #5 pick.
Wizzed On Again

Posted by: brianmo19 | June 23, 2009 10:19 PM

"I sure hope another deal is in the works, because this is very very uninspiring."

Look at it this way....

They are not possibly going into the season with 7 guards.

Stevensons minutes just got cut.

The Wiz will have LOTS of room to be a player in 2010.

I mean seriously, what did they lose in Etan Thomas, Songaila, and some tall goofy dude who only wants to shoot 3's?

Great trade EG, I'm proud of you!

- Ray

Posted by: rmcazz | June 23, 2009 10:20 PM

I really feel there is another trade coming...this seriously cant be all that EG got up his sleeve...or at least i hope not...lez bullez strikes again...*sigh*

Posted by: AaronB1790 | June 23, 2009 10:20 PM

If the Wizards were going to be significantly over the tax this season, I would've laughed if it was for Mike Miller's 9.75 salary....

What is the "other" deal that can happen here? Nick Young and Mike James for Chris Kaman?

Posted by: wizfan305 | June 23, 2009 10:21 PM

Songaila, if he picks up a player option for 10-11, matches Foye's salary for that year. So if there's any savings for the Wiz at all, it's the $2.386 Pech is owed in 10-11 and the $3.377 in 11-12.

Posted by: KeithMcMillan | June 23, 2009 9:26 PM

Any savings? How about they don't have to pay a 5th pick salary that would have put them over the cap?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 23, 2009 10:23 PM

Watch out Orlando Magic and Cleveland Lebroniers! We got Mike Miller and Rand Foye now! It's on!!!

Not.

Posted by: BillEmm | June 23, 2009 10:25 PM

In case y'all havent noticed, Deshawn sucks. So Foye is a good pickup.

Always liked Skinny, and 40% 3pt shooter will be a great fit.

But after Caron's pretty bad year...surprises me we didnt pull trigger for the amare deal. That guy is just a BEAST. Kind of a headcase, could have blown up in our faces...but the kind of risk you take.

Posted by: divi3 | June 23, 2009 10:25 PM

The key is that Miller only has 1 year left on his deal. Foye has 1 year then is a restricted free agent.

Miller is clearly an upgrade over Etan for next year, and they get that without losing any of the flexibility next summer. Miller + James = $15 mil coming off the books. Darius was locked in for 2 more seasons at 4.5 mil, more than he was worth.

Other than the salary stuff, it comes down to #5 for Foye. Nobody can call that right or wrong right now.

Posted by: WhySoSerious | June 23, 2009 10:25 PM

What I don't understand is how so many fans on here lack faith in Ernie Grunfeld, a man who is universally accepted as one of the best GMs in basketball and a man who completely turned around this team from a decades long rut to a team that made the playoffs in 4 consecutive years. It's simply ludicrous that he hasn't earned a helluva lot of respect from Wiz fans.

But that's just the nature of fans...most are idiots.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 23, 2009 10:18 PM


Ernie Grunfeld gave $160 million to 2 starters who can't defend, and one of them was on crutches for a repeat knee surgery when pen got put to paper.

Ernie Grunfeld is currently trying to trade away 3 players that he either drafted or signed.

Kudos to Ernie for helping the Wiz out of the playoff drought - and I mean that honestly. But this team, as it is currently constructed, has NO chance of winning an NBA title, and that's what matters, right?

Posted by: p1funk | June 23, 2009 10:25 PM

giving up a shot at the next young penny for two sencond teamers. we'll regret the trade if evans is there at five .

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 23, 2009 10:25 PM

Don't laugh. Ernie got Caron for Kwame. And that's a fact.

Posted by: satchmore | June 23, 2009 10:26 PM

I sure hope this isn't true!!!! The only plus out of this is that ET's contract would be off the books.

I guess Vinny Cerato is moonlighting as the Wizards GM!

Posted by: LB89 | June 23, 2009 10:27 PM

we want the funk
gotta have that funk

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 23, 2009 10:29 PM

Watch out Orlando Magic and Cleveland Lebroniers! We got Mike Miller and Rand Foye now! It's on!!!

Not.

Posted by: BillEmm | June 23, 2009 10:25 PM


My point exactly. This trade does not put us over any of the other teams in the East that were already better than us.

I thought we were gearing up for a serious run? Now we are talking about pinching pennies and the luxury tax and we're supposed to pat someone on the back b/c we saved a couple mill on some salaries?

I seriously hope another trade is in the works, because as it stands we pretty much look poised to get bounced in the 1st or 2nd round again.

Posted by: p1funk | June 23, 2009 10:29 PM

last year Kevin Love %th pick made 3 million so this deal saves CHEAP ABE about 3.2 million. Is he going to lower the ticket prices?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 23, 2009 10:31 PM

It is very hard to improve a team in one season specialy when you have bad contract and you are over the salary limit. It is not an exiting trade but Washington will have multiple advantage in this trade.
1/They got two role players for a pick which is going to be another project.
2/they can still use the expiring contract of miller and/ or Mike to land a dependable veteran.
3/ At the end of the season they will have miller's 9.7, mike's 6.4 and blaches 3.5 million. If they add the 3.5 million to haywood, they will have 16.3 million to improve their roster to shampionship level.
4/ they managed to kick sangalia's big contract.Sangalia is a smart player but not expected to be productive if both JM and Blache are playing good.

Posted by: gtefferra | June 23, 2009 10:32 PM

what trophy has ernie brought here or anywhere in the nba to get the free pass homie? we're sufferin here. the first round or even second round ain't sjk. we've proven nothing since he got here other than we can play avg ball (4th and 5th seed) and be entertaining when healthy. the wiz aren't winners. at this point i think every move EG makes should be looked at with skepticism. for all he's done we ain't winnin'.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | June 23, 2009 10:33 PM

I agree 100% with WhySoSerious.

I think this is a great deal for the Wiz and Miller is an upgrade over a few players the Wiz have already. If he has a good year then he can come back cheaper if he wants. Otherwise they shed that contract and be a player in 2010.

Again, I don't think EG intends to go into the season with 7 guards so we'll see what happens. It might be something minor, but they need to add some depth now at the 3/4.

This is a really good deal for the Wiz.

- Ray

Posted by: rmcazz | June 23, 2009 10:34 PM

"Don't laugh. Ernie got Caron for Kwame. And that's a fact.

Posted by: satchmore | June 23, 2009 10:26 PM "

And what did LA get for Kwame?

Some dude by the name of Pau Gasol, who just so happens to have a ring now, while Caron's team is lottery bound.

Figure that out.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 10:34 PM

It is very hard to improve a team in one season specialy when you have bad contract and you are over the salary limit.

Posted by: gtefferra | June 23, 2009 10:32 PM

So what you are saying is that we should get excited, b/c Ernie is trying make amends for the horrible contract/salary situation that he put this team in?

Forgive me if I save my confetti...

Posted by: p1funk | June 23, 2009 10:35 PM

Ernie Grunfeld gave $160 million to 2 starters who can't defend, and one of them was on crutches for a repeat knee surgery when pen got put to paper.

Ernie Grunfeld is currently trying to trade away 3 players that he either drafted or signed.

Kudos to Ernie for helping the Wiz out of the playoff drought - and I mean that honestly. But this team, as it is currently constructed, has NO chance of winning an NBA title, and that's what matters, right?

Posted by: p1funk | June 23, 2009 10:25 PM

I'd worry about winning 50 games and getting to the 2nd round of the playoffs before we start talking about NBA titles. This team is quite capable of achieving its first 50 win season in decades and doing some damage in the playoffs--provided they get home court advantage for once. And I don't mind the Arenas and Jamison contracts. Most GMs would have given those guys that money--in fact Arenas could have gotten more at the time. A guy entering his prime, a year removed from his 3rd consecutive all star game and 30 pts per game. You're nuts if you think that was a bad deal at the time.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 23, 2009 10:35 PM

This is good news b/c it tells me the Wiz think Gil will be OK. Just as sending Caron or Jamison away for salary dumps and/or kids would send the opposite message. The deal itself, meh. I trust Ernie, but I will cop to being leery sitting on my couch and having never worked one 1/2 hour as a professional NBA talent evaluator. Seems like we are renting Miller for a year and taking a flier that Foye will continue to develop. And yes, I bought into the "Kobe for Pech and the 5th pick"-style craziness we have been bombarded with over the past few weeks, so I wasn't 100% realistic & am a little deflated. Still, overall GREAT news in what it shows the Wiz are thinking.

Posted by: juno77275 | June 23, 2009 10:36 PM

Man you guys aren't seeing the big picture here. It's not just this upcoming season, it's beyond that.

At the very WORST they dump tons of cash for 2010 when there's several top free agents available.

They dumped three players that will NEVER be a factor in the NBA and they got a vet off the bench who can also start and a young guard who averages 16 points a game for a BAD team.

This is a really good move for the Wiz.

- Ray

Posted by: rmcazz | June 23, 2009 10:38 PM

I don't understand what some of the people here are complaining about. This trade puts the Wizards in a substantially better place than any pick in this year's draft would get them. Did you really think Curry or Evans would push the Wiz to the second round? I love Curry, but even I didn't make that leap. Hope springs eternal, I guess.

Personally, I'd rather take a phenom who's played a couple of years as the leader of his team. And Miller is a veteran who can contribute, not just some rookie. Here again, the Wizards have three (now four, with Foye) players who can force double teams. And can Miller hit an open shot? Yes, he can.

As a bonus, they unload Etan's salary, despite the trade kicker. Timberwolves fans are p#$$ed.

So many drafts result in no benefit. Ernie secured a significant benefit. Yes, I say bring on the Cavs.

Posted by: satchmore | June 23, 2009 10:39 PM

Anybody knockin Antawn should find another team to root for.

Posted by: divi3 | June 23, 2009 10:40 PM

I'd worry about winning 50 games and getting to the 2nd round of the playoffs before we start talking about NBA titles. This team is quite capable of achieving its first 50 win season in decades and doing some damage in the playoffs--provided they get home court advantage for once. And I don't mind the Arenas and Jamison contracts. Most GMs would have given those guys that money--in fact Arenas could have gotten more at the time. A guy entering his prime, a year removed from his 3rd consecutive all star game and 30 pts per game. You're nuts if you think that was a bad deal at the time.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 23, 2009 10:35 PM

And do you really think this team wins 50 games next year? Honestly? With JaVale Mcgee and/or Andray Blatche coming off the bench to spell Haywood? With Dominic McGuire as our tough-guy at the 4 spot?

And yes, I think giving $116 million to a one-dimensional guard coming off of double knee surgery (which then became triple knee surgery) was nuts. You have no idea what he's gonna look like or if he can regain All-Star form. It's nuts to give a guy on crutches that much money for something he did a year earlier before blowing out a knee.

Posted by: p1funk | June 23, 2009 10:41 PM

"And can Miller hit an open shot? Yes, he can."

And this is exactly why I say Stevenson's days are numbered in Washington. Stevenson got D played on him this past year regardless of the back and wilted.

- Ray

Posted by: rmcazz | June 23, 2009 10:42 PM

So this move will free up room for cap space at the end of next year? What free agent worth anything wants to play with the Wizards?
As for Ernie, for every good move he has made, he has made at least 2 bad moves. He took a team that was bad and at best made them mediocre. I hate to say anything good about Danny Ainge, but he took a bad team and put together a championship team. I am a Wizards fan but this is another example of doing something and getting nothing. We need to do something and see improvement.

Posted by: Boogadiggy | June 23, 2009 10:43 PM

p1funk- not sure how you could watch Mcgee's rookie year and not see massive potential. Also, anybody who has followed wiz saw the HUGE difference haywood's absence made. If the team is 100% healthy, sure 50 games is possible.

Flip wins 50 in his sleep

Posted by: divi3 | June 23, 2009 10:44 PM

"It's nuts to give a guy on crutches that much money for something he did a year earlier before blowing out a knee."

While I do not agree with the money Gil stole...er made, I don't think a cartiledge tear is blowing out a knee.

Health is not an issue with Gil, it's if he can share the ball. I'm more worried about that this upcoming year.

- Ray

Posted by: rmcazz | June 23, 2009 10:45 PM

And what did LA get for Kwame?

Some dude by the name of Pau Gasol, who just so happens to have a ring now, while Caron's team is lottery bound.

Figure that out.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 10:34 PM

Right. Because that deal wouldn't have happened without Kwame.

Posted by: crs-one | June 23, 2009 10:46 PM

I like McGee's potential and I think he made great steps. But he's a backup at the 3 spot. There's no way he goes up against some of the premiere 4-men in the league.

Posted by: p1funk | June 23, 2009 10:48 PM

"Don't laugh. Ernie got Caron for Kwame. And that's a fact.

Posted by: satchmore | June 23, 2009 10:26 PM "

And what did LA get for Kwame?

Some dude by the name of Pau Gasol, who just so happens to have a ring now, while Caron's team is lottery bound.

Figure that out.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 10:34 PM

I guess I'm supposed to figure out that the Wizards should have held onto Kwame and preserved cap space for Pau Gasol. Seriously, read what you're writing.. you're an idiot.

Posted by: satchmore | June 23, 2009 10:49 PM

"What free agent worth anything wants to play with the Wizards?"

It's not hard for anyone to want to come to a team that has the pieces in place to go far into the playoffs. The thing is they have to prove that they can stay healthy first.

ONE thing I will give the Wiz is that they are NOT afraid of Cleveland. They don't buy into the hype, even this past year when they were so beat up.

The key is to stay healthy, but they haven't proved that yet so we'll see.

- Ray

Posted by: rmcazz | June 23, 2009 10:49 PM

Gil had 20 assists and 1 turnover in 2 games this year. After missing 70+ games, he came in and was immediately our best playmaker again. Have no fear about Gil.

Posted by: divi3 | June 23, 2009 10:49 PM

While I do not agree with the money Gil stole...er made, I don't think a cartiledge tear is blowing out a knee.

Health is not an issue with Gil, it's if he can share the ball. I'm more worried about that this upcoming year.

- Ray

Posted by: rmcazz | June 23, 2009 10:45 PM


Well, you and I are worried about different things. I'm worried about the health of that knee. Whether you are comfortable calling it "blown out" or not, 3 surgeries in a year on the same knee is not a small thing for a guard who relies on quickness and explosiveness to get his points.

Posted by: p1funk | June 23, 2009 10:51 PM

yes trading big for small is historically not a good idea but when you look at the "bigs" we gave up song- the least athletic man in the league- solid in all areas other than athleticism etan- 6'7 center, complete garabage and pech- who knows, the man may be a decent shooter/rebounder but he plays like a 4th grader constantly trying to earn the extra point stretching his range too far
None of those guys are anything to miss and miller and foye are instantly our 4th and 5th best players, if we could pair aj with a guard or two and get someone who plays tough physical d and is good for 10 points I'd be happy, jamison trying to hoist it so he can outscore his man is not a solution at power forward he needs to be the 6th man or shipped out

Posted by: bford1kb | June 23, 2009 10:53 PM

Flip wins 50 in his sleep

Posted by: divi3 | June 23, 2009 10:44 PM

Yeah, with Rasheed Wallace, Chauncey Billups, Richard Hamilton and Tayshaun Prince in their primes, I would also win 50 in my sleep.

Posted by: p1funk | June 23, 2009 10:53 PM

Gotta disagree about Mcgee. This was just his rookie year, and he is gangly as all hell. Kid runs like a track star and is looooooong. Jumps out of the gym, and is a crazy aggressive defender. Once he fills out...

And he's a 5, I think he will smother any 4s around the rim once he's got some experience.

Will have better career than Oden...not sure of that is saying much tho!

Posted by: divi3 | June 23, 2009 10:54 PM

Not a great deal but certainly not a bad one. Low risk for medium reward. Foye is not and won't be a star, but he can help. Miller is a solid all-around player who can do a lot of things on the court, a needed element given how many one dimensional role players the Wiz have had.

They give up a pick that likely wasn't going to yield much, a role player, and some bench dead weight and only took on 1 extra year of salary in Foye for a relatively small $3.5 mill (while also freeing themselves of obligation to sign the pick). My guess is this is just step number one and that Grunfeld has more to come.

(It also proves my point that having those expiring contracts spread across mulitple players creates more options than having them bundled into one player (like, say, Larry Hughes).

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 23, 2009 10:55 PM

Good deal on paper especially if one of the lower two T-Wolves 1st round draft picks are included. If not, then addition by subtraction also works.

Clears some cap room, but leaves a hole at backup PF and Back-up center positions. If we had the 18th pick, might be able to Hansbourough who has toughness to back up at PF.

Randy Foye is more of a shoot first point guard instead of a true point. Sure hope that Mike Miller gets his shooting touch back.


Perhaps, Josh Heytvelt or Dajuan Summers will be picked at #32
If we could find someone to take Mike James and D. Stevenson off our hands, this would be a great draft.

Posted by: RichAbraham | June 23, 2009 10:57 PM

"We need to do something and see improvement."

The only way to see improvement is to watch the games and look for it. Check back in November.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 23, 2009 10:59 PM

http://blogs.mercurynews.com/kawakami/2009/05/08/my-second-annual-nba-no-defense-team-starring-martin-jamison-durant-and-don-nelson/
here is the criticism of jamison and any wizards fan who excuses his defense should really reconsider their basketball philosophy

Posted by: bford1kb | June 23, 2009 11:01 PM

"I don't see how we have strengthened our team overall with this move."

We just subtracted two dead bodies and one mediocre role-playing veteran for one mediocre role-playing veteran (at worst) and a solid established combo-guard with the potential to be very, very good in this league. On top of that, we turned a contract that will end up being bad (for Minn) into a contract that will end up expiring at the end of the season.

Mike Miller for Songaila, Pech, and Thomas would already be value for the Wizards. The question then becomes whether or not the #5 will be better than Foye. Foye is already a 16+ ppg scorer, an above average defender, a good 3-pt shooter, and is versatile enough to play on the ball or off the ball. And he's still improving. Someone(s) will probably end up being better selected #5 or after, but odds are that the majority of selections will not (and thus the chances of the Wizards selecting said player would not have been good).

It's the safe play, and it really isn't a bad one. At all.

Posted by: psps23 | June 23, 2009 11:01 PM

Jamison brings it every night for 20/10 and is the consummate professional. LAST guy on the roster that should be criticized.

This org hasnt played defense for YEARS, not sure why you'd single out Antawn

Posted by: divi3 | June 23, 2009 11:04 PM

Okay, I know we're 178 comments into this post already, but, um ...

Poll added. :)

Posted by: Keith McMillan | June 23, 2009 11:05 PM

Ray -

Who wants to come to play for the Wizards? I have not heard the Wizards mentioned by any soon to be free agent. What has Jamison, Butler and Arenas accomplished? I haven't seen them in the conference finals yet. If you are expecting free agents to get us into the finals, then you will be disappointed.

Posted by: Boogadiggy | June 23, 2009 11:05 PM

WHAT are you people smoking , big men that can dance is what the Laker need ,oh no i mean the Wizards . Sell the team , get some real Knowledgeable (Having or exhibiting knowledge) people in here to run things ,I'm sick of this mess . So until they get it right i will just pray for my son (he's a wizard fan )me, got ring (15)a class act BACK to BACK yea . I could do better period

Posted by: chasemo2 | June 23, 2009 11:05 PM

WHAT are you people smoking , big men that can dance is what the Laker need ,oh no i mean the Wizards . Sell the team , get some real Knowledgeable (Having or exhibiting knowledge) people in here to run things ,I'm sick of this mess . So until they get it right i will just pray for my son (he's a wizard fan )me, got ring (15)a class act BACK to BACK yea . I could do better period

Posted by: chasemo2 | June 23, 2009 11:07 PM

THIS TRADE SUCKS unless there is another deal on the way. After 10 years I dumped my season tix. When will we ever trade for size and defense? These guys cannot defend...... I still like my Wiz but I hate this trade. I want to now see NY disappear and I honestly wouldn't mind seeing Jamison leave. Defense wins - gunners cannot.......

Posted by: jzamoiski | June 23, 2009 11:08 PM

people forget what the squad looked like for the 25 years before grunfeld pretty quickly, here's a little reminder labradford smith and calbert cheaney

Posted by: bford1kb | June 23, 2009 11:09 PM

Ernie isn't done yet because he needs to make sure the Wizards are under the cap next year.

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 23, 2009 11:10 PM

All hopes for transforming into a defensive oriented team should have vanished with the hiring of Flip.

Wizards fans...it is what it is. When we signed Gil it was Abe deciding to roll with this team and see where it goes, the man doesnt have the time for another tear down/rebuild.

Posted by: divi3 | June 23, 2009 11:12 PM

We just subtracted two dead bodies and one mediocre role-playing veteran for one mediocre role-playing veteran (at worst) and a solid established combo-guard with the potential to be very, very good in this league. On top of that, we turned a contract that will end up being bad (for Minn) into a contract that will end up expiring at the end of the season.

Mike Miller for Songaila, Pech, and Thomas would already be value for the Wizards. The question then becomes whether or not the #5 will be better than Foye. Foye is already a 16+ ppg scorer, an above average defender, a good 3-pt shooter, and is versatile enough to play on the ball or off the ball. And he's still improving. Someone(s) will probably end up being better selected #5 or after, but odds are that the majority of selections will not (and thus the chances of the Wizards selecting said player would not have been good).

It's the safe play, and it really isn't a bad one. At all.

Posted by: psps23 | June 23, 2009 11:01 PM


Except you left out the fact that we are waaaaayyy thin at the 4-5 spot with Mcgee, Blatche and McGuire rotating in at 4 and 5. We got smaller and we are weaker inside. If you think Mike Miller is worth out veteran depth at PF and Center, I would simply disagree with you.

Foye averaged 16 ppg as the premiere ball-handler and guard on the Wolves. He got 35 minutes a game. So the stats you throw out become relatively meaningless when we understand that he's gonna be a 4th option behind GA, CB and AJ. In fact some folks are saying he's gonna come off the bench. But we already had scoring coming off the bench in Nick Young and Foye is not a true point guard. What we got seems to be minor upgrade over a healthy DeShawn Stevenson. That's not worth the #5 pick in my book.

At this stage safe plays aren't helping the Wiz get to the Finals - that's why I'm not impressed.

Again, I hope there is another deal in the works. But as of right now, I'm holding onto my confetti...

Posted by: p1funk | June 23, 2009 11:15 PM

In case your pea brain is hung up, LH's last season here was when they last made it to the 2nd round of the playoffs.
Posted by: DC_MAN88 | June 23, 2009 10:04 PM

Still the village idiot. Go die swine.

Posted by: Rocc00 | June 23, 2009 11:17 PM

Trading Amare is not just a risk.If you expect him at the season opener, you have noclue about retinal detachment.There is a very high chance for that dude not to see the court.Please stop complaining on EG.

Posted by: gtefferra | June 23, 2009 11:18 PM

Do I have to say I TOLD YOU SO.....

ABE IS CHEAP
ABE IS CHEAP
ABE IS CHEAP

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 23, 2009 11:18 PM

This trade carries littl risk. Both Miller and Foye have expiring contract (Foye will be a restricted FA). So if they do not work out, Wizards are not tied down.

Posted by: sagaliba | June 23, 2009 11:18 PM

jamison is the weakest link defensively (now that song doesn't have to play center for us anymore, thanks to both eddies for that delightful defensive strategy), power forwards getting handled is not okay, protecting the paint is a large part of the power forward's duty and jamison cannot help in this area as a guy that plays 40 a night at pf, unacceptable, he is a gunner as a power forward, his stats do not justify his game, the man never passes and forces up awful, contested, off-balance jumpshots with stunning regularity and then completely crapped on his own teammates acting like he, the man playing the most minutes, shooting the most and getting absolutely burnt by his man every night had nothing to do with it, instead he blames the young guys, this is not the way any teammate should act let alone the captain, acting like the rest of the team playing poor defense makes it okay to have the worst defensive, starting "big man" in the league is just foolish, surely the captain giving half-assed close-outs and taking bad shots has no effect on the team

Posted by: bford1kb | June 23, 2009 11:19 PM

Mike Miller will have a better Washington career then Tracy Murray, Don Mclean or John Williams..

Hmmm not sure what that means.

Maybe Ernie will package him for a big.

Posted by: dcinmd1 | June 23, 2009 11:19 PM

An interesting Gamble.

Foye interests me. I've never seen him play. My optimistic side wants to believe that he'll live up to his potential, here in DC. I just hope he doesn't turn out to be another Stevenson. Can we please deal that guy? Maybe we could get the 'Spurs' water guy for him... something like that

I like this trade, though i don't know how these players perform on the defensive side-- that makes me nervous. This almost makes up for the Roger Mason jr. gaffe that WAS the wizards off season, last year (Miller for Mason jr... ok). I was reading up on Miller, i had no idea he won 6th man of the year in 2005-2006. If he returns to that form, it could be a steal. He had an off year, last year, but-- in his defense-- it must have been pretty hard to get into his game playing on a team like the Timberwolves. We'll just have to wait to see if he fits.

Posted by: oljakers | June 23, 2009 11:20 PM

"I haven't seen them in the conference finals yet."

As I said they have to stay healthy first.

But why wouldn't you want to play in Washington and in the East with three dudes around you who could be all-stars any given year?

Seems to me the East is STILL wide open.

- Ray

Posted by: rmcazz | June 23, 2009 11:21 PM

Interesting move. Like most, I would be happier if one of the T-wolves later picks was coming back in the deal.

If they keep Foye and Miller, I think it's an ok deal. They greatly improve their perimeter depth and overall depth, but their frontcourt gets no love. Not yet anyway.

If Miller or Foye get spun into someone else, it will be interesting to see who that will be.

I'm ok with Foye. He's already the 2nd best guard on the roster (if you count Caron as a 3). I think you can play him with Gil depending on the matchup and they could cause problems for teams. Or if the matchup isn't favorable, he runs the second unit, and should be able to be productive against second line guys. Miller should also be a productive sub off the bench or spot starter if Caron is hurt. But I would like to make sure McGuire continues to get minutes because I liked the way he was starting to play last year. Though he was an offensive liability from a scoring standpoint, he was getting rb's, blocks, steals and assists. In other words, was doing the little things without the ball this team needs.

This deal does open the possibility of trading Caron -- at least in a positional sense. I don't know if I like the Amare for Caron deal. I like Amare, but that deal basically leaves you with two high dollar players, Amare and AJ, who play the same position, unless Amare is willing to play center. It sort of recreates the awkward C-Webb / Juwan dynamic of the 90s.

Please don't bring back Larry Hughes and Jared Jeffries. Someone mentioned Jeffries in terms of acquiring a big with a pulse. Jeffries is not a big. He's 6'10", but it's a thin 6'10" and anyone who has seen him play lately could easily debate whether he has a pulse. I loved Larry when he was here, but he is not the same player anymore and will never play more than 60 games in an NBA season again.

I agree with most that I don't think Ernie is done. I don't agree with everything he does, but he is without question a competent NBA GM. Someone was bashing him the other day for the AJ deal from Dallas because Devin Harris is now an all-star. Yeah, bummer, all we got was five years of 20pts 10rbs and 4 trips to the playoffs. We got robbed.

Curious to see how all of this plays out before I pass final judgement.

Posted by: ts35 | June 23, 2009 11:22 PM

"We got smaller and we are weaker inside."

Not really. First of all, the loss of Pech is meaningless as far as frontcourt depth and strength. He provided neither. Thomas couldn't be counted on to stay healthy (he never has) and coming off yet another leg injury, there's no guarantee he'd be able to suit up when the season started. And when he did play, well, so what? He's basically just marking time until his career ends. Songaila brought toughness, hustle, smarts, and effort, but little in the way in production. Haywood's return to health should more replace what they lose from Songaila, as will allowing Blatche to play more of a supporting role. McGee should show some improvement under Saunders, and his length and athelticism should be effective in Flip's offense and zone defense.

In other words, least season their 4/5 rotation was basically Blatche, McGee, and Songaila. Does anyone really think that's better than Haywood, Blatche, and McGee?

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 23, 2009 11:24 PM

"Except you left out the fact that we are waaaaayyy thin at the 4-5 spot with Mcgee, Blatche and McGuire rotating in at 4 and 5."

Yea, but we were already thin there before. We lost Songaila, but that's not a big deal in my eyes. Solid player, but not a championship caliber role guy IMO. I've always had the impression that if Songaila is playing a major role for your team, you really aren't going anywhere deep.

And a healthy DeShawn was a pretty good player. Two years ago, he was pivotal in our overachieving run without Arenas. Foye already is that caliber, and he's still young with room to improve.

This move alone isn't going to take this team to being championship caliber, that's true (if you didn't already believe they were close, when healthy, to begin with). But neither was the #5 pick. And there's still plenty of assets Ernie has to move around. I don't think the painting is complete.

Posted by: psps23 | June 23, 2009 11:26 PM

After studying the deal a little more, I'm sold that it will probably be a good deal for us. I mean, we definitely would have blown the #5 pick on the wrong person anyway...

We gave up nothin' but dead weight for two guys that can help our team win this season.

That's pretty good.

I was hoping for better, something a little sexier, but I'll take this for now and hope we've got another move up our sleeve.

Posted by: msveasey | June 23, 2009 11:27 PM

If I had to guess, I think Foye is more likely to be moved along in another deal than Miller.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 23, 2009 11:28 PM

I know this is all about salary dump but for the #5 pick couldn't we at least get ONE bona-fide star? I mean these are two average players. What's the BFD?

Posted by: dovelevine | June 23, 2009 11:29 PM

And if someone--ANYONE--wants Jamison for anything, for goodness sake get rid of em. When will Ernie Gs love infatuation with Jamison wear off. The guy is a liability. If you can pawn him off on someone do it!

Posted by: dovelevine | June 23, 2009 11:31 PM

"I know this is all about salary dump but for the #5 pick couldn't we at least get ONE bona-fide star? "

No, because there aren't any bona fide stars to be had in the draft at #5. Why would someone give up a star for a chance to draft someone who they think won't be one?

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 23, 2009 11:34 PM

another in a long line of stupid decisions by the wizards. i give polin credit for being loyal but enough is enough. i'm sick of the horrible franchise owners in dc who continue to wreck the teams. polin, snyder and the lerners are just plain awful. such poor leadership and decision making. ernie is an arrogant dumbass who can't put a team of talented players on the floor.

Posted by: everlast1 | June 23, 2009 11:38 PM

Songaila, if he picks up a player option for 10-11, matches Foye's salary for that year. So if there's any savings for the Wiz at all, it's the $2.386 Pech is owed in 10-11 and the $3.377 in 11-12.

Posted by: KeithMcMillan | June 23, 2009 9:26 PM

Any savings? How about they don't have to pay a 5th pick salary that would have put them over the cap?

Yup, you're right.

Also, I didn't realize at first that Foye was going to be a restricted free agent (the $4.795 for him is the qualifying offer).

So yeah, it's Songaila's guaranteed $4.8 mil in 10-11 for Miller AND Foye's expiring contracts, plus not having to pay a draft pick this year.

That gives them the flexibility to -- among other things -- re-sign/extend Caron and/or Haywood, whose deals are up soon (Haywood this year, 10-11 for Caron)

Posted by: Keith McMillan | June 23, 2009 11:39 PM

On paper, its seems like a good trade but the Wizards have the worst luck. So I'm withholding judgement until I see practice games and pre-season play. In the meantime, why can't we get players who are big and strong and like to drive to the basket, instead of just taking a shot in the paint. That is my hope. Driving to the basket opens opportunities for clean looks and open shots, which would be a new thing for the Wizards. Please give me some hope for the upcoming season Mr. Grunfeld.

Posted by: RP5150 | June 23, 2009 11:40 PM

Garbage in, garbage out. If Foye was the real deal, he should have been able to get the Wolves into the 8 spot over the Jazz. Ernie is just making moves to make it look like he's doing something. I wouldn't wipe myself with the 5 from this year's draft.

Posted by: mstov | June 23, 2009 11:42 PM

This funny, a scouting report on Randy Foye:
With no knowledge that he may go the Wizards it states this about Randy Foye:

Best Case Scenario: Mike James
Worst Case Scenario: Juan Dixon

Haa ! Haaaaaaa!

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Randy-Foye-454/

Posted by: dspinx | June 23, 2009 11:43 PM

Do I have to say I TOLD YOU SO.....
ABE IS CHEAP
ABE IS CHEAP
ABE IS CHEAP
Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 23, 2009 11:18 PM

He still has more money than u!
Dat be game set & match swine.

Posted by: Rocc00 | June 23, 2009 11:47 PM

all of you people in favor of this trade must be on some jimjonesjuice!you are trading mediocrity for mediocrity.what needs to be traded is the whole wiz front office,especially ernie,who year in and year out keep coming up with the same ole,tired a--ed moves that take this team nowhere.IF!the wiz make the playoffs by default this upcoming season,then its one and done again!who will they beat? miami,cleveland,boston,orlando,or atlanta?wake up!

Posted by: billydee123 | June 23, 2009 11:50 PM

I got the trade for a big ,a two and a three . Mbenga, Morrison And Sun Yue.

Posted by: chasemo2 | June 23, 2009 11:51 PM

Closing in on 200 posts and, unless I dozed, nobody's even questioned whether THE NEW COACH may have had some say in what's taking place here.

Posted by: dabing | June 23, 2009 11:53 PM

588 votes?

Posted by: dabing | June 23, 2009 11:54 PM

My only hope is the wizards must be banking on 2010 because that is the only reason I would say this trade is good. Miller is on the downside of his career. If they just let go of Stevenson, we will be a much better team

Posted by: stephenwilson2003@yahoo.com | June 23, 2009 11:56 PM

What many of you people do not understand, simply can't comprehend, is that Ernie would have traded the 5th pick and Etan in exchange for a box of pop corn. The fact that we got 2 legitimate players in return is icing on the cake.

Etan was a cancer to this team and a cancer to this community. Ernie has tried to dump him on another team for 3 straight years and finally had the commodity (5th pick) to make that happen.

Wake up people. This trade was ALL about getting rid of Etan.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 24, 2009 12:01 AM

,i>'"Etan was a cancer to this team and a cancer to this community."

Seriously, give the racist claptrap a f*5king rest already. Yes, you're put out by Black athletes who speak out against perceived racial injustice in society. We get it. Shut up about it already.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 24, 2009 12:03 AM

>'"Etan was a cancer to this team and a cancer to this community."

Seriously, give the racist claptrap a f*5king rest already. Yes, you're put out by Black athletes who speak out against perceived racial injustice in society. We get it. Shut up about it already.
---
Agreed. Just because Etan is "yassah bossin", grining and smiling like Lebron and Dwight Howard doesn't make him a cancer. He's just not the long term solution to this franchise.

Posted by: mstov | June 24, 2009 12:08 AM

Have those of you who like this deal and consider Foye good ever watched a T'wolves game? He can't play point and looks to shoot before passing only he's not a good shooter either. He's like some said just another Nick Young. If we aren't getting one of Minny's picks then this is just about being cheap and saving money. Winners aren't cheap! I've watched Foye on numerous occasions and he isn't all of sudden our second best guard. Not even close to it. I'm all for trading the pick and I like Mike Miller shooting 3's for us but get a pick back in return, hell.

Posted by: Jaymac00 | June 24, 2009 12:09 AM

Rocc00

I have peace of mind that I don't have rip off my clients in order to make a living

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 24, 2009 12:10 AM

Just a little background on Etan Thomas that many some fans still don't know about:

-He has repeatedly referred to various black men as "Uncle Tom" if they do not fall in line with a liberal ideology.

-He has viciously attacked our troops

-He has disgracefully attacked our brave officers as "pigs"

-He has repeatedly accused other people of racism even when they have not displayed any racial animus whatsoever.

-Comically, he has compared himself to Muhammad Ali

-He has told groups of young, impressionable children that Republicans don't like them

-He has railed against blacks who "act white"

Any fan with any common sense should rejoice in his departure from not only our team, but from our city. He is a despicable human being. A disgrace to the NBA and to the Wizards. And tomorrow when the trade becomes official, I will whip out the champagne.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 24, 2009 12:17 AM

Seriously, give the racist claptrap a f*5king rest already. Yes, you're put out by Black athletes who speak out against perceived racial injustice in society. We get it. Shut up about it already.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 24, 2009 12:03 AM

Excuse me Kalo_rama, your accusation is extremely offensive. I have no issue whatsoever with "Black (sic) athletes who speak out against perceived racial injustice in society." To accuse me of this is beyond the pale.

I have absolutely no problem with any person--black, white, Hispanic, Asian--speaking out about racial injustice. There is plenty of injustice in this world and we need people to speak out about it. But unfortunately, this is not what Etan speaks out about most of the time. I listed above some of the things Etan "speaks out" and as you can see it's not about racial injustice. It's about his hate.

Get a clue, pal.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 24, 2009 12:23 AM

I'm going to bed. Feel free to make baseless accusations about me and I'll refute them in the morning.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 24, 2009 12:26 AM

"Excuse me Kalo_rama, your accusation is extremely offensive."

Really? Tough sh%t. The truth hurts. But then, what would you know about that given your propensity for twisting the truth to further your quite obvious agenda. No more so than your tired (and blatantly and uncategorically false) bullsh%t about Thomas. He said something that, quite frankly, the people

"Get a clue, pal."

I'm not your pal. And I have more than a clue what you're about, jackass.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 24, 2009 12:28 AM

This has to be the dumbest move in Wizards history besides taking Kwame Brown in the draft. Why on earth would you trade your #5 pick for 2 washed up NBA players? Mike Miller hasn't done anything since playing with the Magic. I can't even remember when Foye did anything spectacular. The organization should have waited until the draft and obtained a solid rookie (Curry) then made a trade to another team. I have lost total faith in any Washington sports organization. What next? Wizards spelled wrong on the jerseys?

Posted by: youngciscero | June 24, 2009 12:31 AM

"Just a little background on Etan Thomas that many some fans still don't know about: "

Just a little background on Barno that everyone here already knows about:

Whenever he hurls these charges, multiple people always challenge him to prove direct quotes from Etan along with sources and links to back them up. We're still waiting for him to provide the first one. Holding of one's breath is not advised.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 24, 2009 12:32 AM

This is a good deal all around for the Wizards. Foye is better than any other guard on the team not named Gilbert Arenas and should start at shooting guard. Miller does a little of everything well — not spectacularly, but well — and can back up either Caron at SF or Foye at SG. What do people expect for three sub-par big men and the No. 5 pick? Certainly not another all-star for a team with three all-stars. Foye and Miller will be better than decent role players and should help the Wizards immensely. I have to say that between this trade and hiring Saunders as coach, I may have to catch a few Wizards game next season.

Posted by: sp_weigand | June 24, 2009 12:35 AM

WHO ARE THE IDOTS THAT VOTED THIS WAS A GOOD TRADE?
YOU KNOW NOTHING! I'M GOING TO SAY IT AGAIN YOUR A FAN YOU KNOW NOTHING.
Now the reason LAKERS won because the SPEND!
THEY HAVE ALWAYS PAID TO HAVE AN ADVATAGE!
That said this team has been the opposite and when they paid someone they made it a big deal.
Lakers players all get paid well.
The reason i bring this up is because to win in the east that's what it will take.
Cleveland and Boston know this.
Stupid Fans!
Know wonder they sell tickets to the Wiz games Stupid Fans i guess are pressed to see anything professional.

Posted by: shamken | June 24, 2009 12:46 AM

"And tomorrow when the trade becomes official, I will whip out the champagne. "

I'm betting that's not all you'll whip out.

And, of course, it goes without saying, that even if Thomas said exactly all of the things you claim (highly doubtful at best) none of that, either singularly or in aggregate makes, him "a cancer" "a despicable human being" or a "disgrace." It simply makes him someone with an opinion and a worldview that differs from you own narrow myopic one. Of course, I've met (and heard from) enough people of your ilk to fully understand that you'll never even come close to comprehending the difference (nor will you ever try).

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 24, 2009 12:50 AM

For some unknown reason we continue to overpay for the unremarkable! I could understand trading the players for players but come on, expiring contracts or not how could you trade your # 5 pick to a team with two first round picks & go into the draft with no 1st round picks now. Rookies are a gamble true, but so is Randy Foye & Mike Miller, especially considering any player picked would probably have been just as productive as either player acquired seeing that they did come from the Timberwolves. Im sorry but I still remember when we had Devin Harris & sent him packing & truthfully believe we wouldnt have even been picking 5th if he was on the roster last year. As a local sports fan I was getting excited of the possibilty of say maybe Curry & Arenas being the highest scoring backcourt in the East, or Haywood & Hansborough downlow dominating like 2 Tarheel big men never did in the pros. So hopefully tomorrow when I awake & look in the paper the Sports headline will read Abe Pollin aint going for this or maybe its going 2 take Obama 2 veto this one bcuz its just not the missing piece to take us from a 19 win season to Eastern Conference Champs & truthfully if Caron Butler doesnt retire a Wizard then Im a start an official petition to kick the team outta downtown & back to the Capital Center!! Gil maybe the $100 million dollar man, but TuffJuice is what runs through the viens of this city sports fans & its no coincedence that we have a player who our real coach named just that, Flip is cool, but bring back Eddie, draft or trade in a way that makes some progress & breed a winner because frankly Im tired of scratching my head wondering what these so called geniuses are doing & not seeing results. Abe Pollin has only got but so much left in the tank & we deserve a parade dpast the street he made what it is!

Posted by: dapoet123 | June 24, 2009 1:19 AM

& for the record if 1 more person bad mouths Etan Thomas a man of substance, class, who is not only humble, but also a great example for all people but especially our young misguided black youth of what you do when you are not happy with what you see around you. He went out in this community, reminder he's not even from here, & was a constant helping hand even after having open heart surgery. In a time when everyone wants attention for all the wrong reasons, this man deserves to be applauded not berated because you felt he did not perform up to your expectations in a basketball game, news flash in this game of life where a helping hand can be priceless he went into the communtiy with open arms & to the halls were they make laws & spoke for those voices who our so called representatives so often over look. So say another thing bout Etan & you probably wont hurt his feelings, but I tell u what... I sure wont like it because unless you are willing to do the same or better your opinion aint... & neither are you but a jealous hater aka envious spectator & probably a closet cowboy fan to!!

Posted by: dapoet123 | June 24, 2009 1:45 AM

Just a little background on Barno that everyone here already knows about:

Whenever he hurls these charges, multiple people always challenge him to prove direct quotes from Etan along with sources and links to back them up.

Posted by: kalo_rama | June 24, 2009 12:32 AM

Kalo_rama has taken to repeatedly lying about me on this thread. Not once have I been asked to provide sources and links about Etan Thomas. Not once.

I am of course happy to provide links.

Posted by: Barno1 | June 24, 2009 1:51 AM

Etan Thomas refers to cops as "pigs":

http://www.alternet.org/story/26076/etan_thomas%27s_field_trip_for_conservatives/

Etan Thomas insinuates that others are racist, even when they haven't displayed any racial animus:

http://www.slamonline.com/online/2007/07/an-open-letter-to-andrew-bogut/

Etan Thomas bashes our troops:

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0924-12.htm

Posted by: Barno1 | June 24, 2009 1:54 AM

Etan Thomas attacks successful blacks who he don't agree with him politically as "uncle toms," "sell outs," who "put down their people so they can move up the ladder":

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/etan-thomas/an-open-letter-to-jason-w_b_48247.html

Etan Thomas telling black kids that Republicans don't like them:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x1452210

Posted by: Barno1 | June 24, 2009 1:55 AM

Etan Thomas on black Republicans:

"Then you recruit black faces to join you in your
absurd notions
Benedict Arnolds with necks tired from pecking at the
souls of their own people
From that sell out Negro named J. C. Watts
Swimming in conservative pots
Brought to a bubbling boil for his black skin
He doesn't even know that he's standing in
Tap dancing in
Prancing around with a sword of white teeth
cutting the chords attached to our advancement"

Posted by: Barno1 | June 24, 2009 1:56 AM

The one positive I see in this is that a lot of salary will be erased from the books next year, which might help put them in a position to go after Amar'e (if they don't trade for him this offseason), Bosh, or - dare I say - LeBron? Shoot, I can dream, can't I?

Posted by: nittanybruin | June 24, 2009 7:08 AM

Terrible trade. Three of our bigs for two of their guards, and no first rd. pick left. The Wolves got a real good deal. I didn't think we needed any more shooting guards, unless there is a plan to trade either Nick or Deshawn or both. On their best days neither Foye or Miller have the production to justify this trade.

Posted by: rickgonz | June 24, 2009 7:30 AM

This trade equates to the team running on a treadmilll....

Posted by: NahLaterz1 | June 24, 2009 8:30 AM

Let's be clear, guard play is not the concern . The Wizards needs a big man that can put up numbers. It appears that the wizards are more interested in competing with the knicks as the Suns of the east.

Posted by: myth000 | June 24, 2009 9:24 AM

I have peace of mind that I don't have rip off my clients in order to make a living
Posted by: bulletsfan78 | June 24, 2009 12:10 AM

U also didn't put up $250M to revitalize a city either teeny weeny.

Posted by: Rocc00 | June 24, 2009 10:06 AM

Etan Thomas bashes our troops:

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0924-12.htm


"I am totally against this war," Thomas says adamantly. "But at the same time, I am completely for the troops. Republicans tried to paint the picture that if you were against the war, you were somehow unpatriotic, and that couldn't be further from the truth. What's truly unpatriotic is misleading an entire nation into war under false pretenses."

read much?

Posted by: buster_c | June 24, 2009 11:15 AM

Did I hear Chris Wilcox's name being mentioned? Ernie please call Donnie Walsh and make a deal. Deshawn and my main man JCritt and if you want to, Nick Young.

Wilcox, McGee, Blatche,and Haywood would be a nice group of bigs for this team

It's nice to dream!

Posted by: Doobie_Sparks | June 24, 2009 4:49 PM

This trade is good and bad. Good because some contracts are coming off the books. And bad because I dont see any value coming back to the team. The team still needs depth in the front court! I hope Ol Ernie has more plans to improve the team in the paint!

Posted by: delgc23 | June 24, 2009 4:56 PM

Still no defense on the team and they are very weak inside. But at least they got rid of some dead wood and trash like Thomas.

Posted by: dcsportsdude | June 24, 2009 5:52 PM

I like this trade for the Wizards. Foye can play either guard spot and makes a good 6th man and/or insurance at PG in case (when) Gilbert only plays 2 games again. And Miller will be better getting out of this mess in Minnesota. As a Wiz fan in Minny thanks T'Wolves!

Posted by: Blue1971 | June 24, 2009 9:02 PM

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