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Posted at 1:17 AM ET, 01/16/2011

Yi Jianlian dunks, Nick Young scores and the Wizards beat another bad team at home

By Michael Lee

Okay, John, after you teach me how to Dougie, I might have to steal that move from Yi for the dunk contest. (Photo by Jonathan Newton/The Washington Post)


Yi Jianlian leaped in front of Toronto Raptors center Andrea Bargnani to intercept a pass from Sundiata Gaines in the fourth quarter of the Wizards' 98-95 win, lowered his head and immediately started dribbling up the floor.

"When he got it, I was wondering what he was going to do," John Wall said.

Wall wasn't the only one. Yi isn't known for his ball-handling or his speed, especially as he works his way back from his sprained right knee, so Wall's immediate concern was whether Yi would travel -- "Euro step," as he put it -- or commit an offensive foul by dribbling out of control. Even Yi probably didn't know what he would do.

But with each dribble, no Raptors player stepped in front of him to stop the ball. So, Yi kept going and didn't stop until he split Bargnani and Julian Wright for a two-handed dunk.

The fans at Verizon Center shouted, "Yiiii!!!!!" They could've easy asked, "Did that just happen?"

The whole play looked like it was in slow motion, with Associated Press writer Joseph White saying, "Some people go coast-to-coast on a jet plane, Yi takes a bicycle."

Asked after the game if he had ever dribbled the length of the floor for a dunk, Yi said, "Probably first time, bring the ball all the way down. Oh, it feel great. I got the ball and I didn't see anybody in front of me. I went full speed, go to basket, finished strong."

However it went down, it was the kind of play that usually goes in favor of the Wizards at home. If they have established anything at this point, it's that they can beat bad teams in this building. They improved to 11-8 at home, with all of those wins coming against teams that arrived in Washington with losing records.

Nick Young again proved to be a prolific scorer at Verizon Center, as he scored a game-high 29 points despite a sore left knee. Young was incredibly streaky, missing his first six shots and later making eight in a row. Coach Flip Saunders aptly describes Young as a "bad-shot-maker," meaning that he has a degree-of-difficulty on his jumpers. Toronto coach Jay Triano basically concurred. "I don't know how much I can fault our guys. I don't think that he had many open looks," Triano said. "There were guys right there, and he made some tough shots."


Oh, I can pass too now. (Photo by Jonathan Newton/The Washington Post)

Since Young was placed in the starting lineup after the Gilbert Arenas trade, he is averaging 20 points in 14 games, with a tremendous spike in production at home. In Young's eight home starts, the Wizards are 5-3, with Young averaging 26.3 points. "Right now he's got an unbelievable comfort level as far as at home," Saunders said of Young. "We've got to get him to bring that killer instinct offensively on the road."

How comfortable is Young at home compared to the road? He scored 18 in the third quarter for the second straight game at home. He has only topped 18 points once in six starts, all losses, and he is averaging just 13.2.

Young started out slowly, but was doing a decent job of making plays for others, as he handed out four assists, one short of his career high, and also grabbed six rebounds. He added that his assists numbers improved because he is motivated to join JaVale McGee in the slam dunk competition in his hometown of Los Angeles. "JaVale said he needed a partner in the dunk contest, I'm giving him gifts or whatever he need. Dunk here, lob here, I'm his man," Young said. "I just need my face on TV a little bit."

Wall had nine assists but scored just eight points, as he struggled to make shots, going 4 for 14 from the floor. He also struggled in his individual matchup against Jose Calderon, who almost had a triple-double with 21 points, 15 assists and nine rebounds. Saunders pulled Wall in the closing seconds, electing to go with Kirk Hinrich to defend Calderon for the final 20 seconds, but said he thought his rookie played well.

"He made a big shot late when it was a four point game," Saunders said. "When Nick got hot, he got us into plays and got Nick the ball for shots, which is good. I thought it was a steady overall performance."

Wall is obviously playing hurt. He's still faster than most, but you can tell that he's lacking that fifth or sixth gear that left opponents clumsily backpedaling. His speed used to mask some of his mistakes defensively, but he's struggling, especially with his confidence. He's shooting jumpers as if he's begging them to fall, instead of expecting them to fall.

The Timberwolves were sagging so far off him in Minnesota, basically daring him to shoot and he passed on those looks. After the game, Wall said he is still experiencing soreness in his right knee, where had a bone bruise, and recently experienced a floor burn on his left hand that affects his ability guide the ball on his shot.

In Wall's defense, he's also a rookie who just played his 38th NBA game. He played 38 games last season at Kentucky.

The Wizards were able to overcome the Raptors with Andray Blatche returning from his sprained right shoulder to grab 17 points and 13 rebounds on the night that fans received his bobblehead doll. But there were also some subtle contributions that were instrumental. Rashard Lewis was extremely clutch in the second half, when he made all three of his three-pointers, including a long-range jumper that extended a one-point lead to 86-82 midway in the fourth.

Al Thornton provided a lift off the bench in the first half, as he scored all nine of his points and was 4 for 4. He had a beautiful bounce pass, through four Raptors defenders, to Blatche for a layup, and came soaring down the lane to rebound a Lewis miss for a two-hand dunk that gave them a 47-42 lead at the break.

"It feels good when you can come out there and be a part of the team, to help the team to the win. It feels good," said Thornton, who will likely be looked upon to do more with Josh Howard expected to miss at least another week with his sore left knee.

Saunders said, "I thought our bench, in particular, Yi and Al were exceptional."

Yi is slowly starting to regain his rhythm after having his season interrupted by two injuries in the same knee. He came off the bench to score 10 points -- his first double-digit scoring game since Dec. 5 in Phoenix. He has scored 18 combined points in his past two games and was perfect from the floor against Toronto, going 5 for 5 from the field. But after the game, his teammates were talking that end-to-end dunk.

"I swear, I seen Yi in practice. Yi has a great set of skills," Blatche said, smiling. "I said, 'Okay, China man!' I'm just proud of him."

Wall said he was also impressed with Yi's ability to finish on the break. "I never seen it. He showed some flashes of JaVale."

By Michael Lee  | January 16, 2011; 1:17 AM ET
Categories:  Al Thornton, Andray Blatche, Flip Saunders, JaVale McGee, John Wall, Nick Young, Rashard Lewis, Yi Jianlian  
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Next: Josh Howard to visit specialist for left knee

Comments

FIRST they need to learn how to win away from home. I'm glad they won but they give me some much stress how they play sometimes. Practice that J John ALOT!

Posted by: bullwiz81 | January 16, 2011 1:41 AM | Report abuse

FIRST they need to learn how to win away from home. I'm glad they won but they give me some much stress how they play sometimes. Practice that J John ALOT!

Posted by: bullwiz81 | January 16, 2011 1:41 AM | Report abuse

"I swear, I seen Yi in practice. Yi has a great set of skills," Blatche said, smiling. "I said, 'Okay, China man!' I'm just proud of him."


..."Chinaman"? C'mon man...!

Posted by: Janitor_with_a_Jumpshot | January 16, 2011 6:56 AM | Report abuse

C'mon, Wall is hurting, bring in a 3d pg to give him and Heinrich some rest.

Posted by: PostSubscriber | January 16, 2011 8:15 AM | Report abuse

..."Chinaman"? C'mon man...!

Posted by: Janitor_with_a_Jumpshot | January 16, 2011 6:56 AM

He obviously has no clue, but my question is, why did Mr. Lee print it?

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | January 16, 2011 8:48 AM | Report abuse

@Michael Lee: "Wall is obviously playing hurt." Please. No excuses. Is he sore? Maybe. Suck it up, kid; this is the NBA. You've got teammates who are playing through multiple injuries, and NO ONE is making excuses for them; in fact, no one will even cut them any slack. Fact is, we don't know that Wall is still hurt. What we do know is Wall looks soft and is "obviously playing" out of control. (No offense; no defense.) Opposing point guards must salivate at the chance to play against him. What are they averaging collectively? Thirty points a game? Wiz won last night because Wall's azz was on the bench at the end of the fourth quarter. How many games Flip gave away because he trusted Wall.

On another note: is the honeymoon over? Looks like Flip and the "rookie phenom" frequently are having words. Word to the wise, Johnny. Pouting's not becoming.

Posted by: Fief1 | January 16, 2011 8:55 AM | Report abuse

"In Wall's defense, he's also a rookie who just played his 38th NBA game."

27 games. 21 starts.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 9:01 AM | Report abuse

"..."Chinaman"? C'mon man...!"

Lee transcribed it as 'China man.'

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 9:05 AM | Report abuse

Good game! Dray came to play! Serious, maybe not his best numbers but I think that was the best he has played all season. He was aggresive on the boards, defended, and attacked the basket offensively.

NY & Al Thornton played good. Flip I liked the rotation Wall, NY, Lewis, Dray, Mcgee starting w/ Hinrich, Thornton, Yi off the bench.

Keep it up! Let's start gettin some wins!! And do it on the road! It's mid Jan, this is when I said it would start comin together.

Posted by: Darnell1 | January 16, 2011 9:07 AM | Report abuse

Good game! Dray came to play! Serious, maybe not his best numbers but I think that was the best he has played all season. He was aggresive on the boards, defended, and attacked the basket offensively.

NY & Al Thornton played good. Flip I liked the rotation Wall, NY, Lewis, Dray, Mcgee starting w/ Hinrich, Thornton, Yi off the bench.

Keep it up! Let's start gettin some wins!! And do it on the road! It's mid Jan, this is when I said it would start comin together.

Posted by: Darnell1 | January 16, 2011 9:08 AM | Report abuse

C'mon, Wall is hurting, bring in a 3d pg to give him and Heinrich some rest.

Posted by: PostSubscriber | January 16, 2011 8:15 AM

Third point guard?

I railed and railed about the third point guard all doing the offseason. I implicated to no end why it would have been smart for the Wizards to have done everything within their power to resign a certain point guard.

I said it would have been smart for them to do so and it would be the kind of thing that good teams with vision and tradition would have done.

But no, I was given the 133 degreee of reasons why it couldn't be done. Butchasee, my point was based upon ability on the floor that this point guard would prove himselp to be the first option off the bench after the annoited John Wall.

I also pointed out that the Wizards had predetermined that this point guard could not help them and said that this wasn't what winners do. Winners let the players determine on the court who plays.

And now, after they knew they were moving Gilbert and had no intention of going with a Wall/Gilbert strategy/combo at all, but preditermined that Hinrich would be the man to fill the void, it now further illustrates the lack of vision and still utter foolishness of management not having the proper vision for this Team.

That point guard that this team should have resigned and he would have added much needed balance, besides the weighted scale of Kirk Hinrich was one Sean Livingston.

Sean Livingston, I knew, from an on the court perspective was a good option to have on the team. But too often, other priorties get in the way of making good sound basketball decisions.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | January 16, 2011 9:10 AM | Report abuse

The real question IMO before the season was how Wall would react to all the losing that was bound to follow. The Wiz just didn't have the horses for a decent season, and anybody with a clear sensorium could see that. Our main hope for Wall should have been that he wouldn't go down early and miss a year the way Griffin did. We knew that playing heavy minutes for the Wiz would be a mental and physical strain for the rookie. So far I think he's done OK. Teams have adjusted to his speed, and he's made a few adjustments himself. Compared to most of the other top rookies this season, he's doing just fine.

Speaking of that, Ed Davis missed a bunch of games at season's start for Toronto but looks to have come around.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 9:13 AM | Report abuse

"Third point guard?" [Insert rant by LarryInClintonMD"

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 9:16 AM | Report abuse

And the thing that is so mind blowing, is that the Wizards preditermened that Kirk Hinrich would be the best influence/mentor for John Wall, but in reality on the floor, I kinda feel that Sean Livinston would have been a tremendous compliment and mentor for the one John Wall.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | January 16, 2011 9:18 AM | Report abuse

If Blatche said of Kevin Seraphin, "Come on, French Guiana-man!" nobody would be upset. Yi is actually from China, and I doubt Andray Blatche has any inkling that the words he used were once considered a racial slur.

I'm not excusing racism by any means. Just pointing out that Andray Blatche is far too stupid to realize what he said could be construed as racist.

Posted by: bryc3 | January 16, 2011 9:18 AM | Report abuse

I agree with Darnell--AB played very well. He got good shots off (close to the rim and in flow), but they were just dimming out. Perhaps it should be AB bobble head night every night.

Young and particularly Wall need more rest. Resign Hudson and actually play him 8-15 minutes per game. Rested players reduces the wear and tear of the season and makes guys fresher in the fourth. Also, Booker should be playing more for his development plus to bring some energy off the bench. An 8 man rotation is not sustainable!

Posted by: audacitea | January 16, 2011 9:20 AM | Report abuse

audacitea, yeah I liked the rotation in this game.... work in a little Booker and you got it Flip!

Posted by: Darnell1 | January 16, 2011 9:27 AM | Report abuse

I wanted to keep Livingston too. I think he chose to leave though. After the wall pick & hinrich trade, plus arenas he felt he'd get no pt. He'd be perfect for this team now.

Posted by: Darnell1 | January 16, 2011 9:33 AM | Report abuse

"Just pointing out that Andray Blatche is far too stupid to realize what he said could be construed as racist.Posted by: bryc3"

Somehow I don't think that's a compliment.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 9:33 AM | Report abuse

"And the thing that is so mind blowing, is that the Wizards preditermened that Kirk Hinrich would be the best influence/mentor for John Wall, but in reality on the floor, I kinda feel that Sean Livinston would have been a tremendous compliment and mentor for the one John Wall.LarryInClintonMD.Posted by: LarryInClintonMD

What's mind-blowing is that you're still so bent out of shape over this.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 9:35 AM | Report abuse

Kevin Seraphin - ROY - LOL

Posted by: member8 | January 16, 2011 9:38 AM | Report abuse

That point guard that this team should have resigned and he would have added much needed balance, besides the weighted scale of Kirk Hinrich was one Sean Livingston.

Sean Livingston, I knew, from an on the court perspective was a good option to have on the team. But too often, other priorties get in the way of making good sound basketball decisions.

LarryInClintonMD.

Excellent point. Shaun Livingston length and ball handling skills would greatly compliment the Wall/Heinrich/Young backcourt.

Only problem was the Wizards had Randy Foye, Quinton Ross, Nick Young, Earl Boykins and Gilbert on the 2009-2010 roster in addition to Shaun Livingston.

I believe that he went with the Bobcats because they offered him a 2-year $7 million deal.

Posted by: musicmanjr | January 16, 2011 9:42 AM | Report abuse

IMO
The wizards do need a 3rd PG, but not hudson. They need someone to come in and not turn the ball over. In his few stints with the team, The offense never jelled with hudson. I also think the wizards made a mistaking declaring John wall the savior of this team and handing him the keys to the team. I agree that he is a talented kid, but He seems like his game is mirrored towards more Rondo than a Chris Paul or Deron Williams or Derrick Rose. I think they need to take the pressure off the kid and maybe have him coming off the bench and learning the game while watching others play. It would be nice to have Mcgee play some power forward. He could be our version of Blake Griffin and a match up terror. He also has a decent shot and terrific shot blocking skills. He would be a matchup terror. You could find a 7 foot non shooting center anywhere to take up space.

Posted by: specialg7master | January 16, 2011 9:48 AM | Report abuse

"[McGee] also has a decent shot"

He does?

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 10:00 AM | Report abuse

Excellent point. Shaun Livingston length and ball handling skills would greatly compliment the Wall/Heinrich/Young backcourt.

Only problem was the Wizards had Randy Foye, Quinton Ross, Nick Young, Earl Boykins and Gilbert on the 2009-2010 roster in addition to Shaun Livingston.

I believe that he went with the Bobcats because they offered him a 2-year $7 million deal.

Posted by: musicmanjr | January 16, 2011 9:42 AM

Good point as well. But this is where vision comes in. If you really sit back and analyze the situation then, you would still have to surmise that Livingston still was the best of the group to be the first guard off the bench.

Basketball vision is what makes winners and losers out of teams. The Wizards as I said then exercised no vision in their decision referencing Livingston.

They could have offered the money to Livingston, but instead they chose to make their decision based upon all the wrong reasons, not one of them being on the court play and need for the team going forward.

We now know they weren't going to keep Arenas and they took the TBD option, 'The Hinrich Deal, which I believe will pan out to be a failed deal.

As I kept saying and saying and saying, they did not place enough value on Livingston. They felt that his value was not worth making him an offer that he would have accepted.

Enough of this baloney about Livingston chose Charlotte. Yeah, hell yeah he did, but only after the Wizards showed to him that we did not or was wavering on resigning him to the Team for eventual Bobcat money. There were eons of comments here that the Wizards should not pay him/offer him that kind of deal.

In hindsight now, if we had offered him 2yrs at $8m, would he have reconsidered and if he had, it would have been worth it. Especially, in the light of fact that we knew we possibly were not going to keep Gilbert.

And I knew back then that Kirk Hinrich wasn't the answer, the the wisdom/vision of the Wiz organization thought he was, though.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | January 16, 2011 10:10 AM | Report abuse

"And the thing that is so mind blowing, is that the Wizards preditermened that Kirk Hinrich would be the best influence/mentor for John Wall, but in reality on the floor, I kinda feel that Sean Livinston would have been a tremendous compliment and mentor for the one John Wall.LarryInClintonMD.Posted by: LarryInClintonMD

What's mind-blowing is that you're still so bent out of shape over this.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 9:35 AM

Bent out of shape would not be an accurate description. More like being right about something would.

But you do a good job of waving your banners and I will keep doing a good job of waving mines, good fellow.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | January 16, 2011 10:15 AM | Report abuse

We now know they weren't going to keep Arenas . . .
Posted by: LarryInClintonMD

We may now that they hoped they wouldn't keep Arenas, but there's no way they could possibly have known that they'd be able to unload him.

That they were able to trade him when they did has to rank as the biggest surprise of the season to date.

Posted by: nmik | January 16, 2011 10:20 AM | Report abuse

The ball handling skills that Livingston displayed here in smoothly moving the offense down the floor last year are the type of skills that John Wall needs to add to his game. It might have been great for Wall to learn those skills from Livingston first hand.

Pray tell, WHAT BALL HANDLING SKILLS IS JOHN WALL LEARNING FROM KIRK HINRICH IN MOVING THE BALL/OFFENSE DOWN THE COURT???

And nobody can tell me that a $9m 2yr investment in Livingston would not have been a much better deal that the $19m 2yr deal that we took on Hinrich, even minus $3m, but add back Seraphin money.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | January 16, 2011 10:33 AM | Report abuse

"Bent out of shape would not be an accurate description. More like being right about something would."posted by LarryInClintonMD

No, Larry, you're bent out of shape. You have a resentment. Somebody who was merely correct doesn't need to rant like that.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 10:35 AM | Report abuse

We now know they weren't going to keep Arenas . . .
Posted by: LarryInClintonMD

We may now that they hoped they wouldn't keep Arenas, but there's no way they could possibly have known that they'd be able to unload him.

That they were able to trade him when they did has to rank as the biggest surprise of the season to date.

Posted by: nmik | January 16, 2011 10:20 AM

Very good point. Very good point, indeed.

It is also why vision, good vision/forethought can be huge.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | January 16, 2011 10:38 AM | Report abuse

"We may know that they hoped they wouldn't keep Arenas, but there's no way they could possibly have known that they'd be able to unload him.That they were able to trade him when they did has to rank as the biggest surprise of the season to date.Posted by: nmik"

It certainly surprised me. I figured they were stuck with him. As it was, they had to take on R. Lewis' contract, which wasn't all that much of an improvement except for its length. We probably owe it to Otis Smith and to the Magic's unexpected losing streak immediately leading up to the swap.

Lewis has been a pleasant surprise, and Arenas seems happy in Orlando, so in that sense it all worked out. I doubt Rashard will finish his career in Washington, and if Smith leaves Orlando, I imagine Gil's tenure won't be long, either.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 10:39 AM | Report abuse

"Pray tell, WHAT BALL HANDLING SKILLS IS JOHN WALL LEARNING FROM KIRK HINRICH IN MOVING THE BALL/OFFENSE DOWN THE COURT???"

Cheez Louise. Shaun (that's how you spell it) isn't really a factor in Charlotte. He's averaging 17 minutes. In the past 3 games, under Silas, he's gone 17, 17, and 11 minutes for 2, 7, and 2 points; 1, 3, and 1 assists; and 1, 2, and 0 turnovers, respectively. The PG who seems to have blossomed under Silas is Augustin.

I wish Shaun all the best, but his real opportunity was in Charlotte under Larry Brown (beloved of tall PGs everywhere), and I think he was smart to grab it.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 10:47 AM | Report abuse

"Bent out of shape would not be an accurate description. More like being right about something would."posted by LarryInClintonMD

No, Larry, you're bent out of shape. You have a resentment. Somebody who was merely correct doesn't need to rant like that.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 10:35 AM

No resentment my friend. None at all. You see I sort of new that the point guard play would come up. In fact, I let several references to the point guard on this board go without commenting.

You know that I said in the offseason that keeping Livingston would basically eliminate that the guard play would be an issue/need on this team.

But, alas my friend, the pg play is an issue on this team and the board brought it up. I just smiled when I started to see the comments.

You see, Samson151, patience is a virtue and surely you had to know when the subject of point guard came up, that the bird in hand that we had (Sean Livingston) that we let go for two in the bush, John Wall and Kirk Hinrich, would not go by without a comment from me.

I don't see you ever letting up on your pet issues.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | January 16, 2011 10:51 AM | Report abuse

Cheez Louise. Shaun (that's how you spell it) isn't really a factor in Charlotte. He's averaging 17 minutes. In the past 3 games, under Silas, he's gone 17, 17, and 11 minutes for 2, 7, and 2 points; 1, 3, and 1 assists; and 1, 2, and 0 turnovers, respectively. The PG who seems to have blossomed under Silas is Augustin.

I wish Shaun all the best, but his real opportunity was in Charlotte under Larry Brown (beloved of tall PGs everywhere), and I think he was smart to grab it.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 10:47 AM

Uh, uh, uh, Brown isn't there anymore, so, how is his decision working out now? You point out, not to well under Paul Silas, one of my all time favorite players by the way.

Shucks man, Samson, seems like he would have been better off to have stayed here. LMAO. But, hell man, we didn't offer him scheisse, uh, uh, a real contract.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | January 16, 2011 11:03 AM | Report abuse

And by the way, I know how to spell Livingston's name. And in case you didn't know it, it is Jeez Louise or Geez not Cheez.

But, I rather not play the spelling game, why do you?

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | January 16, 2011 11:11 AM | Report abuse

"

And by the way, I know how to spell Livingston's name. And in case you didn't know it, it is Jeez Louise or Geez not Cheez." LarryInClintonMD.


LOL if you know how to spell Livingston's name, why not spell it that way?

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 11:24 AM | Report abuse

"Uh, uh, uh, Brown isn't there anymore, so, how is his decision working out now? LarryInClintonMDposted by LarryInClintonMD"

That's the chance any marginal player takes when he follows the money (see: Alonzo Gee). There's still half a season left to see how things might change.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 11:45 AM | Report abuse

Personally, I thought if Shaun were wiser, he'd have taken less to stay in Washington. This is the weaker of the two clubs, and he'd have had more of a shot at minutes. But Felton had left and he's missed so much of his career already -- I can see how he made his decision.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 11:47 AM | Report abuse

With this win, all is well. It's on to the division championship. GO WIZARDS

Posted by: glawrence007 | January 16, 2011 11:49 AM | Report abuse

I am in the minority, but I'm not blown away by JW. I'm not sayin he's a bust, but as a #1 overall, he is not a great pg.

He is extremely fast and athletic, good size, but his pg skills, passing, ability to lead the team, vision aren't that great. Let alone his shot.

When I think of great pgs I think of Magic, Nash, Kidd, Stockton, Paul. Kenny Anderson is a guy I used to like. Wall doesn't have the Pistol Pete type ballhandling or the Magic type no looks, or the Kidd vision. He is not the scorer of AI.

He is very fast end to end, good at finishing at the rim, drive & kickouts. I think the Rondo comparisons are good. Maybe he becomes a Gary Payton type.

Posted by: Darnell1 | January 16, 2011 12:45 PM | Report abuse

I am in the minority, but I'm not blown away by JW. I'm not sayin he's a bust, but as a #1 overall, he is not a great pg.

He is extremely fast and athletic, good size, but his pg skills, passing, ability to lead the team, vision aren't that great. Let alone his shot.

When I think of great pgs I think of Magic, Nash, Kidd, Stockton, Paul. Kenny Anderson is a guy I used to like. Wall doesn't have the Pistol Pete type ballhandling or the Magic type no looks, or the Kidd vision. He is not the scorer of AI.

He is very fast end to end, good at finishing at the rim, drive & kickouts. I think the Rondo comparisons are good. Maybe he becomes a Gary Payton type.

Posted by: Darnell1 | January 16, 2011 12:46 PM | Report abuse

I want Jordan Williams in the draft! I hope we can make a move to add another pick or two. He is gonna be a good pro, and he'd bring just what we need IMO.

Posted by: Darnell1 | January 16, 2011 1:04 PM | Report abuse

I want Jordan Williams in the draft! I hope we can make a move to add another pick or two. He is gonna be a good pro, and he'd bring just what we need IMO.

Posted by: Darnell1 | January 16, 2011 1:05 PM | Report abuse

"When I think of great pgs I think of Magic, Nash, Kidd, Stockton, Paul. Kenny Anderson is a guy I used to like. Wall doesn't have the Pistol Pete type ballhandling or the Magic type no looks, or the Kidd vision. He is not the scorer of AI.He is very fast end to end, good at finishing at the rim, drive & kickouts. I think the Rondo comparisons are good. Maybe he becomes a Gary Payton type.Posted by: Darnell1"

It's a fair question. How good will Wall be? One consideration is how long he spent in college. Magic, Chris Paul, Jason Kidd, Rondo, and Kenny Anderson came out after their soph seasons. Stockton, Gary Payton, and (I believe) Iverson left after their senior year.

Second, all the PGs you mentioned had flaws in their game when they arrived in the NBA, the most common being lack of a reliable outside shot. Some developed one; some overcame the deficit with other skills. Remains to be seen which way Wall will develop.

I think as an athlete, Wall has one ingredient that many of the others didn't: when he's healthy and in shape, he gets to the basket faster than anybody. Scouts traditionally insist that when evaluating players, give extra weight when the player can do something that hardly anybody else can.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 1:17 PM | Report abuse

One play in particular had makes me think why won't Flip call for this more. Nick Young has the sweetest fadeaway shot. He's 6'7 inches and can post most shooting guards. During the 2nd half on one play, Young went into the post. Toroton sent a double team. Young passed out the ball to Hinrich who swung it to Blatche who swung it to soemone else who then swung it inthe corner to Lewis who hit a wide open three. It's that simple. The NBA is about creating dobule teams off mismatches and then swinging the ball to open shooters. Get Nick in the post please Flip! Get a clue!!!!

Posted by: ptp09 | January 16, 2011 1:19 PM | Report abuse

One play in particular had makes me think why won't Flip call for this more. Nick Young has the sweetest fadeaway shot. He's 6'7 inches and can post most shooting guards. During the 2nd half on one play, Young went into the post. Toroton sent a double team. Young passed out the ball to Hinrich who swung it to Blatche who swung it to soemone else who then swung it inthe corner to Lewis who hit a wide open three. It's that simple. The NBA is about creating dobule teams off mismatches and then swinging the ball to open shooters. Get Nick in the post please Flip! Get a clue!!!!

Posted by: ptp09 | January 16, 2011 1:19 PM | Report abuse

Darnell1,

I to was not sold on the Wall hype in college. l commented on the board here back then that I did not see all the stuff attributed to him. But somehow the wizards still anoited him and put the franchise on his and Hinrich's shoulder. Go figure?

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | January 16, 2011 1:30 PM | Report abuse

"But somehow the wizards still anoited him and put the franchise on his and Hinrich's shoulder. Go figure?LarryInClintonMD.Posted by: LarryInClintonMD"

Go figure what? Wall was the consensus number one pick, and had been projected as such since high school. Nobody anointed Hinrich. He started and played a lot of minutes when they needed someone to play alongside Wall and Arenas; now they don't, so he's coming off the bench and playing fewer minutes.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 1:34 PM | Report abuse

Get Nick in the post please Flip! Get a clue!!!!Posted by: ptp09"

I'm sure he'll try. It's always been something of a mystery why Nick hasn't posted up more effectively. He certainly has the physical tools. He seems to have found a role as an outside jumpshooter -- not a pure shooter, but a very effective one. As long as hits those shots and plays some defense, I don't think we fans have anything to complain about. Good passing and occasional good rebounding are pluses.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 1:38 PM | Report abuse

yeah, young, blatche, mcgee, and yi all played well.

difference in the game for me was the rebounding advantage the wiz had.

Posted by: MinuMang | January 16, 2011 2:19 PM | Report abuse

I'd be ecstatic if Wall turns out to be as good as Gary Payton. Payton's a future HOFer. .

Posted by: djnnnou | January 16, 2011 2:19 PM | Report abuse

I'd be ecstatic if Wall turns out to be as good as Gary Payton. Payton's a future HOFer.
Posted by: djnnnou

I'd be ecstatic if he turns out to be 3/4-4/5 as good as either Payton or Rondo.

Posted by: nmik | January 16, 2011 2:23 PM | Report abuse

I'd be ecstatic if he turns out to be 3/4-4/5 as good as either Payton or Rondo. Posted by: nmik

Then your capacity for ecstasy must rival that of St. Theresa's. 3/4 of Payton is Rondo which I'd be happy with, but 3/4 of Rondo would be a little disappointing.

Posted by: djnnnou | January 16, 2011 3:04 PM | Report abuse

But no, I was given the 133 degreee of reasons why it couldn't be done.
Posted by: LarryInClintonMD

Actually, you were given the 133rd degree (are we Stonemasons now?) as to why SL wouldn't want to do it. No matter what your reasoning is or what has changed here in DC or in Charlotte, the fact remains that he had the chance a) to start and b) for a better coach in Charlotte. Even if you say that EG *knew* he was going to be able to trade Gil, no way Shaun could have been certain of that. Especially since people like you were arguing that Gil must be kept.

So Shaun could have easily found himself in the role of 3rd PG getting garbage minutes. Which was most assuredly NOT what he wanted after finally making it back to the court. He wants to play, a) just for love of the game, but b) because being able to play is key for him to be able to sign better contracts.

You've said you played Larry. As a player, which situation would you prefer? Competing for PT with John Wall and Arenas or competing with Augustin?

But regardless, it's over, it's done, he's gone. Let it go already.

Posted by: ts35 | January 16, 2011 3:05 PM | Report abuse

To everyone on here bragging about Livingston, I hope you guys remember that he was garbage and sucked way way way worst then Wall "until" we switched to the 2 guard Offense late in the year.

Dont get it twisted, Im a huge Livingston fan. I just think Flip's Offense is suspect, is designed for jumpers, and I dont think every problem is Wall's fault since nearly all of our PG's have sucked at running this sytem wether its Wall, Shaun, Kirk, Foye, Boykins, Gil, and whoever

Posted by: dlts2041 | January 16, 2011 3:13 PM | Report abuse

Apologies, I meant Freemasons, not Stonemasons

Posted by: ts35 | January 16, 2011 3:28 PM | Report abuse

Good Luck , Shaun, Shawn, Sean, Shonn.

Shaun did some good things here.
I like his game.
I'm glad that he's not here.
We don't need anyone taking minutes from Wall.
This is a learning experience for him.
He needs to be on the floor as much as his body will let him.
If he was getting 20 - 24 minutes a game we'd be all calling for Eddie Tap to come back.
This is the way that rookies learn in the NBA ---- by playing.
Yeah he makes mistakes but he has to make them to learn.

Posted by: VBFan | January 16, 2011 3:41 PM | Report abuse

Ts35.

33rd degree is common to freemasonry, not 133rd degree. There is a difference.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | January 16, 2011 3:51 PM | Report abuse

I just think Flip's Offense is suspect, is designed for jumpers

Always has been, always will be.

Posted by: divi3 | January 16, 2011 4:13 PM | Report abuse

Nobody anointed Hinrich.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 1:34 PM | Report abuse

Didn't Flip make him a co captin?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 4:31 PM | Report abuse

"I just think Flip's Offense is suspect, is designed for jumpers..." posted by dlts2041"

Certainly it favors jumpshooting guards. That could be one reason Nick has blossomed. Most of those shots he made during the 3rd quarter were outside 15 feet. Some were pretty well-defended, too. He's not the same player that Rip Hamilton was in Detroit, but he seems to benefit from the scheme.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 4:34 PM | Report abuse

Yi Jianlian...intercept a pass from Sundiata Gaines in the fourth quarter...and immediately started dribbling up the floor....and didn't stop until he split Bargnani and Julian Wright for a two-handed dunk.

Saunders said, "I thought Yi was exceptional."

Flip would bench McGee for the next game if he did the same thing

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 4:35 PM | Report abuse

"Didn't Flip make him a co captin?Posted by: bulletsfan78"

Didn't we establish that in the NBA, it's a meaningless honorific?

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 4:36 PM | Report abuse

"Flip would bench McGee for the next game if he did the same thing.Posted by: bulletsfan78"

No he wouldn't.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 4:38 PM | Report abuse

VBfan,

Not referring to Walls minutes and rookies learning, but rather adequate backups and how much Livingston could have added to this current team.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | January 16, 2011 4:39 PM | Report abuse

"But regardless, it's over, it's done, he's gone. Let it go already.Posted by: ts35"

Never. That would require a personality transplant.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 4:41 PM | Report abuse

"Not referring to Walls minutes and rookies learning, but rather adequate backups and how much Livingston could have added to this current team.LarryInClintonMD.Posted by: LarryInClintonMD"

Not much, I'd say. Although he would give certain posters an excuse to complain about him not starting or getting enough minutes...

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 4:42 PM | Report abuse

Didn't we establish that in the NBA, it's a meaningless honorific?
Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 4:36 PM
| Report abuse

No, we did not, a point I have continually admonished you for.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | January 16, 2011 4:55 PM | Report abuse

Didn't we establish that in the NBA, it's a meaningless honorific?
Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 4:36 PM
| Report abuse

No, we did not, a point I have continually admonished you for.

LarryInClintonMD.

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | January 16, 2011 4:56 PM | Report abuse

10 points, 10 rebounds, 6 blocked shots..24 minuutes.It's becoming an insult that Javale does not get more minutes. He is over his asthma issue, isn't he?

Posted by: bobilly2 | January 16, 2011 4:59 PM | Report abuse

Nick seems to benefit from the scheme.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 4:34 PM | Report abuse

Nick benifited from Wall's injuries and the Gil trade, before that he couldn't get a starting job...Flip thought Wall and Kirk was his best option...seems like Gil knew more then Flip did since he was willing to fake an injury to get NY some playing time

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 5:03 PM | Report abuse

"Didn't Flip make him a co captin?Posted by: bulletsfan78"

Didn't we establish that in the NBA, it's a meaningless honorific?

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 4:36 PM | Report abuse

We didn't...you did...but in order for you to understand that would require a personality transplant.

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 5:08 PM | Report abuse

Nobody anointed Hinrich.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 1:34 PM | Report abuse

Didn't Flip make him a co captin?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 4:31 PM | Report abuse

and Flip started Kirk for the first 24 games?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 5:10 PM | Report abuse

Flip would bench McGee for the next game if he did the same thing

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 4:35 PM | Report abuse

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNPtfVyVl3A

Posted by: SDMDTSU | January 16, 2011 5:20 PM | Report abuse

I didn't know Kirk was annoited Hinrich anything or put the franchise on his shoulders. LMAO

Posted by: SDMDTSU | January 16, 2011 5:25 PM | Report abuse

Flip would bench McGee for the next game if he did the same thing

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 4:35 PM | Report abuse

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNPtfVyVl3A

Posted by: SDMDTSU | January 16, 2011 5:20 PM | Report abuse

Like I said Flip would bench McGee hate to bring facts into the equation but Yi started the next game?
http://www.nba.com/games/20101014/MILWAS/gameinfo.html#nbaGIboxscore

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 5:27 PM | Report abuse

I didn't know Kirk was annoited Hinrich anything or put the franchise on his shoulders. LMAO

Posted by: SDMDTSU | January 16, 2011 5:25 PM | Report abuse

what?

At least I can blame my babbling on being stoned

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 5:31 PM | Report abuse

At least I can blame my babbling on being stoned

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 5:31 PM | Report abuse

That would explain a lot.

Posted by: SDMDTSU | January 16, 2011 5:41 PM | Report abuse

"At least I can blame my babbling on being stoned. Posted by: bulletsfan78"

I hope that's it. And not something organic.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 5:42 PM | Report abuse

I didn't know Kirk was annoited Hinrich anything or put the franchise on his shoulders. LMAO

Posted by: SDMDTSU | January 16, 2011 5:25 PM | Report abuse

I didn't know Kirk was annoited anything or the franchise was put on his shoulders. LMAO

I'm stoned.

Happy?

Posted by: SDMDTSU | January 16, 2011 5:43 PM | Report abuse

At least I can blame my babbling on being stoned

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 5:31 PM | Report abuse

That would explain a lot.

Posted by: SDMDTSU | January 16, 2011 5:41 PM | Report abuse

The question was how do you and samson explain your babbling?

Wait you two would prefer to avoid answering questions..sort of like Flip...he prefers to blame someone else instead.

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 5:46 PM | Report abuse

Pretty good game between the Lakers and Clips -- Clips up by 1 with 4+ left. Griffin has had an off-night shooting but still solid on the boards. Eric Gordon has picked up the slack. Ordinarily the Lakers win this but now the home court advantage should kick in for the Clips. Could be looking at an upset.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 5:48 PM | Report abuse

I didn't know Kirk was annoited anything or the franchise was put on his shoulders. LMAO

I'm stoned.

Happy?

Posted by: SDMDTSU | January 16, 2011 5:43 PM | Report abuse

I'm always Happy...that's what being stoned is all about...it's like smoking a peace pipe.

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 5:52 PM | Report abuse

Phil Sims just said "I don't care how good the players are you need a coach who can get them in the right situations to take advantage of their talent."

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 6:58 PM | Report abuse

"Phil Sims just said "I don't care how good the players are you need a coach who can get them in the right situations to take advantage of their talent."Posted by: bulletsfan78"

LOL which I guess you interpret as 'fire Flip'. But that's not what Simms is saying.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 7:21 PM | Report abuse

LOL which I guess you interpret as 'fire Flip'. But that's not what Simms is saying.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 7:21 PM | Report abuse

No...what it meant was coaching does matter and it's not just the players like some of you on here say.

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 7:24 PM | Report abuse

"I'm always Happy...that's what being stoned is all about...Posted by: bulletsfan78"

I have to wonder: what's the point of an ongoing conversation with somebody who's just going to keep on saying stuff that doesn't make sense, just because he likes abusing the keyboard? I mean, it's not like he's actually listening.

A good time to step back and read somebody else's thoughts, I guess.

For anybody who gets Netflix, check out the Canadian thriller series Intelligence. Very exciting. Available on streaming.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 7:32 PM | Report abuse

"Phil Sims just said "I don't care how good the players are you need a coach who can get them in the right situations to take advantage of their talent."Posted by: bulletsfan78"

LOL which I guess you interpret as 'fire Flip'. But that's not what Simms is saying.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 7:21 PM | Report abuse

What you missed was "their talent" and since the Wizards don't have much...

Fire Ernie

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 7:49 PM | Report abuse

Yi Jianlian...intercept a pass from Sundiata Gaines in the fourth quarter...and immediately started dribbling up the floor....and didn't stop until he split Bargnani and Julian Wright for a two-handed dunk.

Saunders said, "I thought Yi was exceptional."

Flip would bench McGee for the next game if he did the same thing


Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 4:35 PM | Report abuse

No he wouldn't.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 4:38 PM | Report abuse

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNPtfVyVl3A

Posted by: SDMDTSU | January 16, 2011 5:20 PM | Report abuse

Like I said Flip would bench McGee hate to bring facts into the equation but Yi started the next game?

http://www.nba.com/games/20101014/MILWAS/gameinfo.html#nbaGIboxscore

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 5:27 PM | Report abuse

I have to wonder: what's the point of an ongoing conversation with somebody who refuses to admit he was wrong even when he is shown the facts?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 7:55 PM | Report abuse

"Phil Sims just said "I don't care how good the players are you need a coach who can get them in the right situations to take advantage of their talent."Posted by: bulletsfan78"

LOL which I guess you interpret as 'fire Flip'. But that's not what Simms is saying.

Posted by: Samson151 | January 16, 2011 7:21 PM | Report abuse

Flip head coach gets to decide who starts right?

Kirk 36 games 28 starts

while

NY 37 games 14 starts

it doesn't look like using the teams talent is one of Flip's strong suits?

Fire Flip

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 8:14 PM | Report abuse

Like I said Flip would bench McGee hate to bring facts into the equation but Yi started the next game?

http://www.nba.com/games/20101014/MILWAS/gameinfo.html#nbaGIboxscore

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 5:27 PM | Report abuse

I have to wonder: what's the point of an ongoing conversation with somebody who refuses to admit he was wrong even when he is shown the facts?

Posted by: bulletsfan78 | January 16, 2011 7:55 PM | Report abuse

The facts are that McGee didn't even start THAT game.

JaVale attempted going coast to coast against Sacremento and Miami...did he get benched after those games?

Since we're being factual.

Posted by: SDMDTSU | January 16, 2011 8:21 PM | Report abuse

I think he went coast to coast against Minnesota too.

I guess that doesn't matter either right?

Posted by: SDMDTSU | January 16, 2011 8:25 PM | Report abuse

Yes we need a PG, livingston does not need all these conversations since he has a contract. Hudson might be good as a SG ,they need to find some one.
JW has two good things, speed and ball sharing habit.His mid range shoots will be here soon,he should be told to take open shoots and keep up his head when he is not making them.The body languge need to go out of his game,it is a negative reinforcement.

Posted by: gtefferra | January 16, 2011 8:58 PM | Report abuse

Since Javale likes to go coast to coast, let him play the back up point. He can't play starting center, so what the hell.

Posted by: Janitor_with_a_Jumpshot | January 17, 2011 12:52 AM | Report abuse

"And the thing that is so mind blowing, is that the Wizards preditermened that Kirk Hinrich would be the best influence/mentor for John Wall, but in reality on the floor, I kinda feel that Sean Livinston would have been a tremendous compliment and mentor for the one John Wall."

Posted by: LarryInClintonMD | January 16, 2011 9:18 AM

What's really mind blowing is your irrational belief that your baseless, unfounded opinion is somehow reflective of objective "reality."

Posted by: kalo_rama | January 17, 2011 1:08 AM | Report abuse

What you missed was "their talent" and since the Wizards don't have much...

Fire Ernie

Posted by: bulletsfan78

it doesn't look like using the teams talent is one of Flip's strong suits?

Fire Flip

Posted by: bulletsfan78

So, if I may summarize your apparent position, the talentless players that EG drafted aren't getting enough playing time from Flip.

Posted by: ts35 | January 17, 2011 1:19 AM | Report abuse

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