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Cavaliers (8-3) at Wizards (2-7)

Wizards starters: Gilbert Arenas, Mike Miller, Caron Butler, Antawn Jamison, Brendan Haywood

Cavaliers: Mo Williams, Anthony Parker, LeBron James, J.J. Hickson, Zydrunas Ilgauskas

Line: Cavaliers by 4.

What does it say about the Wizards that this is only the second time this calendar year that Brendan Haywood, Caron Butler, Gilbert Arenas and Antawn Jamison played a regular season game together? That foursome defeated the Cavaliers 109-101 on April 2. The Wizards have won the past two meetings between these two teams at Verizon Center. With Jamison making his season debut, Coach Flip Saunders said the vibe around the team is different entering this game.

"I think the energy level's up," Saunders said. "There's no question, and it's a combination of when you play one of the best teams your energy level had better be up and against LeBron and those things. And then, too, I think any time you get back one of your team leaders and a guy that's not only been a very good basketball player but also very vocal for you, I think it kind of ignites you a little bit."

Saunders said the opponent also has something to do with the increased level of energy. "That's the way our league is. Any great team, great player, it brings out the enthusiasm in everybody. It's no different if it's LeBron, or Kobe comes to town with the Lakers, or Boston and those good teams, they bring that out. They bring out enthusiasm, they bring out passion. But what you have to do is sustain it because that wears off about 4 minutes into the game and then the question is what can you do from an execution standpoint."

Well, it actually is a little different with LeBron than Kobe. I don't know if Saunders is prepared for how the fans will respond to the could-be King. Shaquille O'Neal did not travel with the team because of what the team is calling a "shoulder strain."

You know it wouldn't be the Wizards if there wasn't some injury. Fabricio Oberto will miss his first game of the season because of his left hamstring. Saunders said that it was too tight for the team to risk playing him.

Cavaliers Coach Mike Brown said Antawn Jamison brings another dimension to the Wizards. "It's another all-star for those guys. He's just a different type of player for them because he really stretches the floor. He puts you out of whack defensively, because you're constantly paying attention to him. He can rebound, he can post up. he can iso. He can put the points on the board in bunches. Hes another dangerous weapon that causes problems, big problems."

By Michael Lee  |  November 18, 2009; 6:59 PM ET
 
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Next: Wizards 108, Cavaliers 91

Comments

so glad to see everyone is a go tonight. I hope that we now bench DS totally. I hope we leave Boykins as the PG on the bench and move Foye to the SG off the bench, and not play DS at all. That makes our lineup lethal all the way through

Posted by: dlts20 | November 18, 2009 7:12 PM | Report abuse

Blatche has to come in for Butler and not Haywood and Jamison goes to the 3.

Arenas has to be in full attack mode from the two and not the one.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 7:44 PM | Report abuse

And Kalo, DC88, BF78, what is up with not playing McGeee.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 7:47 PM | Report abuse

Blatche has to come in for Butler and not Haywood and Jamison goes to the 3.

Arenas has to be in full attack mode from the two and not the one.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 7:44 PM | Report abuse

_________________________________________
....And Larry in Clinton should be hired to replace Flip.

Posted by: Utilityman1 | November 18, 2009 7:49 PM | Report abuse

Like I have posted before Arenas needs to learn that drive and dish is just as lethal than taking the shot yourself.

But why did he waste time on the clock.

Miller should smack him.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 8:17 PM | Report abuse

i'm all for helping gil get his legs, but how many silly, forced passes do we have to endure before flip realizes that maybe putting the ball in his hands most of the time is why they're 2-7? start foye and bring gilbert off the bench. might encourage the man to improve his defense - no reason the quickest man on the court should get beat off of the dribble so often.

Posted by: thickman22 | November 18, 2009 8:27 PM | Report abuse

i don't care how many points jamison has, miller's the key to winning this game. put the ball in his hands. a lot!

Posted by: tgif11 | November 18, 2009 8:36 PM | Report abuse

Miller can BALL! He is SINGLEHANDEDLY winning this game.

WHAT has happened to Butler? Horrendous shot selection, turnover-happy, and just plain lost. Other than his tip-ins, he hasn't made layups drop, and neither has Gilbert for that matter.

Mercifully, Haywood is also playing great, and Jamison is scoring in the place of Caron and Gilbert.

Posted by: Crunkenstein | November 18, 2009 8:45 PM | Report abuse

there is no reason for stevenson to be in this game ahed of foye - unless he's hurt. now there's only three scorers on the court.

Posted by: tgif11 | November 18, 2009 8:50 PM | Report abuse

Watching the game at home. Agreed on Stevenson, I'd rather have any other guard in the game including Critter in a suit. Good to hear the fans at the game felt the same way--actually heard a little booing when he checked in.

Posted by: dfresh58 | November 18, 2009 8:52 PM | Report abuse

gil feels like he can take over the game tonight. i hope he's right because he's forcing the issue. drive and kick the ball to miller!!

Posted by: tgif11 | November 18, 2009 9:03 PM | Report abuse

They all need a dose of Dave Hoopla(shooting coach)but he's probably in Philly with EJ especially Agent Zero.

Posted by: dargregmag | November 18, 2009 9:05 PM | Report abuse

2 points from the Wiz bench...and very few minutes. Methinks the starters will be GASSED down the stretch.

Posted by: Crunkenstein | November 18, 2009 9:07 PM | Report abuse

if ilgauskas doesn't try to become a factor in the game, brendan should not step back on the court tonight. blatche is just more of a threat.

Posted by: tgif11 | November 18, 2009 9:18 PM | Report abuse

Methinks Lebron just hurt himself on that throwdown dunk.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 9:35 PM | Report abuse

hey bpybay, maybe we can get a team of 2ptt/2reb guys and intangible our way to a championship.? You know, guys who have learned how to play the game without scoring, rebounding, or blocking shots. What a wonderful team we would have, and all the knowledgeable fans out there would appreciate it.

but until then, i'll take 25/12 from Jamison thanks

Posted by: divi3 | November 18, 2009 2:36 PM

Aptly put divi3. However, in his infinite wisdom he really dosen't know what intangible is, when it comes to balling. For, if you are producing like Oberto currently is, the value of his intangibles is very low.

Oberto might know how to play the game, but right now since he isn't excelling at what he brings to the table his intangible is squat.

You would have thought that bpybay would have realized that before he started acusing folks of not playing the game or having any knowledge of it.

Bpybay, just because you can make an accusation dosen't mean you really know what you are talking about.

By the way, look up what intangible means when it come to banking and money. It means simply, if you don't have any assets you don't have any intangibles.

Translate that to basketball and it means, that you can be knowleageable about the game all you want, but if you are not currently transferring that knowledge to the floor (Oberto) as in production, then your intangibles is nil.

I used money as an example for you Bpybay so you can clearly see what Divi3 are I are talking about when we say bringing some intangibles to the court.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 5:02 PM

Divi3, I think we got some intangibles tonight and I know you agree. I don't know what that guy Bpybay was talking about.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 9:41 PM | Report abuse

Needed that

Big time

Posted by: Kev29 | November 18, 2009 9:42 PM | Report abuse

beautiful!

Posted by: tgif11 | November 18, 2009 9:43 PM | Report abuse

Thanks God! Now can we stop whining about who should play who shouldn't like you're a millionaire coach.

Man, that DS is terrible. I have no idea why he plays. Just has nothing to offer. He only held the leagues best 4th quarter scorer to 4 pts that mattered. He got in LeBron's head big time. And made foul shots to boot.

On another note, wow, Arenas pretty much shut down in the 4th by FS. We have enough weapons, but if it's not obvious as hell he is getting no elevation on his shot by now.... I've never seen him get his shot blocked so much. Wasn't just this game either.

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 18, 2009 9:50 PM | Report abuse

On another note, wow, Arenas pretty much shut down in the 4th by FS. We have enough weapons, but if it's not obvious as hell he is getting no elevation on his shot by now.... I've never seen him get his shot blocked so much. Wasn't just this game either.

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 18, 2009 9:50 PM

Gilbert from where he is coming from is just fine, just fine. For all that he is being asked to do he is Just fine, Just fine.

Ya' Heard' Me'.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 9:59 PM | Report abuse

After the Wiz lost to the Suns a few games back, Phoenix head coach Alvin Gentry was quoted as saying the Wiz were struggling because they were missing their best player. I thought he was just trying to be gracious in victory, but I have to admit they look totally different with Jamison in the lineup. Hopefully, it wasn't a mirage and we can expect more of the same.

Posted by: ArmChairQB | November 18, 2009 10:02 PM | Report abuse

He may be fine, but he is not the same player. Hubie Brown said it - it will probably take a year to get back to where he is going to be. Whatever that is. You see it all the time. Amare, Kidd, any number of NFL players - it's always the second season back from micro fracture surgery where they excel again. Unfortunately, we need some results sooner. Playing for the following season is getting old.

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 18, 2009 10:03 PM | Report abuse

rphilli721,

True about DS2. It probably helped too that Stevenson sat out the entire first half. He was well rested when he got into the game. LeBron got off his game without Stevenson needing to say anything.

That second unit too of Boykin, Miller, Butler, Blatche, and Stevenson worked well against this particular Cleveland line-up.

Jamison and Haywood's play was key in keeping the team close in the first half.

The reality check here is that the Wizards were playing a team missing some key players on the second night of a back-to-back on the road. Still, they recovered well from some early stumbles. And even without Shaq, Varajeo, or Powe the Cavs are still a really good team.

Much needed win.

Posted by: JPRS | November 18, 2009 10:05 PM | Report abuse

Arenas is or was our best player from a talent perspective. But, if you are talking about making everything gel with this team, it's AJ hands down.

Butler, still getting decent numbers (not a good %), but much like Arenas is not the same player. Shot is off, turnover machine still etc etc... I got Miller as a better player for us at the moment. What's Butler's excuse?

I love Jameson's interview where he said it was time to cut the excuses and bickering.

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 18, 2009 10:08 PM | Report abuse

@JPRS,

C'mon dude. You expect me to feel sorry for a team that is down a couple guys??? Seriously? lol

And, who cares that DS was rested. A) He still played GREAT defense on LJ. B) Just means it was a brilliant coaching move by FS.

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 18, 2009 10:11 PM | Report abuse

He may be fine, but he is not the same player. Hubie Brown said it - it will probably take a year to get back to where he is going to be. Whatever that is. You see it all the time. Amare, Kidd, any number of NFL players - it's always the second season back from micro fracture surgery where they excel again. Unfortunately, we need some results sooner. Playing for the following season is getting old.

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 18, 2009 10:03 PM

You are absolutely correct and thats why I am saying he is just fine. In fact he may be better at this point from most coming back from that type of injury.

Is also why I keep saying he should not be responsible for the point role on the Team. Let him do what he does best and that is attack from the two.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 10:12 PM | Report abuse

I hope this can get the ball rolling now. Jamison is the key and it obvious. The scary part is that Gilbert J was off tonight. What is going to happen when that is clicking. Teams are really going to have to pick their posion. Boykins is a really good change of pace. His quickness really throws teams off. I feel really sorry for Nick Young now. When will he possible play. I see a great piece being added to this team by the trade deadline. The Wizards will be O.K. people

Posted by: lemekdivine | November 18, 2009 10:15 PM | Report abuse

JPRS,

You can't be serious for calling a reality check for Cleveland being down two players.

How can you be so sure that they would have won with those two players. And we are still playing hurt if you really bothered to check. Please.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 10:19 PM | Report abuse

I usually bash Stevenson, but I have to give him his props tonight. The dude had a nice game and did what he had to do to mess with Lebron a little bit.

Bokins has made his case to get a fully guranteed contract. He is either going to take Foye's or Stevenson's minutes. I think he will be the first guard of the bench from this point on.

Lastly, loved the ESPN telecast with Hubie Brown and Van Gundey. You really get a lesson in the game of basketball when you have those guys to listen too. Nothing against "dagger" boy, but I can take listening to him but so long.

Posted by: BulletsFever | November 18, 2009 10:21 PM | Report abuse

lol..if you really want to keep score, our best player is still trying to find his way after 3 knee surgeries, Foye is probably still hurting, Miller is a gamer but also hurt, and Jamison just returned. I would say it's dame near even. Although, I will say Shaq would have probably drawn 2/3 phantom fouls on BH and we were missing Oberto as backup.

Have to say that was the best refereed game all season - both ways.

Welcome back AJ! Every time I become less appreciative, you prove me wrong.

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 18, 2009 10:27 PM | Report abuse

I too switched to the ESPN broadcast and back just to see which was better. ESPN was better. I like Phil and Buck but ESPN gives you an unbiased perception and they were much more exciting than the home Team.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 10:28 PM | Report abuse

Welcome back Antawn!! If Arenas and Butler could hit broad sign of a barn we win that game by 30.

So great to see Jamison back and as effective as ever, this could be just another game or the turning point.

Make it the latter Flip!

Posted by: divi3 | November 18, 2009 10:33 PM | Report abuse

64 to40 in the 2nd half.
Did anyone else watch AJ play D?
Or DS?
Loved the Tech on #23.
Boobie was scoreless and he normally kills the Wizzies.
Holding the Cavs to 91 is big.
Glad to see CB finally get some shots to fall.
BH played like he was possessed.
Earl gets this team moving.
Gilbert is still a few games away from being Gilbert.
MM will make everyone else on the floor better.
Enjoyed this one.

Posted by: VBFan | November 18, 2009 10:35 PM | Report abuse

Does anybody know what is going on with GM Flortv?

Haven't seen a post from him in a while. Is everything OK?

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 10:36 PM | Report abuse

And now for some hard truth, Caron is a weak link in a big way. His play MUST improve or Miller should start in front of him.

Posted by: divi3 | November 18, 2009 10:38 PM | Report abuse

@Bulletsfever,

Yep, you have to recognize. Although, I thought he did a good job on Wade as well and still got bashed. He either A) wasn't guarding Wade for some of his points or B) made Wade make tough shots.

Boykins is here for the remainder of the season. I like him as a change of pace PG. I wouldn't play him serious minutes every game bc he can also be a liability. We'll see. Critter has got to be pissed to have missed this opportunity.

Hubie Brown - nobody better. He talks about the teams he is covering like he has watched every game (maybe he has). Unlike say, Barkley, who dismisses us without really knowing what he is talking about. When talking about the Cavs struggles in Washington Hubbie said (paraphrasing): "Not like Washington is not a tough playoff team when healthy. They just need to stay healthy."

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 18, 2009 10:39 PM | Report abuse

"I wouldn't play him serious minutes every game bc he can also be a liability. We'll see."

The Cavs didnt exploit Boykins on D and he killed them just like he does EVERY team that doesnt pound on him.

Earl's quicks and handle are as good as there is in the nba, what a great pickup, and every night opponent doesnt exploit him he should play good mins

Posted by: divi3 | November 18, 2009 10:42 PM | Report abuse

Hibachi was on tonight...

Not the hibachi you're used to though...the hibachi chefs were the Cavs players in the first half who sliced and diced Les BouleS defense.

Gilby shot 27% and the analysts said that Gilby clearly has lost a step. Doesn't finish strong like he used to, and no ups in his last step.

To me, it seems like after the Cavs ran up the big lead, they lost interest.

Once Les BouleS started building a lead, the Cavs didn't have the firepower to answer, especially with Shaq and Varejao out and a roster full of young 4's.

There was a huge FT discrepancy. Les BouleS shot 35, while the Cavs shot 15. Les BouleS had 15 fouls called, while Cavs had 26.

I predict the Cavs will make a trade for a veteran 4 before the trade deadline is over. Even with LeBron, I don't think they can contend for a ring.

Note: Eminem and BTH were the MVP's tonight, along with good scoring from MeTawn. BTH held the fort, and many times Hubie (of course I didn't watch on the homer station) said that they need to get some touches to the big man to reward him for his hustle on D.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | November 18, 2009 10:48 PM | Report abuse

Boykins is here for the remainder of the season. I like him as a change of pace PG. I wouldn't play him serious minutes every game bc he can also be a liability. We'll see. Critter has got to be pissed to have missed this opportunity.

RPhilli721,

This is why I was bringing up Crit several blogs back and I was getting pounded. Crit has the speed to bring what Earl is doing and he has size to not be a liability.

I hope it works out for him here. I would hate to see him doing what I know he will be doing on another Team.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 10:51 PM | Report abuse

"Gilbert from where he is coming from is just fine, just fine. For all that he is being asked to do he is Just fine, Just fine.

Ya' Heard' Me'.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 9:59 PM | Report abuse "

If Gilby hit the market now...would he get max money? Surely not.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | November 18, 2009 10:51 PM | Report abuse

DC_Fan78, why do you hate the Wizards so much?

Give some REAL props to Jamison. He comes back and drops 31 on the Cavs as a 2-8 team beats last year's 60 win team.

And you dont approve?

Eff that retarded junk about Gil losing this and that, he's less than 15 games into his return from micro-fracture. only a FOOL thinks we're looking at the final product

Posted by: divi3 | November 18, 2009 10:53 PM | Report abuse

"This is why I was bringing up Crit several blogs back and I was getting pounded. Crit has the speed to bring what Earl is doing and he has size to not be a liability.

I hope it works out for him here. I would hate to see him doing what I know he will be doing on another Team.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 10:51 PM | Report abuse "

You are one stupid person.

Critter has no offensive game compared to Boykins.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | November 18, 2009 10:54 PM | Report abuse

"If Gilby hit the market now...would he get max money? Surely not."

Who cares? He was offered max money by GSW and Sacramento while he was injured anyway.

Again, why do you hate the Wizards so much?

Posted by: divi3 | November 18, 2009 10:55 PM | Report abuse

@JPRS,

C'mon dude. You expect me to feel sorry for a team that is down a couple guys??? Seriously? lol

And, who cares that DS was rested. A) He still played GREAT defense on LJ. B) Just means it was a brilliant coaching move by FS.

Posted by: rphilli721

/////////////////////////////////

This is nothing about feeling sorry for anyone. It's a question of trying to gauge what this win means in terms of the big picture. What does this win say about where the Wizards currently are? If they beat a team like the Cavs at full-strength, that says one thing; if they don't, well, you have a different kind of take away.

On one side of the balance sheet the Wizards should have more time to develop chemistry and master Flip's offense. On the other side, Shaq's presence creates mismatches on the court -- he creates problems in terms of fouls in the low post.

As far as time-management goes, that too matters. Is Stevenson going to be as effective as a defender against LeBron if he's played 35 minutes instead of 16? Is Stevenson as effective with an additional 10-12 minutes added to that 16 minute total? I doubt it. LeBron gets into a rhythm playing against one defender (or set of defenders), and then you throw him a change-up. It's an effective use of a rotation.

I'm not taking anything away from Stevenson. He deserves a game ball (as well as some other players tonight). I think Flip did a very good job managing the rotations on the fly. Keeping Stevenson fresh and in reserve until the 2nd half was the right call in this particular match-up.

As far as your point goes, Larry, it's the same deal. Beating the Cavs with LeBron is great. Doing it when they have some depth at the front-court creates another set of challenges. Is going small in the late 3rd or early 4th quarter an option if if Varajeo is at PF and Shaq is at Center? Probably not. Different personnel means a different game plan. The Wizards still might have pulled out a win, but it would have been a different game. My guess is that they don't use the same rotations in the future if those two players are available. In the first match-up Haywood had 6 personal fouls; Miller had 5; McGee had 4; and Blatche had 4. Part of that is because Shaq creates mismatches when he's on the court. If Haywood is dealing with foul trouble and McGee is getting time on the floor against Shaq, it's a different ball game.

Posted by: JPRS | November 18, 2009 11:00 PM | Report abuse

Good point. Was going to say the same thing about Critter. Not in the same league as Boyk as a set up man or offensive player. Defense would be his only advantage at this point in his career.

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 18, 2009 11:01 PM | Report abuse

"Who cares? He was offered max money by GSW and Sacramento while he was injured anyway.

Again, why do you hate the Wizards so much?

Posted by: divi3 | November 18, 2009 10:55 PM | Report abuse "

It was a bonehead move to give him max money then, and it clearly shows now.

You'll feel the pinch come the next few seasons when either Eminem, Caron, or BTH walk for more money elsewhere b/c Les BouleS can't afford them.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | November 18, 2009 11:02 PM | Report abuse

"What does this win say about where the Wizards currently are? If they beat a team like the Cavs at full-strength, that says one thing; if they don't, well, you have a different kind of take away."

Well, if you want to play that game, then you have to acknowledge that Gil shot 6-22 and Caron barely better. So while you envision what would have happened with Shaq on the floor, you have to consider what happens if Gil and Caron are shooting near or at their career averages

Posted by: divi3 | November 18, 2009 11:04 PM | Report abuse

It was a bonehead move to give him max money then, and it clearly shows now.

You'll feel the pinch come the next few seasons when either Eminem, Caron, or BTH walk for more money elsewhere b/c Les BouleS can't afford them.

Posted by: DC_MAN88

Agreed. I'd much rather see BTH and MM resigned next year with Caron leaving in 2011 when his contract is up. I don't see any way they can keep all three.

Posted by: ArmChairQB | November 18, 2009 11:07 PM | Report abuse

"It was a bonehead move to give him max money then, and it clearly shows now.

You'll feel the pinch come the next few seasons when either Eminem, Caron, or BTH walk for more money elsewhere b/c Les BouleS can't afford them."

The way caron is playing now, who cares if he leaves.

So you are on record now as saying "eminem" is a very solid player the team should pay. Great trade Ernie huh?

Again, why do you hate the Wizards so much? Just seems odd you spend so much time here when clearly you root against the organization.

Posted by: divi3 | November 18, 2009 11:07 PM | Report abuse

dits20: "hope that we now bench DS totally"

Good thing they didn't take this advice, huh?

Posted by: Samson151 | November 18, 2009 11:11 PM | Report abuse

"The way caron is playing now, who cares if he leaves.

So you are on record now as saying "eminem" is a very solid player the team should pay. Great trade Ernie huh?

Again, why do you hate the Wizards so much? Just seems odd you spend so much time here when clearly you root against the organization.

Posted by: divi3 | November 18, 2009 11:07 PM | Report abuse "

And the way Gilby is playing now reinforces the statement that EG was stupid to overpay him.

I'm on record of saying Eminem had a great game. Who can predict with Les BouleS luck that he can continue it? Nobody.

Why do you suck on Les BouleS jock so much even when they suck? Clearly you should wake up.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | November 18, 2009 11:12 PM | Report abuse

"The way caron is playing now, who cares if he leaves."

Or this advice, either...

Posted by: Samson151 | November 18, 2009 11:12 PM | Report abuse

"Agreed. I'd much rather see BTH and MM resigned next year with Caron leaving in 2011 when his contract is up. I don't see any way they can keep all three.

Posted by: ArmChairQB | November 18, 2009 11:07 PM | Report abuse "

And if Caron walks for nothing, then that would mean it was a poor gamble on EG's part for saying he was untouchable with the Amare trade.

Nobody of Caron's caliber should walk with no compensation. Same with Larry.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | November 18, 2009 11:13 PM | Report abuse

Go Bullets,

It's simple: 1) Jamison is back 2) Gilbert Arenas is NOT a point guard, Earl Boykins is 3) Andre Blatch and Brendon Haywood seem to be serious about playing basketball 4) Miller is playing even better than anyone could have hoped, seeing him out there, playing hurt, makes me want to send him a christmas card (and i don't even believe in God).

I was very unhappy that the Wiz signed Arenas to that massive contract, i think he's a selfish, team goes as i go kind of player-- i compare him to Allan Iverson minus the Hall of Fame potential. I they can get him to put away his ego and play smart basketball, this team has huge potential. I don't ever remember them being this deep

Posted by: oljakers | November 18, 2009 11:14 PM | Report abuse

"I'm on record of saying Eminem had a great game. Who can predict with Les BouleS luck that he can continue it? Nobody."

Actually you are on record as saying signing Gil was a bonehead move because now we wont be able to re-sign "eminem." In fact, that's what you said 10 minutes ago.

Ok, you hate the Wizards and want us to lose. But at least try and stay logical and consistent in your hating, too easy to point out your nonsense currently.

Posted by: divi3 | November 18, 2009 11:15 PM | Report abuse

I've said this before, and I'll say it again. If this team doesn't shut MM down for a minute, his injury will wind up being a season-ending one. Right now he's our MVP and we certainly can't afford to lose him for the season. Hard to figure when our medical staff is going to learn their lessons.

By the way, for all the naysayers, tonight's exclamation point game by AJ should provide proof beyond a shadow of doubt of his value to this team.

Posted by: bpybay | November 18, 2009 11:15 PM | Report abuse

"I was very unhappy that the Wiz signed Arenas to that massive contract, i think he's a selfish, team goes as i go kind of player-- i compare him to Allan Iverson minus the Hall of Fame potential. I they can get him to put away his ego and play smart basketball, this team has huge potential. I don't ever remember them being this deep

Posted by: oljakers | November 18, 2009 11:14 PM | Report abuse "

Call it what you will.

This is a "deep" team that can't afford to lose a single top player.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | November 18, 2009 11:19 PM | Report abuse

Critter has no offensive game compared to Boykins.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | November 18, 2009 10:54 PM

So you think. From where I sit he does. Not as prolific and you have to realize that Earl is a seasoned vet and Crit is not.

However, does he have the talents now to push the offense for the Wizards and the answer is unequivocably, Yes!

Don't be so durn moronic, DCMan88. I told you before that that all your good points go to waste because most will not see through the cow manure and pettiness you feel the need to continually expose.

Did you get treated badly growing up?

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 11:19 PM | Report abuse

"Actually you are on record as saying signing Gil was a bonehead move because now we wont be able to re-sign "eminem." In fact, that's what you said 10 minutes ago.

Ok, you hate the Wizards and want us to lose. But at least try and stay logical and consistent in your hating, too easy to point out your nonsense currently.

Posted by: divi3 | November 18, 2009 11:15 PM | Report abuse "

I'm on record of saying they will walk because Les BouleS can't afford them...including Eminem.

Logic is not in your dictionary for loving Les BouleS.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | November 18, 2009 11:21 PM | Report abuse

"So you think. From where I sit he does.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | November 18, 2009 11:19 PM | Report abuse "

Sitting on the toilet and thinking about Critter does not result in good basketball reasoning.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | November 18, 2009 11:22 PM | Report abuse

"Amare, Kidd, any number of NFL players - it's always the second season back from micro fracture surgery where they excel again. posted by rphilli"

Hubie Brown may have said it, but it ain't necessarily so. Outcomes from microfracture surgery are far more unpredictable than that suggests. Basically you're drilling holes in order to create seepage resulting in a 'superclot' that can proceed to grow reparative cartilage to pad and protect the bone. It's a great technique, but pro basketball and football offer a whole other level of stress. Players like Allen Houston, Penny Hardaway, and Brian Grant played again, but at a much reduced capacity.

The reason players seem to improve in year two, however, probably has more to do with the player's improved confidence in the knee's health than with any lingering medical problems.

Posted by: Samson151 | November 18, 2009 11:23 PM | Report abuse

I want someone from the Wiz brass to explain why Gil shot that technical in the first quarter (he has not been shooting free throws well all year) when Caron was on the floor.

Posted by: bpybay | November 18, 2009 11:23 PM | Report abuse

"What does this win say about where the Wizards currently are? If they beat a team like the Cavs at full-strength, that says one thing; if they don't, well, you have a different kind of take away."

Well, what does it say about our losses when we were down guys. It's a stupid "what-if" game you're playing.

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 18, 2009 11:26 PM | Report abuse

And now for some hard truth, Caron is a weak link in a big way. His play MUST improve or Miller should start in front of him.

Posted by: divi3 | November 18, 2009 10:38 PM | Report abuse

He had a GREAT 4th quarter.

Posted by: bpybay | November 18, 2009 11:32 PM | Report abuse

Starting lineup henceforth:

PG Earl Boykins
SG Arenas
SF Butler
PF Jamison
C Haywood

1st off bench:

SF Mike Miller (bty 6th man of the year a few years ago. He should be allowed to fight for a starting spot-- include Arenas in that competition).

PF Andre Blatch

C Umberto

Package Young and McGee in a trade for either a veteran PF or 3rd C

Posted by: oljakers | November 18, 2009 11:34 PM | Report abuse

Nobody of Caron's caliber should walk with no compensation. Same with Larry.

Posted by: DC_MAN88

What is Caron's "caliber"? What's he done that's so special? He's one part of the puzzle, not the centerpiece of the team. In fact, he might be the fourth best player on the team now (AJ, GA, MM) and in 2011 he might rank even lower if Blatche continues his ascent.

Posted by: ArmChairQB | November 18, 2009 11:41 PM | Report abuse

Thanks Dr. Samson,

First, it was stated that it usually takes that long for the player to become whatever it is they get back to. Obviously there are no guarantees. I've watched sports for a long time and have heard/seen countless anecdotal evidence to the contrary. Amare being a recent example. He flat out said in an interview that I heard that it took until year two for him to get his explosion back.

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 18, 2009 11:46 PM | Report abuse

"I want someone from the Wiz brass to explain why Gil shot that technical in the first quarter (he has not been shooting free throws well all year) when Caron was on the floor..."

Amen! First shot of the game. Arenas should never take that freethrow as long as Caron (or Boykins) is on the floor.

Posted by: oljakers | November 18, 2009 11:46 PM | Report abuse

"What is Caron's "caliber"? What's he done that's so special? He's one part of the puzzle, not the centerpiece of the team. In fact, he might be the fourth best player on the team now (AJ, GA, MM) and in 2011 he might rank even lower if Blatche continues his ascent.

Posted by: ArmChairQB | November 18, 2009 11:41 PM | Report abuse "

You go ask EG why he was untouchable as part of that trade offer. Go do it.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | November 18, 2009 11:48 PM | Report abuse

"What does this win say about where the Wizards currently are? If they beat a team like the Cavs at full-strength, that says one thing; if they don't, well, you have a different kind of take away."

Well, what does it say about our losses when we were down guys. It's a stupid "what-if" game you're playing.

Posted by: rphilli721

///////////////////////////////

"What-if" matters if you want to make smart wagers in the future.

The kind of people who like to see what's ahead of them ask the question. In my view these teams play again in January and they might meet again the post-season, so it's not a moot question. For others maybe it's a pointless exercise. So be it. Different strokes for different folks, as the saying goes.

Posted by: JPRS | November 18, 2009 11:53 PM | Report abuse

Was Shaq in town?

Does anyone know whether he was invited over to the house to check out the grotto?

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | November 18, 2009 11:54 PM | Report abuse

Boykins starting is comical. You should get your posting privileges revoked for that suggestion.

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 18, 2009 11:55 PM | Report abuse

Again, it means nothing. There are going to be plenty of games we play with hurt players or our opponents will be down. A win is a win. Cavs are supposedly a contender and we just beat them at home with guys banged up and our two best players still struggling.

You can lose that logic to defuse just about any win.

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 19, 2009 12:07 AM | Report abuse

"Amare, Kidd, any number of NFL players - it's always the second season back from micro fracture surgery where they excel again. posted by rphilli"

Hubie Brown may have said it, but it ain't necessarily so. Outcomes from microfracture surgery are far more unpredictable than that suggests. Basically you're drilling holes in order to create seepage resulting in a 'superclot' that can proceed to grow reparative cartilage to pad and protect the bone. It's a great technique, but pro basketball and football offer a whole other level of stress. Players like Allen Houston, Penny Hardaway, and Brian Grant played again, but at a much reduced capacity.

The reason players seem to improve in year two, however, probably has more to do with the player's improved confidence in the knee's health than with any lingering medical problems.

Posted by: Samson151

//////////////////////////////////

Makes sense. In Arenas's case he seems to have the lateral movement and speed of old, but he doesn't have the same elevation when he attacks the basket. It might be that he's playing closer to the floor in order to protect himself when he's around the basket (e.g. it's a question of confidence). It may be that he doesn't have the same elevation.

He's shown some flashes of old on offense; defensively he's improved. On this team too, it's not all on him. There a plenty of other players capable of scoring when he hits a cold streak. 8 assists 2 turnovers, 6 rebounds, and 18 points in 32 minutes is solid production.

Posted by: JPRS | November 19, 2009 12:12 AM | Report abuse

ed: use

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 19, 2009 12:22 AM | Report abuse

Boykins starting is comical. You should get your posting privileges revoked for that suggestion.

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 18, 2009 11:55 PM

Holmes... news flash. The starting "pg" (Arenas) for this team leads the league in turnovers this year. He singlehandedly lost the game against the Heat by committing 7 turnovers and missing 8 shots in a row in the 3rd period. Not to mention other abysmal performances Until this team finds a REAL pointguard to start, Earl Boykins will be just fine. Reviewing your past posts, concerning this game, it appears to be your prerogative to pontificate, ad nauseum, your quasi-authoritative position to every person who has an angle. Personally, i think you know Jack. Got friends?

Posted by: oljakers | November 19, 2009 12:28 AM | Report abuse

oljakers,

Arenas "single-handedly" lost the Miami game? Seriously, when Foye went down who else were the Wizards going to have running PG? Haywood?

I agree with rphilli721 that starting Boykins ain't going to happen except in an emergency. The past two games Arenas has an assist-to-turnover that's 4.5. Aside from the Miami disaster he's close to 3.0 on the season. He'll be fine.

Boykins is a great add, but I don't see him starting many games this year.

Posted by: JPRS | November 19, 2009 12:45 AM | Report abuse

good game for the wiz tonight...long way to go though...team just needs to stay healthy (the shoulder injuries on this team is worrisome-c'mon training staff get these guys strong and in condition)...flip will regret leaving miller in the game he first injured his shoulder (and they let him go back out there)...this guy is key and its gonna take all season for him to get right from this injury...gil gets a pass for his up and down play because of the last two seasons...but he only gets that pass if he plays smarter and moves the ball around instead of forcing shots...AJ is gonna make teams respect the wiz more because of his ability to score in the paint, make threes and rebound...caron can be the teams best defender if he makes it a priority and not worry about scoring as much (tayshun prince type role)...boykins is breath of fresh air! i hope they sign him for the remainder of the year...this was a "must" win as far as i was concerned and the wiz did it!! now here comes kevin durant...stay focused wiz (hope miller is alright).

Posted by: ronniecope106 | November 19, 2009 12:47 AM | Report abuse

Well, first, jerk face, I never got personal and I'm not your Holmes. And, if your suggestion wasn't ridiculous I wouldn't have said anything. Nobody with a modicum with sense would do what you say. You want to live on an island, be my guest. The dude was not even in league a couple of weeks ago for a reason. He is a nice change of pace guy and that is all and I guarantee that is all he will be for us.

It's pretty obvious that the starting lineup tonight is the one that FS will use. I'm sure he cares what you think.

You know jack, Jack!

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 19, 2009 12:52 AM | Report abuse

Ed: of sense

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 19, 2009 12:54 AM | Report abuse

"The reason players seem to improve in year two, however, probably has more to do with the player's improved confidence in the knee's health than with any lingering medical problems."

Certainly there's a physiological edge to it, but the implication has always been that the reason the recovery generally takes so long is because that' about the time it takes to fully rebuild the muscles in the leg back to their pre-surgery level of strength and endurance. I recall a quote from Grover saying that when he first started working with Arenas, his leg looked like that of someone who'd been in a coma for a year, because he lost so much muscle mass.

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 19, 2009 1:25 AM | Report abuse

JPRS,

Yes, single-handedly. In using the Heat game as an example, it was not my intention to question who, if not Arenas, should have played the PG position in that particular game, my point was that Arenas obviously is not effective in that position. This team now has a player who at least understands the role of PG, in Boykins. He should start.

Gilbert Arenas will never "be fine" as a point guard. A good point guard is unselfish, a thinker and an effective mover of the ball; Arenas is a 'i score first, team comes second' basketball player. Tonight he was 6-22 from the floor (under 40%), with two absurd 3 point attempts from near mid-court, with at least 15 ticks left on the shot clock. Those two shots alone exemplify this players mentality. Gilbert Arenas is an "I score points, that's what i do" type of player. Those who lead teams to championships, to a man, say "WE win games, that's what WE do". Gregg Popovich can't wait to get his team out there with A0 runnin' the point for the Wiz. I do hope he outgrows his ego though, i do love this basketball team, sometimes in spite of myself

Posted by: oljakers | November 19, 2009 1:42 AM | Report abuse

btw, can anyone speak a-hole? I need a translation for rphili71's little message. I'm sure whatever it is he said, Flip, as always, was hanging on every word

Posted by: oljakers | November 19, 2009 1:53 AM | Report abuse

oljakers,

Along with a sub-par shooting night Arenas also had 8 assists to 2 turnovers -- that's not bad. The previous game he had 10 assists to 2 turnovers. Teams have to account for him on the floor. His 3 point shooting this year has been solid (with the exception of tonight). He finished the night with a +7 point differential and helped the team with its 3rd quarter run.

Some of his reads aren't great, but I figure some of that will come in time. I'd be curious to hear what Flip or Sam Cassell, or his teammates would say -- my sense is that they probably wouldn't say he's a "me-first" player. During his All-Star run before the injuries, I'd say that he didn't distribute enough. Part of that may have been due to the composition of those teams where you basically had three players carrying the offensive load. This season, aside from the Miami game, he's done an OK job of trying to distribute the ball. He's giving teammates some good looks.

The Boykin suggestion though isn't an answer. He's a solid change of pace player, and more of a true point guard than Arenas. He's a great guy to have coming off the bench. With 30-35 minutes a night though starting against opponents first units, I think you'd see lower production. Flip is likely to get maximum production out of him using him as a primary back-up and situational player.

Flip's offense can work with a hybrid guard like Arenas. That's the hypothesis at least -- and that's part of the reason that EG hired him. We'll see how things go. Ten games into the season is pretty early to make predictions. Either the experiment will work, or it won't.

As far as San Antonio goes, Arenas's skill set wouldn't be a great fit. There are a number of All-Star caliber players who wouldn't fit in Pops system as well. That doesn't mean that the Spurs system is the only workable version of the team concept (this season they aren't hitting on all cylinders yet either).

It's also worth noting that the Wizards aren't built as a defensive juggernaut, and Tim Duncans or David Robinsons aren't exactly a dime a dozen. You have to build a team around its strengths.

Posted by: JPRS | November 19, 2009 2:36 AM | Report abuse

Really, the Boykins idea is not the answer. No.

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 19, 2009 5:44 AM | Report abuse

LOL...you people are funny...complain about Gil leading the league in turnovers...go look at who leads the league just about every season. Steve Nash...does that mean he's not a PG?

Some of you just want them to play terribly so you can celebrate. When they play well against a good team for the 2nd time it's like...well they're not going to re-sign them. End your life...it'll be so much easier then living like that.

Who is a "fan" of a team and makes excuses for the QUALITY team they beat...but if the Wizards lose it's because of the GM, the PG, the owner, what's wrong with you?

We were up 17 without Jamison and blew it...lost by 12. I didn't hear...oh we were up and got bored so they won.

They were up 17 without Shaq/Varajeo and lost by 20. It's excuses for Cleveland? Oh they didn't have Shaq and Varajeo. Well we didn't have Jamison. I bet you just couldn't wait to get on here and brag if the Wizards would've gotten blown out.

Nobody felt sorry for a 19 win team so why are excuses getting made for a 60 win team?

Posted by: SDMDTSU | November 19, 2009 8:57 AM | Report abuse

give it a rest

Posted by: tgif11 | November 19, 2009 12:24 PM | Report abuse

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