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Wizards 101, Pistons 98

GRAND RAPIDS, Mich. -- Yes, Gilbert Arenas talked -- if that's what you want to call it -- but there actually was game on Tuesday night and Arenas played quite well (with the exception of a preseason-high six turnovers). He scored 24 points with five assists, but more on him later. The most important development of the night was that the Wizards' reserves -- with the help of Mike Miller -- were able to close out a game after coming up lame in Toronto on Tuesday.

JaVale McGee, a native of Flint, was especially impressive as he scored in double figures for the third consecutive game this preseason, pitching in with 12 points on 6 of 10 shooting. Five of his buckets were dunks -- those "Oh No He Didn't" dunks that made his teammates get out of their seats and fans shake their heads in amazement. It's nothing new to report that McGee is an incredible athlete, but he still manages to do something almost every game to make you saw, "Wow."

He had several highlight reel jams against the Pistons, including a rebound put-back dunk, a baseline, up-and-under dunk and a reverse alley-oop dunk, after catching a pass Miller threw from the three-point line. The last dunk gave the Wizards a 92-91 lead and they never looked back. I asked Miller after the game what it felt like playing with an athlete like McGee and Miller started laughing.

"God is good," Miller said. "It's exciting to see that. He's one of the best athletes in this league. I've always said, as long as he continues to run the floor, is boxing out, rebounding, and finishing like that, he's going to have a great future in this league."

Flip Saunders said after the game that he is trying to help McGee "fight through that wall" by playing him extended minutes, to see if he can produce even while fatigued. Saunders was pleased to see McGee finish strong in the fourth period, when he scored eight points -- all on dunks. "He's been good," Saunders said of McGee, who is averaging 11.8 points and shooting 73 percent from the floor. "He's been very productive with what he's done. I tell our guys, 'If he's even, he's ahead.' No one is going to jump with him. Just throw that thing up there and let him go get it."

McGee can always be spotted putting his index finger up whenever he runs down the floor. The kid is ever ready for the lob. "To me, that's the easiest way you get the ball in the rim. 'Cause ain't nobody going to jump with me," McGee said. "Even if they do, I can catch the ball over them. So that's the easy play. It's harder for me to go to the post and pass it to me. I got to look around and make the play."

Miller helped put away the Pistons with a three-pointer -- his first with the Wizards --- and a critical steal in the final two minutes. The effort was even more solid considering Miller had to go back in the locker room in the third period after getting a bloody nose during a collision with the Pistons' Rodney Stuckey. "I think it was an elbow or a shoulder," Miller said, explaining what knocked him out. "Either way, it didn't feel real good. But it's alright. It ain't broke. I thought it was, it was leaking so bad."

After the game, Miller was joking with Jamison that he could still shoot the three. (Miller had missed his first nine attempts this preseason). When I mentioned that Miller had nine rebounds, Jamison said, "He's rebounding better than me."

Not quite. Jamison still finished with a game-high 11 rebounds, but Miller certainly seemed to mesh well with Jamison, Caron Butler, Arenas and Fabricio Oberto in his first start at shooting guard. That unit was really productive in the third period, when the Wizards outscored the Pistons 29-23 and built a 13-point lead with 4 minutes, 53 seconds remaining. "We got it rolling a little bit and we played well, which was good," Miller said. "It was a good run for a unit that hasn't played much together."

Arenas was really rolling in the third period, as he scored 13 points. He now has scored 37 points with 10 assists the past three third quarters. Before the game, Saunders was talking about Arenas and said, "He's kind of toying with people right now in the preseason. He decides when he wants to show a little bit of flash, and he goes and dominates for about three minutes."

It's becoming apparent that Arenas can get going at his leisure, but he still trying to figure out how to do his thing and spread the wealth. "We tend to forget, this guy has played ball in a long time," Jamison said. "He's still trying to find his rhythm as well, but you've seen, he can get it going. I think now he's starting to understand, he makes us better when he's aggressive early."

"Gilbert is playing is playing at a very efficient level as far as the things he's doing. A guy goes out and gets 24 points on 11 shots, that's very efficient," Saunders said.

Saunders said he wasn't worried about Arenas's turnovers. He has 18 miscues through the first four games, to go along with 31 assists. Arenas had a couple of bad passes, got ripped clean by his friend Will Bynum (23 points) and even got called for traveling. "Three of them were from playing with the ball, like, 'Can I just go by that guy?' " Saunders said. "He's trying to get guys into spots. I'd rather have my point guard, he has the ball in his hands, get the turnovers than the other guys."

Saunders wasn't sure if he was going to play Arenas against Cleveland on Wednesday. "We have to wait and see. Is he ready for a back-to-back yet? I don't know. We'll see how his leg feels tomorrow morning."

By Michael Lee  |  October 14, 2009; 12:18 AM ET
 
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Comments

My swag was phenomenal!

Posted by: kaamil2007 | October 14, 2009 1:57 AM | Report abuse

2nd... man I almost got it!

Posted by: EWE1 | October 14, 2009 3:03 AM | Report abuse

ML, nice article.

I've become a Saunders fan. He comes across like he's got it all moving in the right direction. A man enjoying a his work and doing it well.

Posted by: EWE1 | October 14, 2009 3:06 AM | Report abuse

JaVale McGee is going to be special. I love the Wiz this year. Even if we are not going to win it all,we will be an exciting team and a team that is dangerous come playoff time.

Posted by: arenasmvp | October 14, 2009 5:47 AM | Report abuse

Keep letting McGee and Blatche play. They will only get better. Miller will be a big asset because he will pass the ball which makes he teammates continue to move. I bet Haywoods ankle will heal now.

Posted by: rnbrown4 | October 14, 2009 6:46 AM | Report abuse

Keep working it McGee! My hope is that you play haywood out of the starting role and that he takes his sofy playing game elsewhere so we can spend that money on a tough, Oakley-esque player to back yu up next year.

Posted by: Blurred | October 14, 2009 6:56 AM | Report abuse

I've been killing McGee since the end of last season, so if he becomes a contributor this season, I'll be sure to admit I was wrong. However, I can't agree with Blurred. If we learned anything last year, we learned that Haywood is a vital component to this team. Sure, he's got his liabilities, but those do not outweigh the benefits he brings.

When this team is all put together, we could have something fun to watch.

Posted by: ZardsFan1 | October 14, 2009 7:45 AM | Report abuse

OK...back on my meds now. No more Haywood bashing from me. For a while anyhow.

Glad to see the team is starting to gel and Miller is playing up.

Looks like Blatche had a rough game of it, though.

Kwame had decent stats: 9; 11 and a block.

When do get the next televised game?

Posted by: Blurred | October 14, 2009 7:46 AM | Report abuse

Zardsfan:

I can see your point. I learned a different lesson from last season, though.

When you have crappy coaching and lose four of your starters for over a quarter of the season and 60% of your starters for virtually the entire season, you are gonna stink it up in the NBA.

Maybe the lesson I learned is a bit more simplistic. I could be wrong.

How about this: If Mcgee becomes a real contributor this season, you admit you're wrong and if Haywood matches his stats from 2 years ago, I'll admit I was wrong and post a long apology. Heck, I'll even write a handwritten one to Haywood himself.

Posted by: Blurred | October 14, 2009 7:52 AM | Report abuse

Go Wizards! I think we're gonna be really good this year!!

Blurred- Today is the next televised game, vs the Cavs! Will be very interesting to see how we stack up, altough it is preseason but it's still LeBron and Shaq!

Posted by: rachel216 | October 14, 2009 7:54 AM | Report abuse

Five of his buckets were dunks. Those "Oh No He Didn't" dunks that made his teammates get out of their seats and fans shake their heads in amazement. It's nothing new to report that McGee is an incredible athlete, but he still manages to do something each game to make you say, "Wow."

Be careful Michael Lee.

The last time I heard somebody being described that way, like bringing something special each night, it was Michael Jordan.

Now we all know that JM is not an MJ, but it sounds like this guy might be truly special.

I said last year when we got him that he would be the best of his Class. Based on your report, he's headed in that direction.

By some accounts though, he might have already caught his more esteemed draft class.

Has any of them been invited to Team USA tryouts.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | October 14, 2009 7:56 AM | Report abuse

I love McGee's talent and upside, but I've still got to think it's going to be awhile before he's going to be a legitimate defensive center.

I'd really like to see him get some run from time to time Haywood at center. McGee's shotblocking talent seems to be at coming from the weakside off the ball. With Haywood's lane eating ability, and McGee's ability to step in from off the ball and block a shot and then run the floor could be an interesting wrinkle to throw at team's.

This roster's going to give Suander's a lot of those different and interesting looks to throw at teams.
GM

Posted by: flohrtv | October 14, 2009 8:21 AM | Report abuse

I love McGee but someone's gotta work with him on low post moves. He doesn't have to be a specialist but at least he's gotta be able to threaten defenders with it. If they know all he does (or wants to do) is dunk, they'll quickly figure out how to defend him. He needs to be able to keep them honest with the threat of posting somebody up.

But still it's nice to hear a teammate say "God is good" in response to McGee's play.

Posted by: tundey | October 14, 2009 8:22 AM | Report abuse

50-32 for the Wiz.

Rookie of the Year will be Griffin but should be Brandon Jennings. He's gonna wind up being the steal of the draft.
D. Blair will be in the running but wont get the minutes.

Posted by: original_mark | October 14, 2009 8:22 AM | Report abuse

Hey flohrtv:

I really like your idea of having them on the floor at the same time. I'd love to give that chance.

Posted by: Blurred | October 14, 2009 8:49 AM | Report abuse

I learned a different lesson from last season, though.

How about this: If Mcgee becomes a real contributor this season, you admit you're wrong and if Haywood matches his stats from 2 years ago, I'll admit I was wrong and post a long apology. Heck, I'll even write a handwritten one to Haywood himself.

Posted by: Blurred | October 14, 2009 7:52 AM

you learned a different lesson because you see what you want to see. perpetually reaching for a chance to trash haywood.

hopefully zardsfan turns down your offer. it's ridiculous because haywood producing and mcgee becoming a "real contributor" aren't mutually exclusive.

mcgee can't replace haywood until he becomes a true defensive presence (beyond just blocks).

Posted by: crs-one | October 14, 2009 8:50 AM | Report abuse

By the way...I think Rookie of the Year will be the Cash.

Posted by: Blurred | October 14, 2009 8:50 AM | Report abuse

CRS
No one said they were mutually exclusive.

Of course we could both have been wrong and both admit it.

Or maybe are both right and no one needs to admit anything.

I'm just saying, I never liked Haywoods play or attitude in the past and was hopeful going into the preseason, but watching him play one game made me think he was the same as before.

I'd love to be wrong, because it would make the Wizards so much better. Just don't think it will happen.

I am happy to admit I was wrong - if he proves it. So whether zardsfan wants to take up my challenge, I will admit that I was wrong about haywood if he proves that I was wrong.

So, if he can match his stats from 2 seasons ago, I will use that as the level to admit I was wrong.

Posted by: Blurred | October 14, 2009 8:57 AM | Report abuse

We ought to avoid playing Blatche at center and give him a consistent 25 minutes a game at forward. Also the staff ought to check if he has a Beasley problem.

Last night was the first time this year somebody made a statement about the starting 2 guard. That's good because Foye, Young and Stevenson

Posted by: Izman | October 14, 2009 9:11 AM | Report abuse

haven't clicked so far.

Posted by: Izman | October 14, 2009 9:12 AM | Report abuse

Sounds like Javale's big problem is lack of wind, pretty common in big men early on in their careers. Look how yao struggled to get himself to where he wasnt constantly gassed.

Along with the 5 dunks last night, Mcgee also hit a 19ft J. That's to go with numerous turnaround jumpers he hit against the Pistons. They were sweet shots that cant be defended...but you'd rather not see him take 15ft from the rim.

But apparently the kid can shoot. Already better than Haywood.

Call me crazy, but he may be much closer to supplanting Brendon than we realize. The way he runs the floor is amazing! Flip has got to be thrilled with him, but will keep it level headed and focus on where he neeeds to improve.

We may have a keeper at 5 here, and if we are lucky, by the end of the season it will be clear he's something special.

Posted by: divi3 | October 14, 2009 9:29 AM | Report abuse

Last night was the first time this year somebody made a statement about the starting 2 guard. That's good because Foye, Young and Stevenson haven't clicked so far.

Posted by: Izman | October 14, 2009 9:12 AM

I noticed that too Izman. Even though, Young we know will score the ball, Miller at the two presents a whole set of dynamics for other Teams that is hard to deal with.

Miller's game is much more complete than their's and he is a better facilitator than Foye.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | October 14, 2009 9:31 AM | Report abuse

I love McGee's talent and upside, but I've still got to think it's going to be awhile before he's going to be a legitimate defensive center.

Posted by: flohrtv | October 14, 2009 8:21 AM

and

We may have a keeper at 5 here, and if we are lucky, by the end of the season it will be clear he's something special.

Posted by: divi3 | October 14, 2009 9:29 AM

Agree on both counts. Haywood has proven (by his improved play two years ago, and even more strongly by his absence last year) how critical he is, even as a guy who will never dominate a game in any observable way.

So hoping Javale will supplant Haywood is realistic---maybe next year or beyond.

But when divi said that we have a keeper here, our center position looks pretty good when you consider that realistically, JM is our THIRD string center. We have a technically sound, big-bodied backup in Oberto, and a NON-techincally sound, still learning freak of an athlete behind him---a guy who could be (and I don't say this about young guys often) a star before he's done. His game (mental and physical) just needs to catch up with his athleticism.

But what a great, great pick by EG last year.

Posted by: psdfx | October 14, 2009 9:42 AM | Report abuse

Miller may end up being the best guy to start at the 2. But without him, the second unit could become a mishmash. Young could start just because of a need to balance the units.

Flip's got a deep team, but he needs to form a coherant substitution pattern. And that's something we've never seen here in the past.

This is maybe the deepest team Flip's ever worked with, he's had possibly more starting talent before, but I don't beleive he's ever had this much talent 1-10. It's going to be interesting to see how he utilizes it because there's not a lot of difference between 4-10.

Don't forget about Critt, missing preseason is going to hurt him, but I still think he becomes a factor at backup point down the stretch, particularly if Foye winds up playing a lot of two.

Been reading that Larry would like to move Foster in Indiania. James and Foster's salaries fit, & Foster's got one extra year on his. Since the Pacers are bleeding dough it would sure look like a fit to me. Wonder if Ernie would consider a Foster for James swap and be willing to take on that extra year of salary?

Larry would probably like to come up with some other considerations in a deal. Vereemnko's rights? Future pick? It's a move that would toughen up our front court and not cost a bit in backcourt depth.
GM

Posted by: flohrtv | October 14, 2009 9:56 AM | Report abuse

By the way...I think Rookie of the Year will be the Cash.

Posted by: Blurred | October 14, 2009 8:50 AM

Agreed!

Posted by: cballer | October 14, 2009 9:58 AM | Report abuse

Best case scenario- Javale pushes Brendon hard for minutes by midseason, and being that it's his contract year, Haywood responds with aggressive play every night.

Mcgee is clearly improved over last year, there's no doubt he worked on his shot and it shows. That he isnt satisfied to simply be the dunking freak is a great sign.

And I fully expect to see dozens of alley-oops this year! Finally, we have the player who will eat the rim up if opposition isnt all the way back on D. 'bout time!!

Posted by: divi3 | October 14, 2009 9:59 AM | Report abuse

Pulling the trigger on a Foster trade pretty much means Blatche is on Chipolte duty full time no?

Posted by: divi3 | October 14, 2009 10:01 AM | Report abuse

"Pulling the trigger on a Foster trade pretty much means Blatche is on Chipolte duty full time no?"
-divi3

If a PF deal is in the cards for the Zards it might combine Blatche with one of our redundant guards, thereby presenting a more tempting package for a legit big man.

Barring the exigencies of injury to Jamison or Blatche, a PF deal that is necessary for the Wiz, sometime during the season but before the trade deadline, means Blatche will have proven that he still hasn't stepped up and contributed some consistent quality game at PF.

By moving to acquire a PF, Blatche becomes redundant but his unfulfilled upside may still tempt some GM somewhere into giving up something of significant value.

Posted by: midlevex | October 14, 2009 10:21 AM | Report abuse

Wonder if Gil's injured finger contributed to his TOs. If it is, this can be a season long thing.

Another thought about Gil's fine. A couple of fines like that Wiz can pay 1 yr salary for Dejuan Blair!

Posted by: sagaliba | October 14, 2009 10:25 AM | Report abuse

Javale is not going to push Haywood for minutes b/c Javale can't guard the post and can't play the post. Haywood and Oberto are the only true post players and defenders on this team and that is why they are going to get most of the playing time at 5. Does anyone remember how well Haywood guards Kevin Garnett? Now, envision Javale guarding Kevin Garnett or Dwight Howard or Shaq. It's not pretty. The most we can expect is that Javale will provide energy when he gets in the game and some modicum of competency on Defense.

Posted by: ZardsFan1 | October 14, 2009 10:35 AM | Report abuse

Right now, I would not worry about McGee's post move that much. If he can play good positional defense, stay home and rebound, and occasionally give us those dunks and block shots that he already possess, I'll be happy – for this season at least.

Posted by: sagaliba | October 14, 2009 10:39 AM | Report abuse

I still like Haywood as the starter--he's a better defender, and while his offensive skills are very limited, he can still get you 10 points most nights on a few touches. It's better to bring McGee off the bench and use him to exploit mismatches, or hammer the other team's starting center when he's a little winded. In small doses, he totally dominates.

Posted by: pjkiger1 | October 14, 2009 10:47 AM | Report abuse

3 things...

1 - Zardsfan: I think you are wrong about Javale. He is learning and learning quickly.

2 - I think the starting 2 will be a rotating one depending on who is producing and who has the best matchup. That said, I think DeShawn gets abotu 60 - 70% of the starts because he meshes well with the other starters and needs to be the 4th option to be effected and adds some defense.

3 - Did anyone notice that Mike James had 2 pretty decent games in a row, at least based on the box score? Handled the ball well, dished a couple and was an efficient scorer. Not allstar caliber, but not too bad for the 5th option!

Posted by: Blurred | October 14, 2009 10:51 AM | Report abuse

McGee is a special talent...on offense. He can't hold Haywood's jock on D. We would get absolutely eaten alive in the paint if McGee was our starting center. I hope he pushes Haywood for minutes like everyone else, but he is going to have make serious strides with his defensive recognition and effort. He's a deer in headlights right now.

Posted by: OffseasonChamps | October 14, 2009 11:00 AM | Report abuse

I'd like to see JeVale get some PT at Power Forward alongside Haywood. His game is more like Amare Staudemire's than Dwight Howard's.

Posted by: stevek_ffx | October 14, 2009 11:03 AM | Report abuse

'b/c Javale can't guard the post and can't play the post. Haywood and Oberto are the only true post players and defenders on this team'

Oberto is horrible, Mcgee is light years better already.

I agree that TODAY javale has issues guarding the post, but it's clear his footwork is better and he is learning fast. Don't be surprised if his only liability defensively by season's end is lack of bulk.

Posted by: divi3 | October 14, 2009 11:08 AM | Report abuse

Bottom line is that oberto knows how to play. He knows his limitations and strengths. He may not dazzle, but I think he will be a valuable contributor this season.

I agree that playing McGee at the 4 is a good idea.

Posted by: ZardsFan1 | October 14, 2009 11:49 AM | Report abuse

"Bottom line is that oberto knows how to play."

Does he though? Has he ever logged serious minutes? Put up any kind of decent stats? Ever held his own in the 5spot without Tim Duncan pretending to play the 4?

I'd love to see Twin Towers with Haywood and Mcgee, could be very effective at times.

Posted by: divi3 | October 14, 2009 12:08 PM | Report abuse

I also agree with Haywood and McGee on the floor at the same time.

We probably will see it also, because Flip unlike Eddie has Big Ball in his coaching repertoire. Goody Goody!

Also, the ones that keep saying you don't want to see McGee shooting from 15', think again.

If McGee has the knack and really can shoot from 15', it only is going to make him a complete player. Big guys that understand that there money is made down low, but can also shoot are just terrible to defend. (i.e. Bill Lambier - tellum Kal)

Haywood at one time attempted the outside shot with a little success, but I don't think he has the confidence to be good at it.

JaVale, on the other hand, is too early to rule out anything concerning his game. This fellow just might be a Natural' if you know I mean.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | October 14, 2009 12:23 PM | Report abuse

"Javale is not going to push Haywood for minutes b/c Javale can't guard the post and can't play the post. Haywood and Oberto are the only true post players and defenders on this team and that is why they are going to get most of the playing time at 5."

Neither Haywood nor Oberto has any kind of post offensive game. Oberto has no offensive game at all and Haywood is only effective when he's being spoon fed the ball on lobs underneath the basket or getting kickouts on penetration in the lane. He can't generate any offense without a lot of help.

Posted by: kalo_rama | October 14, 2009 12:29 PM | Report abuse

"The last time I heard somebody being described that way, like bringing something special each night, it was Michael Jordan."

You must not have watched must bball in the last couple of decades then, because plenty of players have been described that way since Jordan entered the league.

Posted by: kalo_rama | October 14, 2009 12:31 PM | Report abuse

"50-32 for the Wiz.

Rookie of the Year will be Griffin but should be Brandon Jennings. He's gonna wind up being the steal of the draft.
D. Blair will be in the running but wont get the minutes. "

Please tell me you are joking about Jennings. Jennings is not that good. I have talked to several players who played against Jennings in AAU when he was coming up. Kid is a prima donna and cocky as hell. He barely saw the court in Europe because he was not good enough to get minutes. There was a reason he did not goto the draft, because his agent thought he was going to fall hard. He lucked out getting drafted where he did by the worst franchise in the NBA. Milw has drafted Jennings and Joe Alexander in their last two drafts.

Can I get a shot at running that franchise?

Posted by: dominic10464 | October 14, 2009 12:42 PM | Report abuse

Kal, the Wizards don't have to have a guy who can score twenty points with his back to the basket, but they do need a guy who can guard and occupy opposing centers. Regardless of Haywood's offensive shortcomings, opposing centers have to guard him b/c he plays near the basket. They can't be a roaming defender. That, I believe, is important to a successful offense.

Posted by: ZardsFan1 | October 14, 2009 12:54 PM | Report abuse

Haywood doesn't play near the basket on offense so much as he stands near the basket. There's a difference. Unless he catches the ball cleanly with no defender between him and the rim (which rarely happens) he's not much of a threat offensively. Teams will gladly give him his 8 garbage points a game if it allows them to dedicate a second help defender to slowing down Arenas's penetration. A big man who can hit a mid-range jumpshot, put the ball on the floor, and finish with force at the rim, however, requires real defensive attention because he's a threat from multiple places on the floor. McGee is clearly still raw and needs more experience, but he has the tools to be a significant player.

And I guarantee you that if you were to poll NBA GMs and coaches, everyone of them (with the possible exception of Don Nelson) would tell you that they do need a guy who can score twenty points with his back to the basket.

Posted by: kalo_rama | October 14, 2009 1:11 PM | Report abuse

I think DS will start the 1st 2 months and would be replaced by MM.I do not think sounders use more than 2 players at a time from the second unit in most regular games,so we do not need to be concerned about the second unit.sounders is focusing about the 8-9 man rotation.

Posted by: gtefferra | October 14, 2009 1:14 PM | Report abuse

"Jennings is not that good. I have talked to several players who played against Jennings in AAU when he was coming up. Kid is a prima donna and cocky as hell. He barely saw the court in Europe because he was not good enough to get minutes. There was a reason he did not goto the draft, because his agent thought he was going to fall hard. He lucked out getting drafted where he did by the worst franchise in the NBA."

Jennings is your classic jet-propelled six-footer, probably the fastest player in this draft. There's usually a place in the NBA for somebody who can just plain outrun the other players. I'd be surprised if he doesn't make it, possibly at a high level.

But you're right, he's very much a rough draft of a player. Put him one on one or in a scrimmage and he can dominate. But in a game against disciplined players, he looks lost.

Will he be the ROY? Very well could. Will he be an also-ran? Also very much a possibility.

Posted by: Samson151 | October 14, 2009 2:00 PM | Report abuse

I'd love to see mcgee get some time next to haywood and I think tyreke evans or derozan will be rookie of the year, as far as the starting two guard goes I'd love to see it be miller but I'd still rather save miller for the bench to solidify that unit, he would be a tremendous asset to the second string, I hope nick gets the nod at the starting 2 guard spot but would not be surprised if this isn't the case, either way I was getting excited about the year hearing dave johnson's animated call detailing gil's status as best player on the floor and mcgee's as an absolute freak who runs the floor better than any five I can remember

Posted by: bford1kb | October 14, 2009 3:01 PM | Report abuse


No one said they were mutually exclusive.

Posted by: Blurred | October 14, 2009 8:57 AM

that's what's implied when someone sets up a "if you're wrong do this, if i'm wrong i do this" kind of bet.

Posted by: crs-one | October 14, 2009 5:39 PM | Report abuse

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