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Flip Saunders cuts practice short, orders players to come back later

By Michael Lee

Flustered by the effort displayed by his team -- and the backtalk from players over calls from coaches during a scrimmage -- Flip Saunders stormed out of practice on Monday. As he left the floor, Saunders told his players, "If you want to get better. Come back at 4."

The players looked stunned. They realized that they were in store for another practice later in the afternoon when Saunders assistant coaches followed him to the locker room. As they players started to leave, Josh Howard said, "Y'all better wake up."

Hilton Armstrong wasn't willing to just let practice end in that fashion, so he called the players back and told them that there was a reason for the extra session. He could see the frustration but said, "The coaches only want to make us better. Real talk."

Saunders later explained what led to his disappointment. The Wizards have lost two in a row and four out of five to start the season, and had no excuse for a sluggish practice after a day off.

"We didn't accomplish what we needed to get accomplished. After you lose a couple of games, you hope to come with a sense of urgency. I was excited about coming here," Saunders said, adding that he arrived more than three hours before practice. "We didn't come with that same urgency as a team. We're not going to beg guys to play hard. If they want to play hard, we'll come back and go another time, we get people who do play hard. That's one thing as coaches, you can't coach effort. We'll find guys that are going to give it."

Andray Blatche said the Wizards probably need more practice time. "What's our record? We 1-4. Patience is running out. Guys are getting frustrated," Blatche said. "I don't have a problem with it. A two a day. Training camp in November. Cool by me. We need it. We losing. That's what happens when you lose. You have to put extra time in."

Armstrong, a four-year NBA veteran was asked if he had ever seen a coach walk out of practice. He smiled and said, "College. Yeah, a couple of times." Armstrong, of course, played for the hard-nosed and borderline abusive Jim Calhoun at Connecticut.

Howard, who is recovering from left knee surgery, said he participated in part of practice, but noticed that the energy level wasn't where it needed to be. He added that he had never seen a coach leave practice in that manner, but understood based on how the Wizards have performed to start the season. "I told some of the guys. 'We getting ready to get a paycheck on the 15th.' For right now, they getting a paycheck for nothing. I can honestly say that. I don't think guys are really buying into this. If anything, we need to work for this paycheck."

Said Saunders, "It's frustration when you lost games that are winnable. You would think that you'd come into a practice with a sense of urgency. Come in to learn, to be very detail oriented, get in, get out, get what you need to get done and get better. I didn't think we had the right frame of mind. Kirk [Hinrich], Al [Thornton] and Cartier [Martin] gave the right effort, but as a whole, there were a couple of guys that were in between but then there are some guys that didn't do what we needed to do, so we'll come back at four."

By Michael Lee  | November 8, 2010; 2:15 PM ET
 
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Next: Lackluster effort at first practice gets Wizards a second

Comments

It's about time! Cut or trade the bums. The Wiz can't do any worse.

Posted by: joe2chase | November 8, 2010 2:49 PM | Report abuse

Flip whines, but has he changed his line-up or rotations one iota? Not happy with a player Flip? You have bench-warmers that you can use to send a message even if you aren't happy with your players efforts, perhaps someone riding the pine might surprise you.

Posted by: closg | November 8, 2010 2:56 PM | Report abuse

I'm torn between 'Flip threw a hissy fit' and 'Flip flipped out on these bums'

Posted by: kahlua87 | November 8, 2010 3:00 PM | Report abuse

Wow. Let 'em have it Flip. Flip knows his a$$ is on the line b/c he's not going to get many more chances to be a head coach if this team keeps executing so poorly.

Posted by: ZardsFan1 | November 8, 2010 3:04 PM | Report abuse

Who cares?! It's like watching your parent overreact to something you did but not actually punishing you for doing it. Unless he cuts someone or makes a lineup change it was all drama and no substance, much like this team.

Posted by: authorofpoetry | November 8, 2010 3:05 PM | Report abuse


"Kirk [Hinrich], Al [Thornton] and Cartier [Martin] gave the right effort, but as a whole, there were a couple of guys that were in between but then there are some guys that didn't do what we needed to do, so we'll come back at four."

What? So basically 2 of the Wiz's 5 starters give a sh#t? Should be a great season.

Posted by: gimmedat | November 8, 2010 3:10 PM | Report abuse

What was Flips reaction? Walking away like a p*ssy instead of yelling at the people that needed to be called-out, he left it to Neck to do the communicating for him. How pathetic, get a real man in here that the players will respect to coach these young guys.

Posted by: closg | November 8, 2010 3:10 PM | Report abuse

For those crying out for lineup changes . . . given the players on the roster, what changes are there to make? The only obvious change to be made is starting Arenas in place of either Hinrich or Thornton, but given his conditioning issues from the injury layoff, that's probably not a good move right now. Other than that, there's no one not currently in the rotation whose presence is likely to have a significant impact on winning or losing. Would it be nice to see what Booker, Seraphin, and possibly N'Diaye have got to offer? Sure. Would any of them likely alter the team's win/loss fortunes? Not really.

The Wizards are a bad team. Deal with it.

(Oh, and for the record, the coach doesn't cut players, the GM does.)

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 8, 2010 3:12 PM | Report abuse

FLIP should fire himself for starters, then go from there.

Posted by: maejude | November 8, 2010 3:13 PM | Report abuse

Lollygaggers!

Posted by: bryc3 | November 8, 2010 3:16 PM | Report abuse


I hope the Wizards' losing culture hasn't already swallowed up Wall. His name wasn't among those listed by Flip as giving effort.

That said, I agree with closg. Flip should have called out the guys who were half-assing it and demanded more from them. I don't like this passive-aggressive approach from the head coach of a young team.

Posted by: artiesliver | November 8, 2010 3:19 PM | Report abuse

How can the players respect (if they still do) Flip after he pulled yet another passive-agressive move. I'm surprised he didn't say that "KG____before he walked-out.

Posted by: closg | November 8, 2010 3:30 PM | Report abuse

This team need a major attitude adjustment. Talent there, mind not,

Posted by: lostdogrwd1011 | November 8, 2010 3:30 PM | Report abuse

Flip, I work across the street real talk. For the league minimum, I'd sign and promise offensive & defensive boards would increase...gimme a shot...really, what do you have to loose?

Posted by: Gooddad | November 8, 2010 3:32 PM | Report abuse

Didn't Ernie just blow up the team to get guys with the right attitude? I can't believe Nick Young wasn't one of the guys working hard. By the way, where are all the NY kool-aid drinkers today? Young followed up his quarterly good scoring night against Philly with a 3 point, 1 rebound, zero assist effort in 15 minutes of playing time against the Knicks, and a 3 point, zero rebound, zero assist effort against Cleveland. But to make up for it, Young also played zero defense. That's our first round pick from 2007. Nice.

This team already needs to be blown up, but before that happens, Leonsis needs to blow up Grunfeld and Saunders. Speaking of Flipper, he's in a close game in the fourth quarter against the Cavs, and he "forgets" to put Thornton back in the game after Thornton went 10 for 16 and scored 23 points through three quarters? How do you look down your bench in the fourth quarter of a close game and not see Thornton? How can any player respect such a knucklehead of a coach? No wonder Saunders had to walk out of practice. He ought to walk out permanently, and take Ernie Dumbfeld with him.

Posted by: sonny2 | November 8, 2010 3:34 PM | Report abuse

Guess AB will have to skip his English class to attend another practice :)

Posted by: fearturtle44 | November 8, 2010 3:36 PM | Report abuse

Rumor has it that Flip said his players were a cancer to the team and the NBA. Not sure where he picked up on that one.

Posted by: fearturtle44 | November 8, 2010 3:38 PM | Report abuse

Flip whines, but has he changed his line-up or rotations one iota? Not happy with a player Flip? You have bench-warmers that you can use to send a message even if you aren't happy with your players efforts, perhaps someone riding the pine might surprise you.

Posted by: closg | November 8, 2010 2:56 PM | Report abuse

But when Flip benches McGee for making mistakes...it's "why wasn't JaVale out there?"

Can't have it both ways. Everybody says they want it one way...but in reality...they don't.

Posted by: SDMDTSU | November 8, 2010 3:40 PM | Report abuse


Damn...I was almost CERTAIN that Flip would name Blatche as the player giving the most effort in practice. Maybe the 4:00 pm session?

Posted by: ArmChairQB | November 8, 2010 3:40 PM | Report abuse


But when Flip benches McGee for making mistakes...it's "why wasn't JaVale out there?"

Can't have it both ways. Everybody says they want it one way...but in reality...they don't.


Posted by: SDMDTSU | November 8, 2010 3:40 PM

Apples and oranges. Effort and execution are two different things.

Posted by: ArmChairQB | November 8, 2010 3:42 PM | Report abuse

looks like that 27-34 win projection is spot on. a shame they had 2 horrible years and the only thing they got out of those draft picks was wall and cap relief that wasnt sure. ugh.

this teams "bigs" are so soft. they have gilbert from 5 years ago in Wall, a combo guard that should be coming off the bench, and the best player has had 3 knee surgeries and needs the ball in his hand to be good, but hes now playing SG.

well, at least they'll get another high draft pick. lets hope Grunfeld isnt around to botch that draft, too.

DeJuan Blair would look great on this squad.

Posted by: m1ke3i6 | November 8, 2010 3:42 PM | Report abuse

Rumor has it that Flip said his players were a cancer to the team and the NBA. Not sure where he picked up on that one.

Posted by: fearturtle44 | November 8, 2010 3:38 PM

LOL

Posted by: ArmChairQB | November 8, 2010 3:43 PM | Report abuse

How can the players respect (if they still do) Flip after he pulled yet another passive-agressive move.

Here is the question you should be asking:
How can the players on a team that has only logged one win (and that on a preposterously lucky shot) not respect themselves enough to try to improve by taking practice seriously?

Posted by: nmik | November 8, 2010 3:47 PM | Report abuse

Flip is doing the best he can with this garbage team Grunfeld assembled.

Posted by: sjp879 | November 8, 2010 3:50 PM | Report abuse

Why do people use "passive-aggressive" for any time a person gets mad but doesn't go postal? He canceled practice and rescheduled it for a few hours later and walked out while criticizing the players for lack of effort. It was very clear that he was dissatisfied. What's possibly "passive-aggressive" about that? Some of you guys just want to hate on Flip no matter what. If he does nothing, he's weak. If he gets mad, cancels practice, and tells them to come back for another practice on the same day, he's throwing a hissy fit, or being passive-aggressive.

Give me a break. He's trying whatever he can to get wins and get the attention of a bunch of kids, many of whom are renown for not being serious enough. In fact, it sounds just like the scene in "Bull Durham" when Costner tells the manager to scare the kids and then he throws all the bats into the shower. It's a smart management tool in this particular situation.

I know LarryClinton and others want to blame Flip for high unemployment and the BP oil spill, but this sounds reasonable. We're 1-4 and actually have some talent. I know all the haters like Wilbon currently feel vindicated with their predictions that we're a lottery team, but this is just a blip, a warmup. This is a good team and so Flip should be mad. I'm mad. This team should be 3-2 now -- and that's without its 2 best-players-who-aren't-rookies even in the starting lineup yet (and yes, I mean Gil and Howard). This is exactly what's needed for this currently underperforming team.

Posted by: Urnesto | November 8, 2010 3:51 PM | Report abuse

"Apples and oranges. Effort and execution are two different things."

Posted by: ArmChairQB | November 8, 2010 3:42 PM |

A player's failure to deliver either undermines the team's chances of winning.

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 8, 2010 3:51 PM | Report abuse

In response to Sonny2--"How do you look down your bench in the fourth quarter of a close game and not see Thornton?"

That driver at GMU also didn't see him when he was crossing the street during training camp. My theory is that Al has the power to make himself invisible.

Posted by: audacitea | November 8, 2010 3:52 PM | Report abuse

you'll find away to blame nick, what ever it was, nick did it. NICK plays 3 minute, but what ever happens bad on the team[LET'S BLAME NICK].

Posted by: maejude | November 8, 2010 3:52 PM | Report abuse

"DeJuan Blair would look great on this squad."

Posted by: m1ke3i6 | November 8, 2010 3:42 PM |

Yeah, his 27% FG shooting and 1 foul for every 5 minutes played would fit right in.

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 8, 2010 3:57 PM | Report abuse

Guess AB will have to skip his English class to attend another practice :)

Posted by: fearturtle44


True Dat, my Ninja!

Posted by: whatyoutalkinboutman | November 8, 2010 4:00 PM | Report abuse

Why ? should FLIP OUT, be mad when he cannot coach. Flip Out don't know who to play, or how to play who, and when to play who. Just fired Flip Out now. And Howard you need to shout up your mouth. Dallas paid your drunk a$$, when you was to high to play. These player work hard for their money. And they are grown men not littler boy's, and the coach should want to hear what the team have to say. So Flip Out run out like a wimp.

Posted by: maejude | November 8, 2010 4:12 PM | Report abuse

there's probably a little residue left over from the veteran players that are no longer here. they probably didn't practice as hard because they were priviledged veterans. the young guys have been immature for the better part of their tenure here in dc. they apparently still have that playfulness in them and it's time to grow up. they are now the team leaders, the team itself. that is what howard was saying. ya'll better wake up, playtime is over. i'd like to think this is where blatch will finally grow up and grab the bull by the horns. the nonchalant, i'm cool attitude must be replaced with i'm bad, stop me if you can. i think he would be the major change if there was to be anything. he still has good upside, and has shown the league he can be a force if properly motivated. what you may get for him is only hypothetical. i guess i'm trying to say the lackadasical attitude must be removed. young needs to understand this also, or he may be a casualty too.

Posted by: joerutgens72 | November 8, 2010 4:12 PM | Report abuse


He canceled practice and rescheduled it for a few hours later and walked out while criticizing the players for lack of effort. It was very clear that he was dissatisfied. What's possibly "passive-aggressive" about that?

Posted by: Urnesto | November 8, 2010 3:51 PM

P-a because Flip's not directly engaging the players whose performance he's dissatisfied with. It's a hit or miss approach since the main person whose behavior he's trying to alter might think he's doing just fine.

Q: When you supervise a group of people at your job, do you tell everyone under you they're not doing a good job or do you specifically and directly address the slacker(s)?

I consider this to be a shot across the bow by Flip to a couple guys. It's worth a try.

Posted by: 2020doc | November 8, 2010 4:16 PM | Report abuse

put your money where your mouth is Flip, give Cartier some serious burn Wednesday

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 4:20 PM | Report abuse

because Flip's not directly engaging the players whose performance he's dissatisfied with. It's a hit or miss approach since the main person whose behavior he's trying to alter might think he's doing just fine.

Kind of like benching all the starters in that game last season, rather than just AJ.

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 4:21 PM | Report abuse

I think Flip did not have his breakfast and try to put it on the players, what diffrence it is going to make,he and his team are not going to win.

Posted by: gtefferra | November 8, 2010 4:23 PM | Report abuse

But when Flip benches McGee for making mistakes...it's "why wasn't JaVale out there?"

Can't have it both ways. Everybody says they want it one way...but in reality...they don't.


Posted by: SDMDTSU | November 8, 2010 3:40 PM

Actually the question is "Why do Armstrong and Yi stay out there despite making the same mistakes while also not contributing anything?"

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 4:23 PM | Report abuse

Posted by: sonny2 | November 8, 2010 3:34 PM | Report abuse

haven't seen much of NY since the philly game. 21 combined minutes against NY and Cle to follow up a 23 min 20pt effort against philly? Gil's back. I posted the other day that a healthy Gil is gonna take some of NY's mins. I dunno if he's played especially poorly over this 3 gm stretch, it's funny how NY gets called out for his defense against the Knicks as if HE played 33 mins 7 pts 2 assts 2TOs 2rebs (guess who) and had to be checking one of the knicks guards.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | November 8, 2010 4:24 PM | Report abuse

"I told some of the guys, 'We getting to get a paycheck on the 15th.' For right now, they going a paycheck for nothing."
-Josh Howard

Say what? I usually hate to be critical of someone's grammer but this doesn't make sense. I get the gist of what he's saying but come on Josh....

Posted by: priceisright | November 8, 2010 4:26 PM | Report abuse

Playing time is the cost the players respect. Although Flip doesn't have much of a bench to use, he needs to use them to send a message. As this rate they are going to loose regardless of who plays. Thanks Ernie for the quality players. Ernie needs to go.

Posted by: JoeC2 | November 8, 2010 4:27 PM | Report abuse


I think Flip did not have his breakfast and try to put it on the players,....

Posted by: gtefferra | November 8, 2010 4:23 PM

Yeah, Flip just needed to make a run to Starbucks...definitely had not considered that angle.

Posted by: Firuz1 | November 8, 2010 4:28 PM | Report abuse

Co-sign, give Martin an opportunity Whining Flip.

Posted by: closg | November 8, 2010 4:28 PM | Report abuse

But when Flip benches McGee for making mistakes...it's "why wasn't JaVale out there?"

Can't have it both ways. Everybody says they want it one way...but in reality...they don't.


Posted by: SDMDTSU | November 8, 2010 3:40 PM

Actually the question is "Why do Armstrong and Yi stay out there despite making the same mistakes while also not contributing anything?"

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 4:23 PM | Report abuse

Not to mention the difference between making a mistake, and not trying at all. If a guy isn't trying, yeah pull him. But if a guy is clearly trying and the ball bounces the other way, or he tries for the rebound and tips it in his own basket or to the other team.........it's kinda different. You can't win with a quitter, you give yourself a chance with effort.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | November 8, 2010 4:29 PM | Report abuse

flip is a cry baby. wizards need a hard nosed coach. flip whines and doesnt get the best out of the players. all he does is bench them instead of letting em loose....ex mcgee, thorton, young, none are ever in during crunch time.

Posted by: skinsfan09 | November 8, 2010 4:30 PM | Report abuse

Say what? I usually hate to be critical of someone's grammer but this doesn't make sense. I get the gist of what he's saying but come on Josh....

Posted by: priceisright | November 8, 2010 4:26 PM | Report abuse

Put that on Mike Lee his Wizinsider stories are chock full of typos and grammatical errors ( kinda like mine). He looks like a nod and smile typa guy vs a "scuse me, what was that?" typa guy.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | November 8, 2010 4:31 PM | Report abuse

so it's after 4 Lee what's going on are they practicing or did the team stand Flip up for their afternoon date?

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | November 8, 2010 4:32 PM | Report abuse

I have watched two games and part of one. I see boring NBA ball. At least with the old team, I saw teamwork, a team running the offense, and good basketball, even if they weren't winning. This is run and shoot.

Posted by: Allegheny9341 | November 8, 2010 4:32 PM | Report abuse

hinrich, armstrong, yi all make terrible mistakes in the game, if that wer mcgee or young, theyd be yanked asap by flip.. he just plays his favorites. freakin bumb coach. the team has some talent, he just cant get it out of them or wont let them. flip needs to go, hes the main problem. he wont delelop this team. let him be a personal assistant to kg, so when kg curses and spits, flip can clean it up and support kg.

Posted by: skinsfan09 | November 8, 2010 4:34 PM | Report abuse

"P-a because Flip's not directly engaging the players whose performance he's dissatisfied with."

Posted by: 2020doc | November 8, 2010 4:16 PM"

My reading of the story is that he wasn't esp. satisfied with anyone's performance in practice. He noted 3 guys who he thought came in with the right attitude. Should he have called out each of the other 12 by name? What would that have accomplished?

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 8, 2010 4:36 PM | Report abuse

But when Flip benches McGee for making mistakes...it's "why wasn't JaVale out there?"

Can't have it both ways. Everybody says they want it one way...but in reality...they don't.


Posted by: SDMDTSU | November 8, 2010 3:40 PM

Actually the question is "Why do Armstrong and Yi stay out there despite making the same mistakes while also not contributing anything?"

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 4:23 PM | Report abuse

Not to mention the difference between making a mistake, and not trying at all. If a guy isn't trying, yeah pull him. But if a guy is clearly trying and the ball bounces the other way, or he tries for the rebound and tips it in his own basket or to the other team.........it's kinda different. You can't win with a quitter, you give yourself a chance with effort.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | November 8, 2010 4:29 PM | Report abuse


I think that it'd go across better if everyone was treated the same too. I don't see how a coach with any self respect ( or media filter) comes out and says "I can't bench John" . I know he's the face of the team but let's not put him above everyone else just yet. if he's your best player he'll prove it on his own . If he's a leader, then even he should recognize what's in the team's best interest in terms of winning.9 Tos should earn him a seat next to Sam I Am for a coupla mins just to calm down and re-focus.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | November 8, 2010 4:38 PM | Report abuse

My reading of the story is that he wasn't esp. satisfied with anyone's performance in practice. He noted 3 guys who he thought came in with the right attitude. Should he have called out each of the other 12 by name? What would that have accomplished?

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 8, 2010 4:36 PM | Report abuse

Make them personally accountable for ther actions?

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | November 8, 2010 4:41 PM | Report abuse


Flip was quick to announce that the practice was closed to the media so no reporters would see him at 4:00 p.m. standing all alone in the VC with a whistle around his neck, a full ballrack and no players. LMAO.

Posted by: bobabuie | November 8, 2010 4:41 PM | Report abuse

"I think that it'd go across better if everyone was treated the same too. I don't see how a coach with any self respect ( or media filter) comes out and says "I can't bench John" . I know he's the face of the team but let's not put him above everyone else just yet. if he's your best player he'll prove it on his own . If he's a leader, then even he should recognize what's in the team's best interest in terms of winning."

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | November 8, 2010 4:38 PM

Right now, keeping Wall on the floor as much as possible is item #1 on the team's "in the best interests of winning" list. That's why Saunders is reluctant to sit Wall. Not because he's "above everyone else" but because their base chance of winning comes with him on the floor with the ball in his hands.

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 8, 2010 4:42 PM | Report abuse

"I told some of the guys, 'We getting to get a paycheck on the 15th.' For right now, they going a paycheck for nothing."
-Josh Howard

Say what? I usually hate to be critical of someone's grammer but this doesn't make sense. I get the gist of what he's saying but come on Josh....

Lee just transposed "going" and "getting" and forgot, as usual, to proofread.

Posted by: nmik | November 8, 2010 4:43 PM | Report abuse


My reading of the story is that he wasn't esp. satisfied with anyone's performance in practice. He noted 3 guys who he thought came in with the right attitude. Should he have called out each of the other 12 by name? What would that have accomplished?

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 8, 2010 4:36 PM | Report abuse

Then why specifically mention any of them? What did that accomplish, other than making sure that Hinrich knew that he still has a man-crush on him?

Posted by: 2020doc | November 8, 2010 4:45 PM | Report abuse

Not because he's "above everyone else" but because their base chance of winning comes with him on the floor with the ball in his hands.

He's not that good yet, more likely to turn it over recently than make a play. I'm all for him learning, but RIGHT NOW he's not necessarily better than Gil or KH at a given moment

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 4:46 PM | Report abuse

"Make them personally accountable for ther actions?"

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | November 8, 2010 4:41 PM

A goal that was just as easily accomplished by doing what he did, which was let them all know that they weren't performing up to par. If it's one or two guys messing up, then addressing them individually would make sense. But when it's essentially the whole team, it's a different issue.

You'll note that despite not being called out individually, all the players quoted in the article clearly got the message.

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 8, 2010 4:46 PM | Report abuse


You'll note that despite not being called out individually, all the players quoted in the article clearly got the message.

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 8, 2010 4:46 PM

Blatche has you convinced that he's ready to give full effort?

Posted by: 2020doc | November 8, 2010 4:50 PM | Report abuse

"He's not that good yet, more likely to turn it over recently than make a play. I'm all for him learning, but RIGHT NOW he's not necessarily better than Gil or KH at a given moment

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 4:46 PM

HA! That's pretty rich, coming from the guy whose first order of business after every game is cataloging the ways in which Hinrich sucks. It's also nonsense.

Wall has had one game this season where he's posted more turnovers than assists. One. Is he going to make mistakes? Sure. He's a rookie. But the offense runs better with him on the floor than on the bench. That's not even an arguable point. (In fact, I believe you yourself have noted that the team is better with Wall at PG than Hinrich during at least one of your many anti-Kirk screeds.) And given this team's inability to play sustained defense, getting the offense to run is a huge necessity, one he's better suited to perform than any other player on the roster.

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 8, 2010 4:55 PM | Report abuse

Right now, keeping Wall on the floor as much as possible is item #1 on the team's "in the best interests of winning" list. That's why Saunders is reluctant to sit Wall. Not because he's "above everyone else" but because their base chance of winning comes with him on the floor with the ball in his hands.

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 8, 2010 4:42 PM | Report abuse

Letting the world know that you will not pull a player, regardless of performance or situation is huge for the player's confidence and overall temperment on the court. However, that being in the best interest of winning is questionable. Furthermore,as much as I like The Great Wall, i haven't seen a player come through this town that was allowed to turn it over an average of 8 times per game and still be held above reproach. Some would question his bb IQ.

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | November 8, 2010 4:55 PM | Report abuse

"I told some of the guys, 'We getting to get a paycheck on the 15th.' For right now, they going a paycheck for nothing."
-Josh Howard

Say what? I usually hate to be critical of someone's grammer but this doesn't make sense. I get the gist of what he's saying but come on Josh....

Lee just transposed "going" and "getting" and forgot, as usual, to proofread.


Posted by: nmik
========================================
Thanks for the translation, now it makes perfect sense.

Posted by: priceisright | November 8, 2010 4:56 PM | Report abuse

"Blatche has you convinced that he's ready to give full effort?"

Posted by: 2020doc | November 8, 2010 4:50 PM

I said he got the message. Whether he actually responds to it is a different issue.

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 8, 2010 4:56 PM | Report abuse

Ole FLipper is a darn bad coach. He's DoubleSwitch Riggleman bad. And now that he's outed Lil Ole Hinrich as his teachers pet, well everything is starting to make sense. Man this is gonna be a long season.
But unlike the other local teams, we may actually have a real owner who is actually watching and knows what to do. Or so we pray.

Posted by: skins_fan_22 | November 8, 2010 5:01 PM | Report abuse

Why does Flip have a job? After how he ruined Detroit he should never work again.

Posted by: Aerowaz | November 8, 2010 5:01 PM | Report abuse


I said he got the message. Whether he actually responds to it is a different issue.

Posted by: kalo_rama

A player failing to do either undermines the team's chances of winning.

Posted by: ArmChairQB | November 8, 2010 5:02 PM | Report abuse

"Furthermore,as much as I like The Great Wall, I haven't seen a player come through this town that was allowed to turn it over an average of 8 times per game and still be held above reproach."

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | November 8, 2010 4:55 PM

You still haven't, because Wall is averaging 5.8 TOs per game on the season, not 8. Is that too much? Sure. But when set against his almost 10 asst., 19 pts, 3 stls, almost 8 trips to the line per game, it's hardly a crippling number. The pluses far, far outweigh the minuses.

"Some would question his bb IQ."

Only really, really stupid people.

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 8, 2010 5:04 PM | Report abuse

"A player failing to do either undermines the team's chances of winning."

Posted by: ArmChairQB | November 8, 2010 5:02 PM

Agreed. So, other than trying to be clever and failing miserably . . . what was your point, exactly?

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 8, 2010 5:06 PM | Report abuse

More proof for my theory: The NBA sucks. It doesn't even pass for mildly entertaining anymore. A bunch of rich boy gangster wannabes who could care less, so why should I? Just once I'd like to watch a game where somebody played some D prior to the 4th or during the playoffs. I wouldn't walk across F St to watch this bunch of overpaid jerks play. I've got a suggestion, next time you have Wiz tix, sell them to some schmuck in front of the Verizon Center and go across the street to the National Portrait gallery instead. You'll have spent your time much more wisely.

Posted by: rcupps | November 8, 2010 5:08 PM | Report abuse

Flip has a right to be upset after losing to a sorry bunch like Cleveland who only has 4 legit NBA players on its roster (Hickson, Williams, Verajao, and Parker). Jamison was in street clothes and they were playing a bunch of journeyman with less talent than the Wiz. No excuses for losing at home to a team that will be lucky to win 25 games this year.

As for Flip, he should shoulder some more responsiblity for why he didn't put Thornton back in the 4th quarter. I realize the Wiz have to showcase Arenas so they can move him, but that no excuse to go with a 3-guard lineup in a close game in the 4th quarter. That was poor coaching, plain and simple. If EG wants to field the most competitive team, no more 3-guard offense unless the other team goes small and play Yi if AB is slacking off. I'd rather see a guy with less talent but who gives a 100% effort the entire time he's in the game.

Posted by: wizfan89 | November 8, 2010 5:09 PM | Report abuse

And given this team's inability to play sustained defense, getting the offense to run is a huge necessity, one he's better suited to perform than any other player on the roster.

I suspect you havent been watching the games.

KH is exactly the player I said he was all summer. I didnt say Hinrich was better than Wall, I said at any given moment Wall isnt necessarily going to be better than Gil or KH. So there's no reason for Flip to act like the team cant function without a 20yr old rookie having the ball in his hands.

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 5:09 PM | Report abuse

Kind of like benching all the starters in that game last season, rather than just AJ.

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 4:21 PM | Report abuse

I don't think he had an issue with JUST AJ. It was all of the starters.
Actually the question is "Why do Armstrong and Yi stay out there despite making the same mistakes while also not contributing anything?"

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 4:23 PM | Report abuse

Mistakes after 3 games and 3 years aren't actually the same.

Furthermore,as much as I like The Great Wall, i haven't seen a player come through this town that was allowed to turn it over an average of 8 times per game and still be held above reproach. Some would question his bb IQ.

Turnovers aren't all about IQ. He is very aware of what's happening on the court. IQ that gets thrown around for Nick and McGee is completely different than turning the ball over.

Once again...3 years...versus 5 games.

Posted by: SDMDTSU | November 8, 2010 5:10 PM | Report abuse

BTW Yi is looking more and more like the 2nd coming of Pecherov. Another wasted 7-footer who wants nothing to do with the post and just wants to heave up 3s. Just what you need. He and Hinrich are looking more and more like huge busts.
Who put together this team?

Posted by: skins_fan_22 | November 8, 2010 5:15 PM | Report abuse

Flip should have called out the guys who were half-assing it and demanded more from them. I don't like this passive-aggressive approach from the head coach of a young team.
Posted by: artiesliver

Tough to say that since we don't know what he said during practice. The report only says that he walked out during practice. He might have been yelling, cajoling and demanding more for a half an hour, and not getting it, he stormed out. We don't know.

Either way, personally, I would have gone a different way, and kicked the players off the court, not stormed off of it.

Lollygaggers!
Posted by: bryc3

Exactly what I was thinking, lol. Now he just needs to throw the bats into the shower.

Posted by: ts35 | November 8, 2010 5:19 PM | Report abuse

Once again...3 years...versus 5 games.

So this is Hilton's 5th game in the nba? funny, i could have sworn he's 25yrs old and in his 4th year in the league after playing full 4yrs in college.

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 5:19 PM | Report abuse

"Flip has a right to be upset after losing to a sorry bunch like Cleveland who only has 4 legit NBA players on its roster (Hickson, Williams, Verajao, and Parker)."

Cleveland was definitely a winnable game, but that doesn't mean they're a bad team. They're just a lot worse than they were the past two seasons, when they were part of the winningest regular season club in the NBA. They probably won't make the playoffs this year, but they play pretty well together, and they're certainly capable of beating a club that has experienced the sort of turnover that Washington has.

My guess: Flip was upset by the crappy effort he saw in practice, and made his point by stalking out, followed by the coaching staff. If that inspires some players to greater effort, then good.

Posted by: Samson151 | November 8, 2010 5:22 PM | Report abuse

Tough to say that since we don't know what he said during practice. The report only says that he walked out during practice. He might have been yelling, cajoling and demanding more for a half an hour, and not getting it, he stormed out. We don't know.

Either way, personally, I would have gone a different way, and kicked the players off the court, not stormed off of it.

Sounds like the issue wasnt effort at practice so much as a lousy attitude from the players, whining about call and bickering with each other more than practicing. Or at least that's what AB took it upon himself to tell the media

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 5:22 PM | Report abuse

Not sure how Saunders conducts practice but for about a month I would allocate 80% of the practice to defense-this is the only thing that will get this team going. All these players know how to shoot, etc. but they need to focus on the one aspect of the game that they probably put as a low priority for most of their life. From defense comes offense and the coach needs to throw away the fancy play book and reward defensive performance. Sure they need points but maybe they need stops more. Many of these players need to be retrained to provide the effort and use proper positioning to play what amounts to over 1/2 the game-defense. The players that work the hardest on defense should start for the next month not the supposed gifted ones.

Posted by: hlwalton | November 8, 2010 5:24 PM | Report abuse

"KH is exactly the player I said he was all summer. I didnt say Hinrich was better than Wall, I said at any given moment Wall isnt necessarily going to be better than Gil or KH. So there's no reason for Flip to act like the team cant function without a 20yr old rookie having the ball in his hands.Posted by: divi"

I'd say that KH is not in fact the player you think he is, or that you've been saying he is all summer. He's a limited athlete who happens to be much better than you give him credit for.

But it's a free country, and there's law that says we have to make sense. So rant away.

Posted by: Samson151 | November 8, 2010 5:28 PM | Report abuse

""So your theory is that Flip sucked until he had more than one good player? Pretty sure that describes every coach in the NBA.

Posted by: ts35

Flip Flop sucked against the knicks who only had one good player. The cavs had no good players and a new coach, and Flip Flop still sucked also. Flip Flop seems more like a rookie coach instead of one who's 6th on the win list.

Posted by: DC_MAN88

Well, that wasn't really your argument was it? We were talking about Flip with the T-Wolves. But if you feel you've lost the first argument (and you have) and want to move to another, by all means..."

No, that's your theory. Don't make points just to argue with yourself.

My point is that Flip Flop sucks as a coach period.

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | November 8, 2010 5:30 PM | Report abuse

Said Saunders: "It was a tough situation. If we had won the game, it would've been great playing them. We didn't win it, and I question myself. I questioned myself the last three minutes, not having Al in there."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/11/06/AR2010110604362_2.html?sid=ST2010110605033

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | November 8, 2010 5:32 PM | Report abuse

Sorry, I mean there's NO law that says we have to make sense. So you're legally protected.

Posted by: Samson151 | November 8, 2010 5:34 PM | Report abuse

i could agree that flip is not the right coach for this particular team....i wouldn't say he's a bad coach overall. the issue is the lack self-motivation from the majority of the players. at least the ones being looked upon this year to contribute. it's all about attitude and changing the mentality of paycheck regardless of effort. playing time should be the carrot. effort players get the time, lackadaisical players get the bench....it hasn't worked with young because he still hasn't figured that part out yet. practice is where you impress the coaches.

Posted by: joerutgens72 | November 8, 2010 5:37 PM | Report abuse

There's been some discussion about who would be a good coach for this version of the Wiz, and I've been giving it some thought. The best candidate has to be: Red Auerbach. In the first place, a local boy. Also somebody with an impeccable coaching record -- if anybody can coach'em up, it would be Red. And perhaps most important, he's likely to let Javale McGee and Gilbert Arenas play all 48 minutes of every game, since he's not able to call time out for a substitution.

Posted by: Samson151 | November 8, 2010 5:38 PM | Report abuse

I'd say that KH is not in fact the player you think he is, or that you've been saying he is all summer.

I said he's not worth $9mill (he isnt), is not the defender many here thought (obvious now) and that he doesnt score well enough to play SG (he doesnt). And that he's a heady vet (he is).

He's a limited athlete who happens to be much better than you give him credit for.

Look at his PER, he's been below avg for several years. Every year since his contract year in fact. It is what it is, nonsense talk about "glue" notwithstanding of course.

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 5:38 PM | Report abuse

FIRE SHANAHAN! TRADE DONOVAN! Oops, sorry, wrong blog!

Posted by: JohnWWW | November 8, 2010 5:44 PM | Report abuse

Ask yourself, could you see little Avery Johnson or Bill Laimbeer walking-out of practice in a hissy-fit? Flip once-again threw gasoline on a fire, this will be headlines and HE handled the situation poorly.

Posted by: closg | November 8, 2010 5:51 PM | Report abuse

So this is Hilton's 5th game in the nba? funny, i could have sworn he's 25yrs old and in his 4th year in the league after playing full 4yrs in college.

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 5:19 PM | Report abuse

5th game in this system genius. Do you actually make effort not to make sense?

Posted by: SDMDTSU | November 8, 2010 5:51 PM | Report abuse

Kalo rama got it right the first time. Let's face it, we've got one spectacular rookie and a bunch of journeymen and guys who might be consistently good if they worked at it. But Flip I don't know, there's a big disconnect. I wonder if Blatche, talking about guys needing to earn their paycheck and start practicing hard, knew that he didn't make Flip's short list of hard workers. So something isn't connecting between the coach and the players, Blatche seemed to think that he wasn't part of the problem. It's going to a long year either way, but it would be a better one if the Wizards can at least give everything they've got. They need to get someone else besides Wall out of this season who really shows something, game in game out. Either that or hope we get a top 3 lottery pick next year. As for Saunders, give him this season, but I'm not expecting too much if the players aren't buying into his style.

Posted by: curtb | November 8, 2010 5:54 PM | Report abuse

5th game in this system genius. Do you actually make effort not to make sense?

So Flip is running the same system Eddie and ETaps had been teaching Javale his first 2 seasons? Sorry for my lack of intelligence, I'm just having trouble understanding why HAs mistakes are excusable and Mcgee's are not. Didnt realize that Armstrong's previous system called for fouling PGs 30ft from the basket.

(ok, i'm being a dbag)

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 5:57 PM | Report abuse

You have bench-warmers that you can use to send a message even if you aren't happy with your players efforts, perhaps someone riding the pine might surprise you.


Posted by: closg | November 8, 2010 2:56 PM | Report abuse

Yeah, that worked great in the last game. Just ask McGEE and THORNTON.

Posted by: glawrence007 | November 8, 2010 6:01 PM | Report abuse

I'm just having trouble understanding why HAs mistakes are excusable and Mcgee's are not. Didnt realize that Armstrong's previous system called for fouling PGs 30ft from the basket.

(ok, i'm being a dbag)

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 5:57 PM | Report abuse

It's ARENAS. He and his subalterans are successfully undermining FLIP's B-Ball EUTOPIA.

Posted by: glawrence007 | November 8, 2010 6:05 PM | Report abuse

Trade Gilbert the Bum and things will improve.

Posted by: interactingdc | November 8, 2010 6:06 PM | Report abuse

"i could agree that flip is not the right coach for this particular team....i wouldn't say he's a bad coach overall. the issue is the lack self-motivation from the majority of the players. at least the ones being looked upon this year to contribute. it's all about attitude and changing the mentality of paycheck regardless of effort. playing time should be the carrot. effort players get the time, lackadaisical players get the bench....it hasn't worked with young because he still hasn't figured that part out yet. practice is where you impress the coaches.

Posted by: joerutgens72 | November 8, 2010 5:37 PM | Report abuse "

Forget Flip, Grunfeld is not the right GM for this team!

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | November 8, 2010 6:08 PM | Report abuse

SAUNDERS wants out of this f*****-up organization. If I were TED, I'd let him.

Posted by: glawrence007 | November 8, 2010 6:09 PM | Report abuse

Well EG and FS are both auditioning for a job. Obviously, a few of the players will be pleased when they are gone.........those who believe in no accountability, and who believe the players run the league. But be warned, careful what you ask for, you just might get it.

Posted by: glawrence007 | November 8, 2010 6:15 PM | Report abuse

i would imagine that leonsis has a plan in mind for the franchise. this year for him is probably a feeling out process of nba ownership. it took him a minute to get the nhl down. i suspect there will be lots of changes going into next season(if there is one), building a foundation, then adding players that fit together with new coach and gm, not of course in that order. i would say wall is the only definite for next season, and maybe mcgee. everybody else, who knows. he can't like what he see's from this group of players.

Posted by: joerutgens72 | November 8, 2010 6:26 PM | Report abuse


"Agreed. So, other than trying to be clever and failing miserably . . . what was your point, exactly?"

Posted by: kalo_rama

That Blatche as been "receiving" the message for years.

Posted by: ArmChairQB | November 8, 2010 6:34 PM | Report abuse

I love how everybody is jumping on flip. You can debate whether you think it was appropriate or not--I think it could be a fine response knowing as little as we know--but it distracts from the fact that our team is slacking. Focus on the real problem people.

Also. Josh Howard is really leading with his chin. I'll be interested to see if he delivers. I think--and hope-- he will

Posted by: crs-one | November 8, 2010 6:34 PM | Report abuse

has been

Posted by: ArmChairQB | November 8, 2010 6:35 PM | Report abuse

My reading of the story is that he wasn't esp. satisfied with anyone's performance in practice. He noted 3 guys who he thought came in with the right attitude. Should he have called out each of the other 12 by name? What would that have accomplished?

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 8, 2010 4:36 PM | Report abuse

Make them personally accountable for ther actions?

Posted by: lilhollywood10 | November 8, 2010 4:41 PM | Report abuse

He doesn't need to, nor should he, do that through the media.

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Posted by: goodlucky30 | November 8, 2010 6:48 PM | Report abuse

It should be noted that Nick Young walked out with Blatche, and when Blatche stepped in front of the camera and said "I want to talk," Nick Young states behind him, "Oh, I got a lot to talk about." Bullets Forever

Not a good time to be mouthing off, Nick.

Posted by: djnnnou | November 8, 2010 6:55 PM | Report abuse

This team has too many damn knuckleheads (i.e. Blatche, Young, McGee, etc). Need to cut bait with these guys and get players who have a brain.

Posted by: Roman5 | November 8, 2010 6:55 PM | Report abuse

Apples and oranges. Effort and execution are two different things.

Posted by: ArmChairQB | November 8, 2010 3:42 PM | Report abuse

I'd like to know where the effort was on that missed FT rebound that lead directly to PARKER dropping a three on us and the lead change. I didn't see any and I watched the play twice live and on rerun. JaVALE had his head up his ass.

Posted by: glawrence007 | November 8, 2010 6:56 PM | Report abuse

Flip has lost the team, if he ever truly had it. He's a well-meaning, hard-working dedicated guy, but he lacks the charisma to inspire players and the gravitas to scare them. I like that he tried to motivate them today, but the fact that he had to resort to grade school teacher tactics shows how immature the players are and how desperate Flip has become. We need someone in the Byron Scott/Phil Jackson/Pat Riley mode, a stretch for a cursed franchise such as ours, but possible if Leonsis truly takes the reins and outlines vision, dedication and and acumen in building a contender. We also need hungry, mature players. Among Blatche, Mcghee, Young, Arenas, at least two have to go. They are part of a losing culture of immaturity and softness we've had several years now, and they risk influencing the one sure building block we have: Wall. We're stuck with Gil, but I think losing Young and either Blatche or Mcghee, would tilt the culture of the realm of professionalism. With the exception of Mcghee's lone defensive skill: shot blocking - all are soft on the D-end. Offensively, none of them has shown an inclination for patience, ball movement, intelligence or team concept, erasing all coaching strategic options. You simply can not win with that many key rotational players lacking court smarts, effort and maturity. Grunfeld, ultimately, is responsible for assembling this team and should bear consequence for its failures. He should have a long time ago, actually, his only crowning accomplishment being able able to hold on to it so long after assembling such a poor product.

Posted by: SammyT1 | November 8, 2010 7:05 PM | Report abuse

I'm getting a sense that Flip is about to lose control of this team. Rumor has it that is what happened in Detroit when he took over after Larry Brown won it all in 2004.

We don't know what's going on, but when players are unhappy with the coach, they generally know how to collude to get him fired. Of course, I obviously don't know whether that is the case, and the fact that JH and AB spoke up in defense of the coaching staff is a positive, but it will be very interesting to observe this team over the next five games or so.

Posted by: bpybay | November 8, 2010 7:12 PM | Report abuse

The Wizards are very lazy and slothful and one of the worst teams in the NBA.Why anyone would waste money seeing garbage like this is beyond me other than seeing the other teams the Wizards play.

Posted by: chuckcoley | November 8, 2010 7:32 PM | Report abuse

"Look at his PER, he's been below avg for several years. Every year since his contract year in fact. It is what it is, nonsense talk about "glue" notwithstanding of course.
Posted by: divi3"

Actually, looking at his PER is pretty close to nonsense.

Posted by: Samson151 | November 8, 2010 7:41 PM | Report abuse

"I'm getting a sense that Flip is about to lose control of this team. Rumor has it that is what happened in Detroit when he took over after Larry Brown won it all in 2004. We don't know what's going on, but when players are unhappy with the coach, they generally know how to collude to get him fired. Of course, I obviously don't know whether that is the case, and the fact that JH and AB spoke up in defense of the coaching staff is a positive, but it will be very interesting to observe this team over the next five games or so.Posted by: bpybay"

I was just wondering, is there only the one fact in the above post (about players speaking up in support of the post)? Because I didn't see any others.

Innuendo, gossip, personal opinion, sure.

Posted by: Samson151 | November 8, 2010 7:46 PM | Report abuse

Sorry, that should read 'players speaking up in support of the coach'.

Posted by: Samson151 | November 8, 2010 7:48 PM | Report abuse

How about a practice without basketball balls and focus only on defense, because the team can't seem to play any.

Posted by: cwhiteco | November 8, 2010 7:48 PM | Report abuse

Poor Flipper. The player are starting to realize how stupid he is. Players know who can play and they see captain Kirk getting burnt on a regular. How is this guy keeping his job. His sub pattern is the worst. Ted get a coach the players can respect. Flipper hope you spent your money wisely because you will not get another job.

Posted by: rnbrown4 | November 8, 2010 8:14 PM | Report abuse

I think storming out works if you have a mature team. A team that can be shamed into giving better effort. When you have a young team like we do, am not so sure storming out will work. Sure everybody is saying the rights things...but the proof will be in the effort given on Wednesday.

Posted by: tundey | November 8, 2010 8:34 PM | Report abuse

First, there is nothing passive aggressive about making millionaire athletes adjust their schedules to attend a second practice later on in the day.

NY is the player that should be cut immediately. He is a lost cause. I hate watching him saunter up and down the court as if he were in a YMCA rec league and it's not bc he is making if look effortless. He is just giving no effort. He would be working at McDonald's with his 2 cent brain and work habits if he didn't have NBA level talent.

The rest of them have to decide what they want to be. Michael Wilbon was right...can't have this many knuckleheads on one team bc they will play like it. Their execution level is pathetic and it starts with guys like Blatche, McGee, and NY.

Posted by: rphilli721 | November 8, 2010 8:42 PM | Report abuse

And as Flip walks out of the gym, all the players collectively ask 'what the frick is wrong with that crybaby?'

Posted by: DC_MAN88 | November 8, 2010 10:07 PM | Report abuse

Josh Howard is a bad person and a horrible American. That is all.

Posted by: Max_in_Missouri | November 9, 2010 12:26 AM | Report abuse

DeJuan Blair would look great on this squad.

Posted by: m1ke3i6 | November 8, 2010 3:42 PM | Report abuse@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ Dejuan Blair, Dejuan Wagner, Deblair witch project......

Posted by: Mikereese23 | November 9, 2010 2:50 PM | Report abuse

"KH is exactly the player I said he was all summer. I didnt say Hinrich was better than Wall, I said at any given moment Wall isnt necessarily going to be better than Gil or KH. So there's no reason for Flip to act like the team cant function without a 20yr old rookie having the ball in his hands."

Posted by: divi3 | November 8, 2010 5:09 PM

You're so full of crap your breath must be brown.

Just a few days ago you came in here and said that Hinrich needed to sit because he brought "nothing" on the court. That was the word you used: "nothing." You maligned his scoring, his defense, and his playmaking (noting, after one game that the team, fell apart when Hinrich was running the point). You denigrated him in every possible way as a player. But now, all of a sudden, they're better with him on the floor than Wall?

Please.

We get it. You hate Flip and are genetically predisposed to jump on any opportunity to take a shot at him. But at least try not to make yourself look like a hypocritical buffoon in the process. Or, at the very least, try to keep your various lines of bull straight.

Posted by: kalo_rama | November 9, 2010 7:31 PM | Report abuse

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